• 2024 '22 '21 '19 '15 '14

    I am about to play my next Halifax game FtF tomorrow! My buddy has been just itching to try it again after our last 3 man game a week ago.

    The last one we tried involved a Sea Lion. Not an opener but later in the game, not exactly an expert execution, but exploiting a weakly defended UK after a few rounds of sneaky saves translated into naval builds by G.

    Like YG, I enjoy the potential for a Sea Lion in A&A. It remains a favorite “what if” scenerio each time a new board comes out. What I’m not into though, is a game balanced around London falling every time, with a scripted sea lion, in the first or second round. So for me the ideal is a 50/50 Sea Lion opener. Lately I’ve been trying to see which mix of income HRs with Halifax might allow for such a spread. My preference would be for a max defense of London which gets a roughly 50/50 or perhaps 60/40 chance, depending on how players choose to use the scramble mechanic. It’s of course hard to see everything when the game has so many “moving parts” but so far I prefer Halifax to OOB, on basically every level.  So again great work on this YG! It’s just a much stronger foundation to build on, at least for my group. My friends are fully converted haha

  • Sponsor

    Thanks Black Elk, what’s your opinion on the degree of an Allied advantage in Halifax, vs. oob 2ndE, or an average bid?

  • 2024 '22 '21 '19 '15 '14

    That’s a really good question, and one for which I don’t have a ready answer. I would say that Halifax provides a definite Allied advantage over OOB, but the changes (particularly with respect to the production rules) go further than anything you could achieve with a pre-placement bid on game balance. The core conditions out of the first round are altered here, such that its hard to compare Halifax with OOB at bid X, or to equivocate.

    Some of the changes here favor Axis as well as Allies on the production spread, but my gut tells me that what we have done here, definitely provides the allies with a leg up. I think this comes primarily from the way the British economy is handled, by collapsing UK pacific into UK, but its hard to put a specific amount on it in IPCs.

    In my play group, we never did find a balanced bid for G40. Even with a pre-placement Allied bid between +12 and +18 ipcs, nobody I gamed with ever felt that the game was particularly well balanced even with such a bid. There might have been openings for the Allies to win, but this was do more to the chaos of dice rolls than to the pre-positioning of extra units. It is also still unclear to me at what point you start swinging irreparably in the other direction (e.g. at X ipcs on the bid, then Allies almost always win.) Consider for example, how even a bid of 6 ipcs spent in the right place, can swing a TUV trade dramatically in the opening round. This even more so, if people use LL, which I don’t, but can still appreciate the effectiveness of pre-placement just giving a single extra pip in a key battle.

    We started at 3, like always, then 6, then 9. Axis still fairly dominant.

    So basically we had a G40 range somewhere between 10-18 to be balsy or to be more comfortable. But again, those games still did not feel balanced to me. Nobody I’ve played with has accepted a pre-placement bid over 20, on the logic that “the game couldn’t possibly be that unbalanced!” or even if it was, that the corrective of 20 ipcs pre-placement would be more distorting than its worth on account of the power of aircraft in A&A games. So basically 18 at the high end for us, and of course Axis can still win quite handily.

    Which is why I have gone over more and more to HRs at income as a solution to game balance, rather than pre-placement bidding.  G40 never felt balanced to me by side on production, even with a bid, at least not balanced in the way that Halifax feels roughly balanced right now. So I have not yet used a bid for this set up.

    I would say we have probably not removed the overall Axis advantage on the board, but have put the Allies at least back into contention. I think it is wise to enable a UK defense of London. The cost in the Pacific is still significant, but a set up where UK cannot possibly win the battle of Britain or defend their home island at 50/50 seems somehow unacceptable for the gameplay. Likewise for a Moscow crush. If it seems like Axis just wipe the floor every time, either on London or Moscow, that’s when I begin to think of core changes. The original games play reasonably well as single theater games, but the balance as a joined up thing was shaky. Now it will be much easier to tease out just how well the British Empire stacks up against the Axis, or how Russia fares, absent a bid under this set up. More games will reveal where we are.

    I will say though, that I already find myself exploring builds that I would not have considered in OOB with a pre-placement bid.

  • 2024 '22 '21 '19 '15 '14

    ps. If anyone would like to playtest Halifax using tripleA to see how it compares to a bid game OOB, here is a gamesave you can use. Right now everything necessary can be handled via the edit mode. In the save below, you can see the list of game edits in the game history tab. For example, how UK Pacific is removed and its territory ownership transferred to Britain. Also how the Commonwealth is formed by Adding British territories to Anzac. Also, in this case all starting factories are set to Major, and it is the players responsibility to know which are allowed to produce at the IC, Major, or Minor (if captured) under the Halifax values 10, 5, or 3.

