Japan's NO



  • One of Japan’s national objectives states: when Japan is not at war with the US, has not made an unprovoked declaration of war against UK/ANZAC, and has not attacked French Indo-China, it receives a bonus of 10 IPCs.

    If UK/ANZAC attacks Japan first, that doesn’t bring the US into war and as such Japan would still receive that bonus if it doesn’t attack the US, right? In the current game, Japan attacked only USSR and China turn 1. Then UK attacks Japan on its first turn. Turn 2 Japan, Japan counterattacks UK but still leaves the US alone, and hasn’t yet taken over Indo-China. So, the US is still out of the war (hasn’t been attacked by Germany/Italy on that side yet), and Japan receives the bonus, even though it is at war with UK/ANZAC. Is this correct?

    Thanks



  • Yup, thats right.

    In that scenario, Japan is free to attack DEI, Mainland UK, and Anzac, and if it leaves FIC and USA alone, still receives the ten bonus IPCs.


  • 2018 2017 2016

    Certainly begs the question if a pre-emptive declaration that early is worth it for UK and ANZAC. Reinforcing Yunnan helps keep China relevant and could help defend India, but as mentioned Japan can start swiping money islands and get some substantial bonus income in R2. I guess if Japan sends everyone home R1 you could have some wiggle room for a round.

    UK Pacific will need all the help if can get defending Calcutta, a move like that is tugging on Superman’s cape.



  • Thanks.

    Yes in this game I played the Allies a little differently - Soviets Turn 1 stacked the 18 INF in Amur, which drew the predicted response of an attack and Mongolian activation. To kill the 18 INF, Japan used the planes it would normally use to go after the Chinese (was hoping to kill a few planes with the AAA-none hit of course, and send the Mongolians south to help China).

    So Japan had fewer planes to hit southern China/stack in Kwangsi, and left 2 fighters, 2 tacs and an SBR in Kwangsi. I took the UK Kwangtung INF, an INF and ART from India by transport, battleship support shot and my three UK Pacific planes after them (I killed the planes, only lost the ground units, moved the planes back to defend Yunnan).

    The maneuver caught Japan a little off guard, at this point he’s taken over most of Siberia  (I find Russia can handle that loss of income if it maintains its bonus and gets a European axis territory once in awhile), China is holding the Burma Road and his Japanese transports, having gone to Amur, were out of position to nail the money islands early on. We’ll see how it goes, but generally speaking I have no qualms about attacking Japan with UK if Japan leaves its planes/boats vulnerable.


  • 2019 2018

    Declaring war on Japan in UK1 is generally a bad idea, unless Japan has REALLY misplaced some of his transports and/or carriers.

    There are pros and cons to declaring in UK2.

    Pro: You will get +5 for UK one turn and +10 for anzac one turn.

    Con: Since the US will not be able to attack in US3, the fleet that may be positioned at Queensland or Hawaii is not threatening Japan. Therefore Japan can safely split the fleet to escort the transports to Java/borneo/celebes or whatever in J3. Without a UK-DOW, Japan needs to hit all targets at once in J3, while staying in a position to attack the seazone at caroline. Otherwise, the Australian and American forces can join at Caroline, threatening a lot of coast and Island territories. This leads to unprotected transports more often than not.

    So it basically boils down to: +15 safe extra-ipc for the allies against a strategic advantage for Japan, enabling them to split the fleet for transport escorts.



  • I really don’t like the French-Indo China part of this NO.  The Japanese going into Indo-China wasn’t the only reason for the ABCD embargo.  They should lose the bonus in Turn 2 no matter what they do, due to the war in China.

    That’s just my two cents.


  • 2019 2018

    From a game balance point of view however, it makes absolute sense. If you want the early minor in FIC, you’ll have to sacrifice 8 IPC. This decision is perfectly balanced.



  • Generally I declare on UK2 if Japan has not declared already.

    Simply put, a UK stack on the Burma Road creates more headaches for Japan than anything else.  China is an IPC sink for Japan, giving China artillery makes it doubly so.  Russia in Amur makes it even more dangerous for Japan on the mainland.  Japan cannot afford to wait, and bogging them down in China if they’ve waited two turns already technically drives Japan to a long play game where they’ve lost the economic advantage.

    Throw in the NO bonus for India and ANZAC for a round and its generally worth making the US wait to join the war.  Particularly as the UK after 2 rounds has probably collected at least 12 IPC from DEI that Japan has not taken due to lack of DOW.  It possible to hold some of them for a third round, depending if you leave units on the DEI or just hop from island to island with the same Inf and TT.  You could easily place 9-10 Inf on India on UK3, making India a tough nut to crack if you’ve been placing Mech on UK1 and UK2 (I think you could have 8-9 Mech as well).

    It makes for a slower game, and it could hurt Moscow in the process depending on the German plays.  US cannot even threaten Germany for a long time if it has to wait until Round 4 to move off the coast of the US in the Atlantic.  Earliest landing for US ground units in Europe would be Round 5 if that happens and thats assuming the US is prepared on US4 to move units and a fleet and ground units to Gib.


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016 2015 '14 '13 Moderator

    I find it far to much of a temptation not to DW on UK2 for the reasons you mentioned Spendo.



  • I find this exactly the strategic dilemma for Japan!
    Japan strengthens its position when DOW J2 but that may weaken the German/Italian positions. Some US players are even ready to go for Gibraltar and start projecting a threat into Europe in US 2 .

    If UK DOWs UK2 as general play, it may just end up strengthening both axis nations. But I can see it working in some cases, especially if the German threat levels are low in Europe and Japan is out of position with its fleet.


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