Axis and Allies Mediterranean

[John Brown]

I haven’t heard anything in awhile.

I hope he hasn’t, abandoned it.

It was an awesome game, to see played, at HBG headquarters. :-)

[Johnson73]

I do know that some finishing touches on the Rule Book are being done as we speak  Map and play testing is complete.  He had some issues with Artist, (3) to be exact, that delayed the game to be finished.  I estimate a fall release.

[John Brown]

@Combat:

I do know that some finishing touches on the Rule Book are being done as we speak  Map and play testing is complete.   He had some issues with Artist, (3) to be exact, that delayed the game to be finished.  I estimate a fall release.

That is great, to hear. :-)

[Maofator]

This project is not abandoned.  Mare Nostrum 1941.  All the charts and such are done.  Map is pretty much done.  Just wrapping up the rule book.  Needs a few clarification tweaks, a few graphics added, and then a big formatting project to undertake.  (who know a table of contents would be so much work).  Is adding a table of contents beneficial?  Without the table its 28 pages for the book. Thoughts?  Added a teaser pic of the game logo on the map.

[Imperious Leader]

28 pages is kinda long… hoping under 16 but ok.  Can we get a screen shot of the whole map?

This is a map and rules thing i think it best to start explaining the rules here in segments so we get an idea how your system works. perhaps you might go kickstarter and offer some new miniatures?

[John Brown]

I like a table of contents, because it divides the rule sections, and tells what particular page, it is on.

It makes things easier, to look up.

I’m so glad your still working on this.

Can’t wait to purchase this game.

Cheers!

John

[robert t]

A game which deals with the Africa front and Italian campaign would be great. It seems like the next step in the A&A game series.

Going from north of Rome down to the Sahara desert would incorporate naval, land and air pieces.

It would fill in an area which is missing right now from A&A.

[Maofator]

@Imperious:

28 pages is kinda long… hoping under 16 but ok.  Can we get a screen shot of the whole map?

This is a map and rules thing i think it best to start explaining the rules here in segments so we get an idea how your system works. perhaps you might go kickstarter and offer some new miniatures?

The rule book length (28 pages) is due to a couple factors.  First, I’ve tried to fully explain all mechanics so someone who maybe hasn’t played “Game X” could pick it up and understand how to play.  Experienced gamers will be able to skim past portions of it.  Second, the font size is a little larger than say Hasbro rule book font.  It’s more in line with Historical Board Gaming rule book font size.  Third, I’ve added some graphics for flavor to break up the monotony of a steady stream of text.  I feel a table of contents will offer an easy way to look up and reference rules.  Unfortunately programing Word to populate the table is a lot of work for a rule book with a ton of different headers.

The idea is to sell the game through Historical Board Gaming using their traditional format.  Buy the map, download the rules and charts, use HBG units or OOB.  I haven’t talked with HBG in some time, but I assume this is still the plan.  Once the game is ready to go, I’ll reach out to HBG to work out the details.

I may start posting some game mechanic concepts and rules.  Honestly, I’ve purposely avoided being on here promoting the game until I feel it’s close to done.  This project has hit so many road blocks!  I don’t want to build up excitement only to have it fizzle because of more delays.

[Maofator]

OK.  I’m going to post some info here to give everyone an idea of what’s gong on.  Maybe getting this out there, getting some feedback, might just light a fire to get me motivated to get this thing finished!!!

Basic Concepts:

• Axis (Germany, Italy, Hungary, Romania, and Bulgaria) versus Allies (Great Britain and the Commonwealth, Russia, Greece, and Yugoslavia) with Vichy French Territories up for grabs. 
  All Axis players go at the same time, then all Allied players.  Repeat process.  This allows coordination of units. 
  Victory Conditions:  Axis captures two of the following:  Gibraltar, Cairo, or Stalingrad OR capture “X” number of Victory Points.  Allies Capture “X” number of victory points OR last “X” number of turns. 
  Mountain Terrain:  Applies penalties to attacking ground units. (Seems more logical to apply penalties to attackers than bonus to defenders for gaming purposes)
  Rivers:  Stalls Blitz attacks

New Mechanic Concepts:

Naval Transports:  GONE.  I’ve always been frustrated with Transports.  I understand the concept, but I’ve felt that countries that NEED these units to get involved in the war are at a disadvantage.  Frequently a country must spend as much money on transports as it cost for the units they want to move or more.  For a country to build a enough transports to make a major difference is a huge undertaking.  Not only do you have to build the transports but you have to build other naval units to protect your transports.  The fact that transports have such a high cost and have NO effective combat value is tough for countries that need them.  For Mare Nostrum all destroyers can carry one ground unit.  Conceptually, the cost of naval transports are built in to all naval units.  Just like you don’t have fuel tankers, or tug boats, etc.  Destroyers act as “escorts” for transport ships carrying units.

