G4013L Karl7(Axis) v. Gamerman (Allies)

Right, that’s what I said about re-rolling.
I understand the whole subtract dice from right to left thing and keeping dice rolled.
The issue here is that you thought you had more firepower than you did.  It wasn’t a typo in rolling the dice.

For all I know, if you were aware you didn’t have the extra cruiser, you would have siphoned off one of the aircraft from Karelia to Norway, and hit me once less, and I might have hit you again in round 2 in Karelia, and a forward infantry would be dead.  If we were playing face to face, I would have stopped you immediately, before you rolled dice.  I think I would have grounds for demanding that you re-do your entire round.  I’m certainly not going to ask that you do any such thing, but my point is the combat move was illegal and simply looking back and saying you got an extra hit anyway, is beside the point.

I think you should take one infantry off of Norway.  It will make very little difference in the game - it’s just the principle of the thing, and as you can tell, it’s significant to me.

It just sets the wrong precedence (even though this is probably our last game for a year because of league rules).
If I make an illegal combat move (extend the range of a bunch of fighters, for example), and then the dice go great for me, you could argue that I wouldn’t have made the (hypothetical) attack at all had I not been trusting in phantom fighters.  You would not allow me to merely subtract some meaningless dice (extra hits) and have the same result.  I was trusting in phantom fighters.

You were trusting in a phantom cruiser.
I’m not writing all this because I really want one nearly insignificant infantry dead.  I’m writing all this because of the principle of the thing - it’s just bad form.

So unless you protest, I think we should delete one infantry from Norway to settle the mistake.

As you know, I have been catching many mistakes by you, and some of them benefit you.  I think this dude in Norway is a small price to pay.

@Karl7:

Oh, and I get that obviously rolling more than you should increases the chances of getting a preferred number.  But then rerolling altogether gives you a whopping 50% you’ll do better than you did.

I know, that’s why I said last night that we probably shouldn’t re-roll - just delete 1 infantry.

Also, without the cruiser I don’t think I would have put anything more into the battle anyway.

But we don’t know that.

I have to get a cavity fixed in a half hour.
Maybe R3 later today

@Karl7:

I acknowledgement of you integrity as a player and your correcting of my errors I will gladly remove an inf from nor.

Thank you.

So you don’t play with the remove 1 die from the right?

I do, but only when too many dice were rolled by accident (a typo).  The difference is, you thought you had more firepower than you actually did.

Nah, not messy at all - you can see clearly in the combat moves.

If something’s there illegally, and the player rolls everything, it ain’t a typo.

@Karl7:

I think I like your rule, but let me clarify for my own sake - the rule is:

If in an attack, you roll for at least one unit that has made an illegal combat move, the defending player is entitled to require you to reroll your attack rolls for (1) all your legal attacking units, or (2) for all legal attacking units of the same combat value as the illegal unit(s)?).

I don’t understand (2), but yes, if you make an illegal combat move I think the defending player has the right to make you re-roll all battles that could have been affected.

When I mentioned “messy” before, I was more thinking of differentiating between situations like in Nor where the illegal move had a possible benefit to another attack by allowing more total units to engage all around vs a situation say where you are making only 1 attack total but just included too many units. The later I think would be more amenable to the reduce from left rule because if you insist on a reroll you are giving them the 50% chance of doing much better less the reduction in number of dice.

Even if it is the only battle, I think the defender has a right to a re-roll, because again, you can’t prove you would have made the attack with fewer units and you are looking at dice that were rolled when you had the confidence of more units.

Yet, differentiating between those two scenarios is probably getting too complicated and the bright line rule above will probably serve us better.

I don’t yet understand the “second scenario” you’re describing

(I like thinking about this stuff sadly.)

Good!  So do I.

The defender of course should never abuse his rights, but should treat the other player the way he would want to be treated if the situation was reversed.

This is one area where we’re looking at it differently:
When dice are thrown based on an illegal move, I think those dice can be completely disregarded.  Like they never happened.  I understand the wisdom in keeping all dice thrown as much as possible, but I think illegal moves are an exception.

There ARE situations where re-rolling is appropriate.  Even whole combat phases.  Normally those situations would be as a result of illegal moves.

Well, fortunately this situation was very minor and we have come to an agreement.  But yes, going forward I think you will be well served to add this rule to your reportoire:

If a combat move is illegal, the defender has rights to re-rolls, within reason.  (Shouldn’t have to re-roll things that are completely out of range, in another place, if there is no relation at all)

No.  If a re-roll is done, it should be the whole battle.
The problem is not that you rolled an extra 3, the problem is you went into the battle thinking you had an extra 3.

I would definitely wait to hear from you on the AA decision

No, the Allied commander hasn’t studied the situation yet.