Make paratrooper unit standard in 1940 Global Bal Mod

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizer

    As I mentioned give each country a Air Transport plane on setup at there Capital only.
    You can promote 1 Inf to a Paratrooper (cost 2) per turn only for starters.
    You can buy more Air Transports if you want.
    Air Transports C10 M4-5 FAB AD0 Can take as a Casualty.
    Paratrooper C2 A2 first round only. Then A1 D2 Art +1 on A
    or go with IL’s idea with no Art boost or support.
    Paratrooper A3 first round, A2 second round and then A1 rest of rounds. D2

    Start with something and test play and tweak as you go on.

    We use Paratroopers and Elites in my game and there being used by all countries.
    Malta, Norway, Crete, Pacific Islands, Dutch Islands, can openers and blocker landings.
    Also Air Transports can transport 2 Para or Elites.
    But I would keep it to 1 if you think 2 is to strong for Germany.
    At least with 2 you have a better chance (some support helps) to take and control an Island.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    @FMErwinRommel
    Yea i found adding the “Air Transport” to work well for what you want to do. Especially against undefended Med islands.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16

    I would be interested in Test playing. I just don’t know how to tweak or perform it here on triple a.

  • '19 '17 '16

    Yeah, if reasonable price points could be developed, I would be keen to see this in balanced mod. Also, just have one paratrooper per air transport. Ideally the aa guns would shoot at the transports and the troops would die if hit. I reckon 4ipc per paratroop would be about right. Or do you think it should be more?

    One more thing. I wouldn’t bother with upgrading units to become paratroopers, just recruit paratroopers from scratch. Or provide both. If it took longer to get a paratrooper than a battleship that would be ridiculous.

    Now as for the idea of having different capabilities per nation, death to your feeble plan!

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    @simon33 said in Make paratrooper unit standard in 1940 Global Bal Mod:

    Now as for the idea of having different capabilities per nation, death to your feeble plan!

    heh heh 🙂

    @aequitas-et-veritas said in Make paratrooper unit standard in 1940 Global Bal Mod:

    I would be interested in Test playing. I just don’t know how to tweak or perform it here on triple a.

    It might be a little different but you can do this in “Global 40 House Rules” under " Experimental" in triplea.

    Elite is a A2 D2 M1 +1M w/tank (can blitz with tank), C5 unit. It may be transported by Cruisers and Battleships on a 1:1 basis. It may be Air Transported into combat or ncm by Air transports on a 1:1 basis

    Air Transport is a A0 D0 M5 +1 w/AB C6 unit. It may transport Elite units in either combat move or ncm on a 1:1 basis. May be taken as casualty.

    Select Map Option “Elite and Air Transport” before game start.

  • '19 '17 '16

    Also air transports should neither attack nor defend. Just have them taken last a0 d0 like sea transports.

    The mod squad do not want any setup changes so this would be not on the board at the start.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    @simon33
    yea sorry forgot this BM thread. BM is on “House Rules” too, so you can still try it, need to fix the china AAgun not allowing guerrillas, keep forgetting 🙂 but w/e : )
    I can’t remember how they work for certain, they don’t attack or defend but are taken as casualty. Can take them before last if I remember right. Just the way triplea worked i think. The Air Transports

    Oh yea. Caucasus seemed pretty vulnerable, but that’s a big investment by Adolf. Idk, leave that up to you smart Players 🙂

  • '19 '17 '16

    Ok, looking at the elite/air transport in the House rules, there’s a few aspects I don’t like. First one being air transports participating in the ground battle. Is that a boo boo? I also find it weird that when you click an air transport it asks how many but I guess you can live with this. Also that the attack is possible without being combined with overland or amphibious units. This rule was correct in Axis and Allies and shouldn’t have been changed. I’m guessing that to support that rule the attack needs to be made in the airborne combat move phase. Might not be that easy to get it working the way I want.

    I also dislike that elites can be paired with tanks and blitz. Where did their vehicles come from?

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    @simon33
    yea if I remember right, the AT won’t go into combat unless it can be taken as a hit. Idk, sea transports can, so I’ll have to look at it again. I figured it would just represent them being shot down though, so not entirely a bad thing.

    Yea that’s just how the “Paratrooper” tech works in triplea by asking you “how many”.

    I don’t see why Paras should have to have other non Para units there to be allowed to go into battle. Crete didn’t. Maybe I’m misunderstanding something here.

