@GEN-MANSTEIN Who knows. Maybe it happens, I remain in suspense for another 3 years.

@Argothair I’ll examine your reply further, but it was “Maphead” Dave playing with another buddy who is still learning the game, and the 2 SB save $6/+Take Yugo going all in round after round to get $$ (clearly not strafing after strafing the last 20 germany times) it was a play/option easy tell/read from my buddy and FORMER axa “student” now my Darth Vader. Plus I assumed they’d double drop me in the most obvious way possible even before we played. ME didn’t survive that.

@Argothair Its good to hear from you again brother.

I know how to allocate the battle. I lost the SZ 91 CA. I was just blathering on to a new player in this thread about how you should never undercut Taranto because you risk a scramble. I did that and kept my CV, 1 Fighter, 1 CA. He snaked the plane stack in Syria (GHG suggests Trans J) w his 2 TTs AND he swacked my ships. Easily.

However, if you read my playout, none of that mattered–I was missing 1 inf 1 tank from Canada I ambitiously sent south.
I was missing the DD blocker
I put 1 mech in SA
AND
Everything went to Taranto

and that is a 100% idiot move because if you don’t protect UK with all you can on turns 1-2 (assuming Ger has flex power/$ and units) he can attack you with 2 waves and has a high chance of victory. Especially if you are a noob like me and send anything anywhere else and listen to people on the internet.

This is why ME doesnt work–you can’t follow all those dealpoints and get UK power south unless GER does something obvious w his starting power/$.

Some of the basic concepts might be preserved like the SA shuck, the Iraq UK 1 take, the NB on Persia but IDK, its just like I said in 2017 if you dont watch what Germany does and play on rails you will be snaked.

@crockett36 Because I got shamefully sealioned as I’ve sealioned myself so many times before;

Germany buy 2 SB save 6
Kill SZ 91 CA first strking
Take Yugo outright no strafe
(play read; Stratbombing then SL)

1. Buy UK 1 8 inf 1 mech (mech went to SA)
   Do Taranto all in, Gib fighter to kill DD
   DD kills fighter Italy keeps 2 trans
   TT goes to africa with tank in anticipation of heading to Africa
   TT goes S empty
   Scotland fighter helps DD kill sub that lived in SZ 91 and is stuck in FWA

2. Germany gets ready to annhilate me and bombs me out without reply I repair 15 and buy 4 inf 1 fighter my chance of survivng the first round is like 10% and he has another wave ready as always…

G3 me = noob after so many games following a canned plan made by another noob

UK 3 noob = loses

UK has to do pat buys, it cannot do anything flexible, and it probably shouldnt send everything to Taranto, risking a backfire as the gentleman here was speaking about just this week as I was preparing.

@Arthur-Bomber-Harris I’m not remembering it correctly…its been a while. I guess all I can preserve of my original point is that if Japan is too aggressive and attacks too early, and builds too many factories too quickly, USA can outbuild them–and/or step up and take Iwo.

@ShadowHAwk @Krieghund Thanks for the answer kreig. Its more a nuance than a loophole, but it does create a new tripwire.

British, Dutch, ANZAC (Australian-New Zealand
Army Corps), or American territories or ships by the Japanese will be
considered an act of war by all of the remaining Allied powers

Japan
may attack Dutch territories only if a state of war exists
between it and the United Kingdom and ANZAC. Japan may
attack French territories at any time, requiring no declaration
of war against any Allied power before doing so. p8

These two powers also have an arrangement with the
Dutch government in exile (Holland having been captured
by Germany) and have taken guardianship of the Dutch
territories in the Pacific.

Wouldn’t the result be that Japan takes the territory but does not fight the UK at all? The last reference seems to hint that this is not a friendly-neutral occupation but rather an ally moving onto another ally-at-war’s territory, which is legal, but then a neutral vis the other allies allowed to attack France… does so…while still at peace for another 3 turns? Not certain this the answer…or how we resolve the situation once UK does enter the war…

I think this consideration cuts both ways–we can argue both sides of what is “historical” and what isn’t.

I think a more compelling reason for the rule is that it leaves a fantasy scenario open to the Axis, and there are many of those–a balance that demonstrates that the opening setup (as revised) is about as goldilocks as this particular game/map can get between what is Fantasy and what is Historical Reality (the Axis get slapped down).

Having attempted my own setups and game design, I fully appreciate the work and thought that went into the placement of literally every single unit and each rule, in each iteration. It still cannot strike an absolute “balance”, but that is nearly impossible in games where the opponents start with different units/territories/advanages (unlike chess where the only difference between the two sides is who goes first, that is a “model” game)

I think your point would be better made if the Japanese fleet was parked in the SZ to the left of SZ 26…not in it. Not scale wise but diplomacy/surprise wise. Appreciate the discussion.

@Arthur-Bomber-Harris immediately. If 2 J carriers go south they take Iwo on the first turn.

A careful allocation of stuff left behind on the Home Islands might make that dangerous, but I’ve been beaten at least twice (as Japan JDOWing) when my opponent took advantage of how thin I left the back lines and forced me to recoil back in defense. That could be my lack of finesse/skill though as the axis, and/or it could require that fewer objectives (more conservative play) are taken in the J1 such that more can stay home…I guess I could try it again Saturday

@crockett36 a dissembling digression of inferences based on speculative anecdotes from a variety of players of different skill levels with wildly varying opponents on different platforms.

as we do