Here’s the Armies vs Navies idea I came up with!
G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread
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Peter and I developed several different approaches to tech and did some playtesting as well.
What I found to be most promising and fun was a system where a new facility is introduced that concerns research. Research would also be specific in that you choose which research-project(s) to develop. Several research-projects can be pursued simultaneously.
We tried having the dice from facilities to be obtained for free or having to be purchased (funding) for something like 1-3 IPC. I believe the latter is to be prefered.
This would be combined with a dice-system where a research needs to meet a certain amount of points and different research-facilities give different numbers of dice for the research.
A research could also be developed with full or partial success. The partial success gives access to the tech, but with a nerfed effect, with the possibility of completing the tech later on.
One delicate problem was balance. It takes a lot for research to beat units in the field, so finding the right pricing is an extensive task. If it’s too expensive it’s just bad and if it’s too cheap it’s too good.
A system like this may most certainly include nation-specific research. I’d also prefer to see more projects available rather than fewer, giving more options for variety. There’s also the possibility of locking up certain researched based on either turn or previous completed research.
Of course, a tech-system in A&A shouldn’t be too complicated.
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my 1st post:
We can simplify it, by determining the fixed cost of tech investment. And then we just edit in the game. And for the future it can be a part of the program.
Or we can make each tech upgrade cost different ammount of money, but i think it complicates things too much.
The only thing that would be maybe logical to make a difference in cost is the sheets.
Naval tech upgrades could cost more or less then the land one for example, but they could cost the same too.
I think it would be also cool to play in a way that each nation chooses 1 tech from each board. And starts the game that way.
And every 5 rounds we give another tech bonus to choose.
I am just brainstorming here, feel free to criticize
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I find ur version of half tech fixed for all + half tech specified by each nation cool.
I would make some adjusments though.
i ll soon write a more detailed suggestion.
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My suggestion would be:
fixed tech
1st chart
- Paratropers
- Increased factory production
- Rockets
2nd chart
- Super subs
- Jet figs
- Long range aircraft
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@Amon-Sul said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
Jet figs
Long range a- Jet Fighters. The attack value of your fighters is now 4 instead of 3. In addition, during bombing raids your escorting or intercepting fighters now hit on a “1” or “2” instead of just a “1”.
in the meantime figs already shoot at 2 for intercepting / scrambling.
maybe we should build up fig defense more too, or the figs would be too strong then.
also we can change jet figs in a way that they attack on 3, but defend on 5.
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@Amon-Sul i was wondering if we can edit achieved techs in and out.
In this case we could simply start a game, announce the tech we would shooting for and adjust properly if a different one comes out.Also want to mention @simon33 as he is involved in a few projects unless I am unlucky misstaken by my thoughts.
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@aequitas-et-veritas said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
@Amon-Sul i was wondering if we can edit achieved techs in and out.
In this case we could simply start a game, announce the tech we would shooting for and adjust properly if a different one comes out.Also want to mention @simon33 as he is involved in a few projects unless I am unlucky misstaken by my thoughts.
yes, before we get the technical support its very easy to just add it in edit mode at the start of the turn
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my suggestion for additional Nation related Techs would be:
GERMANY:
- Fortress Europe (Your artillery in gray territories defends on a 3)
- Atlantic Wall (During any amphibious assault against a gray territory, all your infantry defend on a 3 during the first cycle of combat.)
- Improved Mechs
RUSSIA:
- Improved art
- Transsiberian railway (Your infantry, antiaircraft guns, and artillery may move 2 territories per turn only among Russia - Samara - Novo - Timguska - Jenisey - Yakut - Buryatia - Amur)
- Mobile Industry (Your industrial complexes each may move 1 territory during your noncombat move phase. They cannot move during the combat move phase. If they are captured by an opponent, that opponent cannot move them. U can not deploy units in a territory with less then 2 ipc value).
JAPAN:
- Dug-In Defenders (All your infantry on islands defend on a 3.)
- Banzai Attacks (When you begin an attack with only infantry, all those infantry attack on a 2. This also applies to any amphibious assault in which your attacking land units consist of only infantry.)
- Lightning Assaults (Your transports may make more than one amphibious assault per turn: They may move, attack a coastal territory, then move again and attack a second coastal territory. They still must stop their movement in the
first hostile sea zone they enter. A transport’s capacity is unchanged; it still cannot load or offload more than one land unit plus one infantry in the turn)
USA:
- Warbonds
- Shipyards
- Fast Carriers (Your aircraft carriers have a move of 3 (4 with naval bases))
UK:
- Radar
- Warbonds
- Mideast Oil (If an air unit you own lands in Anglo-Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Iraq, NW Persia or Persia during your noncombat move phase, it may then move an additional number of spaces equal to its normal movement.)