    The reason for Elites being able to blitz is because wittman wanted the USA to be able to transport two 2 move units on one transport. Also it represents infantry riding on tanks which greatly increased their range and did happen.

    I need to look at how it all works again, been a while.

  • '19 '17 '16

    @barnee said in Make paratrooper unit standard in 1940 Global Bal Mod:

    I don’t see why Paras should have to have other non Para units there to be allowed to go into battle. Crete didn’t. Maybe I’m misunderstanding something here.

    In spite of this example, the need is because of the abstraction in A&A. Otherwise there is no way they can be resupplied. At Crete they took airfields and did air supply that is really the exception rather than the rule.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    yea that’s true, they were usually used in combined arms attacks, but it seems it would limit their usefulness quite a bit. Basically you couldn’t attack any of the med islands.

    idk, I guess all they’d be good for is getting some extra dudes that are out of normal range into the fight. I found I didn’t buy them that much because there was always something else that seemed more important. Doubt they’d get built at all if they couldn’t attack by themselves.

    I’ll revisit the whole thing. Maybe try to find a compromise of some sort. Paras die next turn if a non para unit doesn’t show up or something.

  • '19 '17 '16

    @barnee said in Make paratrooper unit standard in 1940 Global Bal Mod:

    Paras die next turn if a non para unit doesn’t show up or something.

    That’s an interesting idea. Starvation or at least running out of ammo is certainly a real world possibility.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    @simon33
    yea still undecided. I get your point but if a single dude on a naval transport takes an undefended island, it doesn’t need anything extra to happen. The Marines on Guadalcanal basically lived off of captured supplies since the Navy punked out on them.

    So it could be considered that the Paras captured enough local stuff to survive. Probably just add a 2nd option and then people can use whichever one they like. Well… 🙂 any that actually try it that is 🙂

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18

    @simon33 just saw this talks about getting rid of the “how many” prompt

    https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/issues/5724

  • '19 '17 '16

    Looks like a lot of the things required here aren’t possible. The absolute worst problem though is that air transports fight in the battle and can protect the infantry, which it totally bogus, like classic transports which protected the warships. I see no point in proceeding if this problem is insurmountable.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16

    @simon33 said in Make paratrooper unit standard in 1940 Global Bal Mod:

    Looks like a lot of the things required here aren’t possible. The absolute worst problem though is that air transports fight in the battle and can protect the infantry, which it totally bogus, like classic transports which protected the warships. I see no point in proceeding if this problem is insurmountable.

    Would there be a way to make it possible to start from scratch and rewrite the Programm or the code then?
    I remember Karl7 and Adam514 testet a game with minor AB’s in the game and pretended the gameplay and edit in the results.
    Would that be doable?

    I mean all we have to do is take an extra Ftr and use a Marine for the goal of attacking that Teritorry.
    After the battle erase the Ftr.
    From the file/ readout we can recongnize what the other player was doing…

    After the game, we collect data and adjust properly and ask the guys who fixing the programms to adress it in this and that manner.

    Just a thought. What do you think?

  • '19 '17 '16

    Anything is possible of course. I have posted something on triplea-game.org. Maybe someone will know something I haven’t been able to see easily.

    I think it would be a stretch to far to have to many player enforced rules though. If you’re that keen that you can deal with having to remember to enforce taking the air transport last, I guess it is totally possible.

  • '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 Customizer

    Simon you bring up a good point about air transport as a casualty. If it AD @0 then it should not get to be used as one ?
    Some will say if it’s on ground when territory is attacked the air transport can be taken as a casualty due to the fact the attacker is taking shots at it to destroy it which means less focus on an inf and such.
    In my game u can take as a casualty ( same as AA gun ) or air transport can retreat to another territory after 1 round of combat. All AD planes can retreat after any one round of combat. Not trying to get off triple a topic here.

    Barnee I thought had this air transport plane working in his test games ?

  • '19 '17 '16

    Looks like there is a way but it makes it capturable. Still, I can probably live with this being an edit mode fix. I’ll look at this a bit more tomorrow.

  • '19 '17 '16

    Ok, if anyone is interested, I’ve added this to the Canadian Mod. There are a lot of changes which I could go into, I expect it will be a bit like Balanced Mod in that early on Allies will have the edge but if it gets popular and people understand how to play it a bit more, Axis will start to win out.

    Anyone interested in playtesting? Tried one game against myself which the allies look like winning.

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