• Surprise Strike: Both attacking and defending submarinescan make a Surprise Strike by firing before any otherunits fire in a sea battle. As detailed in step 2 of theGeneral Combat sequence (page 18), submarines maketheir rolls before any other units, unless an enemydestroyer is present. If neither side was eligible for aSurprise Strike, there is no step 2. Players move directlyto step 3 of the General Combat sequence.Submersible: A submarine has the option of submerging.It can do this anytime it would otherwise make a SurpriseStrike. The decision is made before any dice are rolledby either side (the attacker decides first) and takes effect immediately. When a submarine submerges, it’simmediately removed from the battle strip and placedback on the map. As a result, it can no longer fire or takehits in that combat. However, a submarine can’t submergeif an enemy destroyer is present in the battle. Page 32 of Europe rules.

    A sub vs sub battle, I interpret the above as the defending sub can submerge BEFORE being fired at. Attacks are simultaneous, and the defending sub would have a surprise strike as well, making it eligible to submerge before any dice has been rolled. Am I correct?

  • Moderator 2023 '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 '12

    You are right atease.
    The defending Sub can indeed avoid combat as the Attacker had no Destroyer to prevent it submerging.


  • a friend im playing against on triple A said the game didn’t offer to submerge my sub before he fired. Is that normal?

  • Moderator 2023 '22 '21 '20 '19 '18 '17 '16 '15 '14 '13 '12

    Can’t help with that as I do not play AAA.
    (Have played Napoleon.)
    He might be right, or he may have missed the question. Is easy to press continue when it is the IA’s go. Could he edit it back in?


  • Atease, no that is not normal in TripleA. Are you sure there wasn’t a destroyer present or your opponent just didn’t click through it? You can always add the sub back on the map by using edit mode…


  • I guess he just skipped the question. It was 1 sub vs 1 sub in SZ 125 to cut his Russian bonus.

    We edited it back. Thank you!


  • Just wanted to check a sub rule. If a sub goes up against other non transport, non destroyer type ships (in this instance a damaged carrier and cruiser), can the sub keep doing a surprise attack till the opposition are destroyed without them firing back? That’s how my friend read the rules.


  • Depends on if the Sub is attacking or defending…

    If the Sub was attacked by the carrier(AC) and cruiser. It has the option to submerge. If it doesn’t submerge, then the Sub would Surprise Strike at 1(since it’s defending), at the beginning of the round. If it hits, then the attacker has the option to apply the hit to his AC or cruiser. He would most likely apply the hit to his AC, since AC’s don’t have an attack value. Then, he would roll for his cruiser. If he hit, your sub is dead. If he misses, then you have the option to press the attack. Then, every round you roll for your Surprise strike first. If you hit, in 2nd or subsequent rounds, while your Sub is still alive, then the cruiser would die before being able to roll a defending dice roll.

    Remember, when destroyers aren’t present, then both attacking and defending Subs fire their 1st strike before any other units.

    If the Sub was attacking, then the Sub rolls the 1st strike @ 2(since he’s attacking). If he hits, same thing as above. Your opponent decides where to apply this hit. If he applies to the damaged AC or cruiser, then that unit doesn’t get a return fire, as the 1st strike killed it before it had a chance to return fire. Then, as long as the Sub is still alive it gets a 1st strike. If it hits, then that unit won’t get a return fire either, as it died before it had a chance to return fire.

    Hope this helps…

  • 2023 '22 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    @SunTzu7:

    Just wanted to check a sub rule. If a sub goes up against other non transport, non destroyer type ships (in this instance a damaged carrier and cruiser), can the sub keep doing a surprise attack till the opposition are destroyed without them firing back? That’s how my friend read the rules.

    Like Brado explained, yes the sub gets a “surprise strike” each round.  But the defending carrier and cruiser do fire back every round provided it was not sunk by the sub surprise strike.

    So in your example, if the sub hit, the defender would choose a casualty.  Whatever he chooses will not roll (will not fire back) but the other unit will fire back.
    Subs get surprise strikes at the beginning of every single round of combat (the first round AFTER the last enemy destroyer is sunk), even when they are on defense.

    If you read through Step 2 under General combat (Submarine Surprise Strike or Submerge), the rule book tells exactly how to handle sub combat and makes it very clear that surprise strike happens every round, and also how to handle surprise strike casualties.
    One such sentence:
    “As long as there are attacking and/or defending submarines and no opposing destroyers, this step is repeated during each round of combat.”

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