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i must say i like Aev s idea of russian tanks costing 5 ipc.
also an idea about japanes BBs attacking and defending and combine bombarding on 5.
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I think that jet figs would be too strong if attacking on 4.
I think if we allow them that, maybe we should disallow em the tac + fig combo.
or jet figs should defend at 5 and attack at 3.
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@freh I never did answer this question. Yes I don’t think a carrier would do the trick, since the sub has to be destroyed before the amphibious landing can take place.
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as for war bonds. good for UK, but too little for USA.
instead of that maybe better for USA is Heavy bomber
a) rolls 2 dice instead of one
b) attacks on 5
and the price of course 14 ipc
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@Amon-Sul said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
as for war bonds. good for UK, but too little for USA.
instead of that maybe better for USA is Heavy bomber
a) rolls 2 dice instead of one
b) attacks on 5
and the price of course 14 ipc
Those heavy bomber solutions are just insane. Far too strong. I think a better solution is to make SBR stronger or something like that.
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@Amon-Sul said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
my suggestion for additional Nation related Techs would be:
- Mobile Industry (Your industrial complexes each may move 1 territory during your noncombat move phase. They cannot move during the combat move phase. If they are captured by an opponent, that opponent cannot move them. U can not deploy units in a territory with less then 2 ipc value).
Isn’t this just very meh for Russia? I mean, they almost don’t have any territories with more income than 1, especially in the east.
Only point would be to immediately withdraw the factories so Germany can’t take hold of them. Of course, that’s a serious point.
Would 1 MIC, 3 mIC in Moscow be able to produce 19 units?
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I think the easy part is to figure out fun techs, the hard part (from experience) is incorporating it in the game. The current system with paying for dice that randomly gives you research is not good enough. Some kind of point system as mentioned by trulpen is preferred, with or without research facilities.
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It’s fun thinking about different ways to incorporate tech. I’ll just throw out my ideas.
I think it’s great to provide flexibility in terms of amount invested and the corresponding odds. Sort of a low-luck system where the odds improve based on how much you pay.
As for cost, maybe some of the cost (and risk) could be punted forward as an ongoing cost. You get your tech, but risk an ongoing cost of x per turn for y number of rounds, where x & y vary. This would maintain the element of variability and risk - instead of the risky part being whether or not you get the tech, it would be how much it would cost you on an ongoing basis. And at the end of the day, it would be a way of impacting unit cost without over-or under-charging for units.
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That sounds very good @freh .
Example:
Btp (Breakthrough point) for Super Sub is 8.
Cost 4 ipc per roll.Your roll on G1 for this development and score 5.
5 is now the credit and represents time ,effort and investment.
Next Turn you invest the cost of 4 opc for a roll again.
You score 5 again.
You achieved Super Subs and can use it immediately, bc you overrolled the 8 you nedded and spent more time effort and ipc to gain Super subs. -
@aequitas-et-veritas that could work too… similar to the way that convoy damage works, it could also be that you need to roll 8 but only dice rolls of 4 or less count.
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@trulpen said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
@Amon-Sul said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
my suggestion for additional Nation related Techs would be:
- Mobile Industry (Your industrial complexes each may move 1 territory during your noncombat move phase. They cannot move during the combat move phase. If they are captured by an opponent, that opponent cannot move them. U can not deploy units in a territory with less then 2 ipc value).
Isn’t this just very meh for Russia? I mean, they almost don’t have any territories with more income than 1, especially in the east.
Only point would be to immediately withdraw the factories so Germany can’t take hold of them. Of course, that’s a serious point.
Would 1 MIC, 3 mIC in Moscow be able to produce 19 units?
no, no merging of ICs.
well u have rostov, novosibirsk.
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@Pejon_88 said in G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread:
I think the easy part is to figure out fun techs, the hard part (from experience) is incorporating it in the game. The current system with paying for dice that randomly gives you research is not good enough. Some kind of point system as mentioned by trulpen is preferred, with or without research facilities.
i am a fan of giving tech bonuses for free, and just doing it in edit.
one bonus at the start of the game, and every 3-5 turns u choose another
or we can give a fixed ammount for buying a tech earlier, and we do it in edit.
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lets say we say 16 ipc for a tech development.
we just edit add the tech and remove 16 ipc.
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