    Basically all Halifax adjustments are via edit and the players responsibility to track things like NOs or total income. For example, in the place units phase you can edit income to match the appropriate values and then include a newly purchase “Minor factory” on the board. If a territory is captured you can edit the IC factory to a Minor factorywith the edit mode. Right now Major Factories are just ICs and the production limitation is up to the player to self enforce. Or if its more helpful, you just edit your unit placements at the end of the turn to match the correct values. The amount of editing currently required in tripleA, basically matches the changes you have to track in a normal game. Except here the set up has been handled already.

    The next step is to create a full gamemap xml with appropriate production units, rather than just an edited save game using the two factory types currently available. But if you want to try it immediately, here is a save that shows the basic changes for Halifax: Commonwealth option 2.

    Gamesave attached here…

    G40 Halifax 2.tsvg

  • 2024 '22 '21 '19 '15 '14

    A few images of the saved game above for TripleA.

    You can see it uses the standard TripleA ANZAC faction, color and position in game sequence, but with the value at 20 to represent the full Commonwealth (option 2). Note how Eire is now blue, fighter in Ontario, and commonwealth ships at sea. UK pacific in the stats window is set to Zero, and the income added to the British. Check the values of ANZAC and British in the stats columns as these now correspond to the full Commonwealth and full British Empire factions under the Halifax rules.

    With regard to NOs and to things like capital capture or liberating conquered territory, or factories, again it is up to the player to track the appropriate total income or make the appropriate “possession” edit in the game options. If you want to play a full game, just remember to edit your NOs, and to check territory ownership in the case of any of the adjusted territories being taken and reconquered, since they will then revert to the original owner. Example, Japan takes Burma, and then UK recaptures it, the liberated territory will show up as UK-Pacific, so at this point you need to “edit possession” back to the British. Same deal if capitals are captured or liberated, just make sure to edit your total IPCs and track your factory production according to the Halifax rules.

    Next step for us would be to make the full xml gamefile (rather than just an edited saved game), with the full faction name Commonwealth, a chosen color for territories and units, and a Roundel. A new gamefile is also necessary to get all 3 production facility types available. But until then you can still play around with the savegame if you like, just load it into your saved game folder in tripleA to see the core changes under Halifax.

    I generally use the map view at 60% for Global like the Atlantic image (60% gives a reasonably clear view with only a bit of ‘fuzz’) but the south Africa image shows the scale of the territories in the mapview at 100% for those who prefer the close up. Enjoy
    :-D

    Halifax 2.jpg
    Commonwealth option 2.jpg

  • 2024 '22 '21 '19 '15 '14

    And here is the save for Commonwealth option 1, in case anyone wants to see what it looks like without all the other Dominions. Note the differences in the stats columns between Option 1 and Option 2 with respect to British and Anzac starting income and TUV.

    So far I have been playing with the Full Commonwealth option 2, but for good measure now we have a savegame for both in case anyone wants to play.

    Halifax Canzac.jpg
    G40 Halifax 1.tsvg


  • @Black_Elk:

    Next step for us would be to make the full xml gamefile (rather than just an edited saved game), with the full faction name Commonwealth, a chosen color for territories and units, and a Roundel. A new gamefile is also necessary to get all 3 production facility types available. But until then you can still play around with the savegame if you like, just load it into your saved game folder in tripleA to see the core changes under Halifax.

    Wait no longer! I made a gamefile for both Option 1 and 2 Halifax rules. It’s just ANZAC colored for now, but that is a simple change if a general consensus prefers a different color. TripleA even comes with a Commonwealth Roundel in the default game files, so that choice was simple. The only new rules that must be player enforced are the restriction on building units costing more than 10 from minor factories, as well as the Commonwealth having two capitals. (I just made Ottowa the Commonwealth capital, because how often does it really get taken?)

    Here is a mediafire link since the forum won’t allow attachment of this size:

    http://www.mediafire.com/download/fp2z76r282ukq8d/World_War_II_Global.zip

    Note to Users: I highly recommend saving a backup of the original World War II Global.zip file somewhere so you have something to restore to if something somehow goes wrong in the transfer. Other than that, all you have to do is replace the normal .zip file with the one linked and the maps should show up in your game list the next time you start TripleA.

    Also, to Young Grasshopper: There is a fighter in Ontario added to the setup, correct? I know you’re probably used to playing with it by now, but it’s not in the setup modifications section of the original post. Neither is all Major ICs (except India) becoming Industrial Complexes, but that’s more intuitive.

    And, some pics of the new game.

    G40 Halifax V1 Atlantic & Stats.png
    G40 Halifax V1 Africa & Objectives.png


  • Option 2 pics

    G40 Halifax V2 Atlantic & Stats.png
    G40 Halifax V2 Africa & Objectives.png

  • Sponsor

    Hey Black Elk, are those screen shots of some kind of triple A game with modifications to play Halifax rules? Forgive my ignorance to the online gaming portion of this website.

