13L G40 NT Arathorn (Axis) vs. Infrastructure (Allies +13)

[arathorn]

3 casualties for Germans = 3 artillery
2 casualties for Russians = 2 ftrs

A
1 tank, 1 ftr, 1 tact = 10 = 1 hit + roll at 4

Rolls: 1@4; Total Hits: 01@4: (6)

D

3 art = 1 hit.

[arathorn]

BTW, you can choose to retreat after any round of attack.

1 casualty germans = 1 art
1 casualty russians = 1 ftr

1 tank and 1 tact = 1 hit plus  a roll at 1

Rolls: 1@1; Total Hits: 01@1: (2)

2 art = 1 roll at 4

Rolls: 1@4; Total Hits: 11@4: (3)

[arathorn]

At this point - I will not roll any further until I’ve heard from you.

If you choose a point of retreat after any of the previous rounds, then you can simply retreat back and change your non-combat move.

If you choose to let the last round stand, you have to choose between 1 tank and 1 tact in casualty, leaving you 1 unit against my 1 art.

If you choose the tact and press the battle, we’ll roll your 3 against my 2. If I hit, regardless of your hit or not, I keep Berlin.

Let me know what you want to do.

[gamerman01]

HOLD EVERYTHING

Infrastructure’s invasion of Berlin with ground units was not even legal in the first place.
R4 needs to be redone

[gamerman01]

However, since Infra did post the R4 move, the 72 hour clock does NOT end tonight.  It will be 72 hours from now.

[MrRoboto]

Just out of curiosity - why wouldn’t it be legal?

[arathorn]

You can only blitz a territory that is completely empty.

[JDOW]

Europe Rulebook 2nd Edition p. 15

A tank can “blitz” by moving through an unoccupied hostile territory as the first part of a move that can end in a
friendly or hostile territory

However, I apologize to invade but I cannot resist to add this fun fact.

I ran the simulation 20000 times initially and now have a look at the result! :D

[gamerman01]

Page 15, Europe 2nd edition manual, blue box, first sentence under Combat:

A power can’t attack a territory controlled by or containing units belonging to a power with which it is not at war.

[gamerman01]

Has been #12 on my Triple A issues list

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1cS3hFwoBP0rWr3208jw1LAtCvHYa9Ji9uU8PwbCMIwM/edit

[arathorn]

@JDOW:

Europe Rulebook 2nd Edition p. 15

A tank can �blitz� by moving through an unoccupied hostile territory as the first part of a move that can end in a
friendly or hostile territory

However, I apologize to invade but I cannot resist to add this fun fact.

I ran the simulation 20000 times initially and now have a look at the result! :D

I did the same thing :)

18.02 LOL

Good thing the whole move was illegal - or that would have been grounds for ANOTHER debate :)

[MrRoboto]

@JDOW:

However, I apologize to invade but I cannot resist to add this fun fact.

I ran the simulation 20000 times initially and now have a look at the result! :D

What exactly are you pointing at?

[arathorn]

@MrRoboto:

@JDOW:

However, I apologize to invade but I cannot resist to add this fun fact.

I ran the simulation 20000 times initially and now have a look at the result! :D

What exactly are you pointing at?

IF the move had been legal, then the LL reroll option would have been up for debate.

[gamerman01]

@arathorn:

Good thing the whole move was illegal - or that would have been grounds for ANOTHER debate :)

No kidding  :-)

MrRoboto, JDOW is pointing at the fact that it is barely below 18, which is the threshold for triggering a LL re-roll by agreement between the two players

[JDOW]

@arathorn:

@JDOW:

Europe Rulebook 2nd Edition p. 15

A tank can �blitz� by moving through an unoccupied hostile territory as the first part of a move that can end in a
friendly or hostile territory

However, I apologize to invade but I cannot resist to add this fun fact.

I ran the simulation 20000 times initially and now have a look at the result! :D

LOOL, and the average of the 40k simulations is 17,99 then, how sick is that?
I is NOT possible to have a closer situation for the 30 IPC reroll rule I guess^^

I did the same thing :)

18.02 LOL

Good thing the whole move was illegal - or that would have been grounds for ANOTHER debate :)

[JDOW]

@arathorn:

@JDOW:

Europe Rulebook 2nd Edition p. 15

A tank can �blitz� by moving through an unoccupied hostile territory as the first part of a move that can end in a
friendly or hostile territory

However, I apologize to invade but I cannot resist to add this fun fact.

I ran the simulation 20000 times initially and now have a look at the result! :D

I did the same thing :)

18.02 LOL

Good thing the whole move was illegal - or that would have been grounds for ANOTHER debate :)

without quotation mess this time^^

LOOL, and the average of the 40k simulations is 17,99 then, how sick is that?
I is NOT possible to have a closer situation for the 30 IPC reroll rule I guess^^

[MrRoboto]

Thank god the move is invalid! It would have been one hell of a job for Gamerman :-)
And with Berlin conquered I think the allies would have eventually won the game here. Now it’s looking extremely grim, though.

[JDOW]

@MrRoboto:

Thank god the move is invalid! It would have been one hell of a job for Gamerman :-)
And with Berlin conquered I think the allies would have eventually won the game here. Now it’s looking extremely grim, though.

Even if this is a theoretical discussion, I guess the easiest solution would have been to agree on a certain sample size like 100k (or 1M if somebody has too much time^^) and the result of that simulation is decisive then, even if there might be some variance, that is what A&A players have been able to deal with:D

[arathorn]

But even with such a sample size, the swing was RIGHT around 18.
You got 17.97 and I got 18.02 after 20000. So it’s never going to be good enough.

[gamerman01]

And this is one of the reasons that basing a low luck re-roll on TUV swing is not a very good idea.

Consider this as well:
If Infrastructure had realized that this result was close to the threshold, he could have deliberately chosen more expensive casualties and then Germany would not have the re-roll option.
So you want good luck, but not great luck, because then the other player could force a re-roll?

This house rule is in much need for improvement.

Also, if Germany spent 10 for the re-roll and then still lost Berlin, this ends up being Russia who pays for the re-roll because then she plunders 10 IPC’s less.  So if you’re going to play with a house rule that you pay for LL re-rolls, you need a special condition in there for if a capital is falling.