Sea Zone Control:  Just like land territories, sea zone can be controlled.  The Allies needed a way to extend naval movement and the Axis needed a way to restrict it.  So, naval units (other than submarines) have a movement of 3.  However, just like land territories sea zone can be “controlled”.  The idea of “controlling” the sea zone is more along the lines of “Recon has spotted enemy naval units in this area, proceed with caution” thus stopping movement.

Combat Value:  Rather than units having an attack and defense value they have a single combat value.  This is designed to simplify the game.

Air units, and air combat:  I’ve focused a bit more on this area by separating Air to Air combat as a separate part of the combat sequence, rather than clumping it into all combat.  Air units in the same combat zone must resolve Air to Air combat first.  Once resolved they receive “free shots” on naval/ground units.  Naval and ground units get token AA shots prior to that.  Air units also have “Air to Air”, “Air to Sea”, and Air to Ground" combat values.  This offers a more realistic and strategic value to air units.

Production Sites: I’ve created what i feel is a more realistic production system.  Rather than having a factory that can pump out 10 infantry all of a sudden, I created a more limited production/reinforcement system.  The number of of infantry, mech, air, and naval units that can be placed is limited each turn.  (see photo)  The yellow circle represents the number of infantry that can be produced per turn.  Green, the number of mech units (mechanized infantry, artillery, tanks).  Blue, the number of air units.  Grey, the number naval units. The numerical value in the factory icon represents how much total money can spent per turn placing new units.

Two roll combat units:  Units like Tanks, Bombers, and Battleships get 2 combat rolls to score hits.  It seem too frequently these game become a war of attrition.  In order to play the odds players frequently purchase lower price units to add die rolls rather than invest in heavy hitters.  By giving some units two rolls to score hits, it entices players to invest in more expensive units.

That’s in for now.  I may add more info later on.  If you have questions or comments please let me know.

[Midnight_Reaper]

These are very interesting ideas and you have caught my attention!

-Midnight_Reaper

[Imperious Leader]

Gibraltar, Cairo, or Stalingrad OR

What does the map look like at Stalingrad? I thought it was a Medd map, but including this makes it a very large area

[Ichabod]

The US isn’t part of the game?

Operation Torch commenced on 8 Nov 1942 - joint Anglo-American invaision of Vichy French N. Africa territories.

For an Axis and Allies like game, please add the US into the game if it’s not too late. Maybe restricted like can’t enter the war until turn 4 or 5 to represent the time frame.

[Maofator]

@Imperious:

Gibraltar, Cairo, or Stalingrad OR

What does the map look like at Stalingrad? I thought it was a Medd map, but including this makes it a very large area

Prior to starting this project, I had wondered why there wasn’t much in the way of WW2 games centered on the Med.  Once I started, it became pretty clear.  Although this region had a lot of action during the war it doesn’t translate into a game very well.  In the northern part of Med the axis made short work of Yugoslavia and Greece, then moved on deep into Russia.  That doesn’t make for a very fun and balanced game.  There were several issues to overcome to give this game a historic feel, but make it fun and balanced.  The Russian campaign was one of the trickiest issues to tackle.  The axis war with Russia had a major effect on the region both at the beginning of Barbarossa, and later on when Russia invaded Romania, Bulgaria, and Hungary.  I felt there was no way to offer an accurate portrayal of the Mediterranean theater with out somehow adding the element of the Axis push to Stalingrad.

However, with that said, I wanted to maintain a focus on the Med itself and keep the game map reasonably sized.  As a compromise I created “boxes” along the edge of the map the represent the movement into Russia.  Starting from Kherson, to Mariupol, To Rostov-On-Don, to Belaya Kalitva, to Surovikino, and finally to Stalingrad.  These boxes represent an eastward expanse that would have doubled the size of the map.  This allows the axis to push east, and Russia to build up and offer counter offensives.

[Maofator]

@Ichabod:

The US isn’t part of the game?

Operation Torch commenced on 8 Nov 1942 - joint Anglo-American invaision of Vichy French N. Africa territories.

For an Axis and Allies like game, please add the US into the game if it’s not too late. Maybe restricted like can’t enter the war until turn 4 or 5 to represent the time frame.

Originally having the US in the game was part of the plan.  However, as things developed it became clear I needed to drop the idea for a couple of reasons.  Ultimately the biggest reason was game balance.  Having the US involved in the conflict drastically tilted the game in favor of the Allies.  Trying to compensate by minimizing the Allies in the early stages of the game unbalance it in favor of the Axis.  instead I made the rule the axis must achieve a victory within 20 turns.  This basically indicates the US entry into the region.

I had considered labeling Great Britain as a British-US coalition rather than just Great Britain.  The British player will have more resources available in the form of reinforcements for the region than what were historically allocated.  It’s not that Britain didn’t have the resources, they just didn’t focus them in the region.  It’s still much less than what the US historically sent into the Med.  So, it’s a compromise.  It also helps simplify the game.  I hope that makes sense.

