Rule clarification: subs vs. carrier with fighters

[bmnielsen]

Would like clarification of something that came up in our last game.

My opponent sent 3 subs after my unescorted carrier loaded with two fighters. If one or more of the subs hit on their sneak attack, does that prevent my fighters from taking off and defending? Or are they considered “in the air” at the start of combat? My fighters were lost anyway as they weren’t near friendly territory, but we weren’t sure if I had the chance to take some of the subs down with them.

[Panther]

The fighters are considered defending in the air. But they cannot hit the subs. You need a destroyer friendly to the fighters if you want to assign hits scored by Air units to submarines.

[BJCard]

Yup, makes Subs super powerful

[bonusbent]

@BJCard:

Yup, makes Subs super powerful

I accept the answers given, but in my opinion fighters should be considered as cargo if the AC is attacked only by subs and there is no destroyer - at least during the first round of combat. It would make the rules even more complicated, but at least people wouldn´t leave an AC floating unescorted.

[Eqqman]

@bonusbent:

I accept the answers given, but in my opinion fighters should be considered as cargo if the AC is attacked only by subs and there is no destroyer - at least during the first round of combat. It would make the rules even more complicated, but at least people wouldn´t leave an AC floating unescorted.

But in your example, it isn’t unescorted, it is carrying its CAP with it.

[Degrasse]

You might want to dig through Krieghund posts, but I think the answer is more complicated if the aircraft are a different nationality.

[wheatbeer]

Friendly aircraft only become cargo on carriers if the carrier is damaged during the combat move of the power controlling the carrier.

If a carrier is defending, friendly planes still launch (no different than in any other battle).

[DizzKneeLand33]

I know it’s the rule, but isn’t it kind of strange that defending fighters launch prior to a sneak attack hit by the subs?  To me, if the subs scored two hits on their first attack, then everything should sink to the bottom of the sea, both CV and the two fighters, who were never able to launch….

[zanetheinsane]

To be fair, this is why you never ever ever send carriers anywhere without a destroyer. The same problem happens if you send a carrier plus fighters to attack submarines. Since the carrier doesn’t roll attack dice and the fighters can’t hit the submarines, you just have infinite rounds of combat until the subs either sink the carrier or the units retreat.

This is also why it is recommend that when playing the pacific side as either Japan or the US, you purchase at least one sub for every carrier that the other side purchases.

You should also never tip your carriers on defense if you have no where for your planes to land, since the attacker will almost always retreat and watch your planes crash into the ocean for free.