  • Sponsor

    Quote from Black Elk…
    Also, to Young Grasshopper: There is a fighter in Ontario added to the setup, correct? I know you’re probably used to playing with it by now, but it’s not in the setup modifications section of the original post. Neither is all Major ICs (except India) becoming Industrial Complexes, but that’s more intuitive

    I added a fighter to Ontario as part of my own Halifax expasion, but removed it from the Generic rules posted in the first reply of this thread. The reason being is that the Generic Halifax rules should only contain modifications absolutly necessary for the game mechanics to play a single UK economy, the new Commonwealth, and the new Production units. Therefore, the added fighter in Ontario is a personal preference and belongs in my own Halifax expansion rather than the Generic rules. I believe that the setup modification to replace all minor ICs with major factories is mentioned.

    Cheers.


  • #houserules

  • Sponsor

    Halifax Rules are now at…

    +21

  • Sponsor

    After a game we had on the weekend in which two players suggested that Halifax Rules may be hurting the Allies chances to win, I added some optional national objectives to the first post of this thread which I recommend for balance.

  • '17 '16

    @Imperious:

    #houserules

    Please do not put this jewel into the wormhole vortex of Houserules.:cry:
    At least, keep it stickied amongst the first threads of Houserules’ forum.
    Thanks,

  • Customizer

    Congrats on the sticky for all of you folks who worked on this! I haven’t played this as I am teaching new players the OOB Basics right now, but I think this maybe something that’s going to be good down the road.

  • 2024 '22 '21 '19 '15 '14

    Oh fantastic!  I was wondering where this thread had gone, now I see it got a sticky! Genius.

    Oh colonelcarter, great work! I was really hoping someone would put that file together,  since I’ve been so busy with my day job lately. This is great! Now we can play for real!

    To YG, that’s correct dude, Halifax is now playable on tripleA. :)

    I would definitely encourage everyone to check it out and gather some hard data from playtesting. Especially as regards things like balance by sides (allied advantage, disadvantage etc.) Often times the anecdotal experience of players in a face to face game can seem very compelling,  but it can just as easily lead to over compensation. I would suggest that right now we are no where near enough games played to determine the overall balance of the set up. This requires at bare minimum at least 100 games played, at a reasonably high level of skill, before I would start suggesting set up alterations. This is because each alteration requires a pretty strong control group of tests to measure against, so we can see how alterations are affecting things. I’m excited that we now have a legit gamefile for these purposes.  It will speed us along considerably :)

    Again great work guys!


  • I do not like the NO’s being given to the UK and US for strategic bombing. Feels forced.

    I also don’t like the taking away of the USSR communism bonus, when you could have just changed it to make sense rather than abolish it. This would be changing it to “+3 IPCs for control of any orginal Axis, Pro-axis, or Neutral territory with a printed IPC value of ‘1’ or more”. So no more world tours for soviet troops to get that 3 ipcs for Sardinia etc.

  • Sponsor

    @oztea:

    I do not like the NO’s being given to the UK and US for strategic bombing. Feels forced.

    These are optional, not required to play the Halifax Rule set.

    @oztea:

    I also don’t like the taking away of the USSR communism bonus, when you could have just changed it to make sense rather than abolish it. This would be changing it to “+3 IPCs for control of any orginal Axis, Pro-axis, or Neutral territory with a printed IPC value of ‘1’ or more”. So no more world tours for soviet troops to get that 3 ipcs for Sardinia etc.

    The Communist bonus has not been removed, the National Pride has been split into two… and that is also optional.


  • YGH, you got my thumb up as well. I just noticed this topic now, and I really like the commonwealth setup idea. I will try to bring this to my gamegroup.

    PS: If I were to make an houserule to the game, I’d change the mediterranean sea zones, add few zones in order to make it so that Italy and UK can’t attack in 1 move gibraltar/italy/egypt. Just because the mediterranean battle is terribly one-sided. Either Italy is annihilated or it dominates. I’d like a more balanced approach.

  • Sponsor

    I have removed the following national objective suggestions as to keep the base Halifax Rules pure, however, in our playtest games we have found that extra national objectives are necessary for balance.

    The following are optional national objectives recommended for balance:

    United Kingdom

    3 IPCs if the United Kingdom has conducted a successful SBR on a German production facility this round
    3 IPCs if the Allies (not including Dutch) control Borneo, Java, Sumatra, and Celebes

    Germany

    5 IPCs if Germany controls London

    Soviet Union

    Remove the Russian national objective “National Prestige” and use the following two NOs instead:

    5 IPCs If the Allies control Archangel, and there are no Axis warships in sea zone 125
    5 IPCs If there are no Allied units on any original Soviet Union territories

    Japan

    5 IPCs If Japan controls all original Chinese territories

    United States

    3 IPCs If the United States has conducted a successful SBR on a German production facility this round
    3 IPCs If the Allies (not including Dutch) control Borneo, Java, Sumatra, and Celebes

    China

    Modify the Chinese national objective “Burma Road” to the following:

    2 Free artillery units if the Allies control all territories connecting the Burma road

    Setup Modifications

    • The major industrial complex in India now becomes a major factory
    • All minor industrial complexes now become major factories

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