[CWO Marc]

I’m having a bit of trouble grasping something about this game.  The location is clearly the Mediterranean, but what (if any) is the exact time period in which it’s set?  Is the game meant to reflect what was actually going on in the Mediterranean (and elsewhere in Europe) at a specific point in WWII, or is the game basically a non-historical one which uses the geography of the Mediterranean as a battleground for a WWII-themed conflict of a somewhat general nature?

[Marc Arderiu]

I do appreciate the fact that for once no US forces will be involved into the game. Regarding vichy france, will they be neutrals that will align when attacked. Also, are there going to be special rules for a AfrikaKorps?

[Maofator]

@CWO:

I’m having a bit of trouble grasping something about this game.� The location is clearly the Mediterranean, but what (if any) is the exact time period in which it’s set?� Is the game meant to reflect what was actually going on in the Mediterranean (and elsewhere in Europe) at a specific point in WWII, or is the game basically a non-historical one which uses the geography of the Mediterranean as a battleground for a WWII-themed conflict of a somewhat general nature?

Thanks for your question.  The time period starts March 1941.  France has surrendered and declared a Vichy govt.  The Romanian territory of Bessarabia has been ceded to the Russians, as well as Transylvania to Hungary.  Operation Judgement has already taken place.  Italy starts off with a damaged Battleship representing those damaged in the battle.  Germany starts off with units in Africa repenting the beginning of the Afrka Corps.  Italy starts the game at war with Greece.  German units begin in Hungary, Romania, and Bulgaria that were originally designed for the invasion of Russia, but now are set to assist Italy with their Balkan campaign.  Every effort was made to maintain historical accuracy for the region during that time.

With that said, every game (to varying degrees) takes liberties to ensure game balance.  They are all a type of historical fiction that allow players the ability to recreate conflicts and achieve varying outcomes.  Otherwise, what’s the point of playing them?  A couple examples:  Global games don’t offer the US player nuclear bombs on turn “X”.  That would be historically accurate, but it would unbalance the game.  In some global games I’ve played two turns is close to a year in historic reference.  With that in mind, would it take like 5-6 years to sail around the world?  My point is, there are going to be history buffs that point out “flaws” in the game.

So, to answer your question this game tries to be historically accurate, but tweaks had to be made to fit game mechanics, balance, and playability.

[CWO Marc]

Thanks for the info about the March 1941 starting date. I’d been wondering whether (and if so, in what way) the game was meant to cover such widely-separated aspects of the war in the Mediterranean (and southern Europe and North Africa) as the rapid German conquest of Greece and Yugoslavia (April-May 1941) on the one hand, and the much longer and larger campaign for maritime control of the Mediterreanan on the other hand (which was virtually a miniature version of the Battle of the Atlantic, and which lasted nearly as long). It sounds as if the game concentrates on the former element, or at least uses it as its starting point.

[Maofator]

@Marc:

I do appreciate the fact that for once no US forces will be involved into the game. Regarding vichy france, will they be neutrals that will align when attacked. Also, are there going to be special rules for a AfrikaKorps?

Thank you!  I appreciate the vote of confidence. As for the French there are rules for each side (axis and allies) to influence Vichy territories/units to join their causes.  There are also rules that add modifiers to the attempt when a country uses a “show of military force”.  Failure will result in combat when a show of military force is used.  Each side may also attack these territories/units normally as well.  Ideally, each side would like to get the free units though.

As for Afrika Korps there are no special rules at this time.  However, I continue to come up with ideas that could be implemented in the game.  Rather than continue to delay the release of the game by trying to add all these ideas,  I plan to offer optional expansion rules down the road.  Some concepts for this include rules for Spain and Turkey.  Rules for Spain are done and tested.  Turkey would work similarly.  The rules work, but I i’m not quite happy how it plays out.  The concept is to have functioning neutrals that build and move units that both the axis and the allies jockey to maneuver.  These neutral would offer alternative means for the axis to achieve a victory via Victory Point total.  Afrika Korps is something that could definitely be added with those rules.

[Maofator]

@CWO:

Thanks for the info about the March 1941 starting date. I’d been wondering whether (and if so, in what way) the game was meant to cover such widely-separated aspects of the war in the Mediterranean (and southern Europe and North Africa) as the rapid German conquest of Greece and Yugoslavia (April-May 1941) on the one hand, and the much longer and larger campaign for maritime control of the Mediterreanan on the other hand (which was virtually a miniature version of the Battle of the Atlantic, and which lasted nearly as long). It sounds as if the game concentrates on the former element, or at least uses it as its starting point.

You’re welcome!  I appreciate the interest in the game.  You hit the nail right on the head.  There was a lot going on in the region during the war, but at different times, etc.  The game does focus more on the Balkan campaigns early on, but moves to the French North African territories, and naval combat in the Med pretty quick.  Trying to put it all together to make an enjoyable game was challenging.