• Our group at times have beefed up adv art tech to include the option of firing at adjacent tt @ 3 one time only, but you need to match it 1 for 1 w/inf (kinda like bombardment). So this tech would allow art to support two inf +1 if it goes in with them (oob you would have three 2’s) or support one inf +1 and fire its 3 from adjacent tt (only once). As IL said its pretty cool not to have them be on the front line. I’m ok with it being able to move in non combat even if it fired in combat, but moving two spaces might be to much. I think it should still only move 1 space either before it fires or after not both.

    I also like a roll of 1 gets to choose ground unit, they should be able to hit a tank. Tanks should also get this. As discussed on another tread ftrs in ground battles should also be able to choose air units if you roll a 1 and the enemy has air. If there’s no air ftrs can choose any ground unit.


  • I like Jens idea, well except for 4, but her limts give a enough drawbacks to attack, to warrant a serious upgrade to defense.

    All arty defend on 3 first round
    OR
    All arty may choose the enemy casualty on a roll of a 1
    OR
    All arty bump the defense of infantry to 3 on defense at 1:1

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    Yea, my idea was to kinda treat them like shore bombardments, except they also give a boost to infantry on the attack as well (for the first round.)

    After all, I cannot for the life of me remember a single news real showing an M-79 Pack Howitzer CHARGING the enemy with the infantry!  I believe that’s why we had tanks! (Basically artillery that “charge” with the infantry, right?)


  • Arty firing from adjacent territories?  
    Did Gerald Bull make this house rule?  :-D

    IMO 25 km is probably maximum fire support for heavies. If they ain’t following me then they ain’t helping me for long.


  • OK so this joint defensive bonus with inf + arty: would it still apply if the arty and inf were allies conducting multinational def?


  • @allboxcars:

    OK so this joint defensive bonus with inf + arty: would it still apply if the arty and inf were allies conducting multinational def?

    No joint strikes in defens or attack, simple as that. Since I first saw this house rule I have play tested the rule about 20 times, were arty boost the defense of infantry to 3 on defense at 1:1. I must say it is not a game breaker, but really nice. I will use this house rule in every game a play from now on. Now those arty are worth to buy. I love it, good work Game Master! I do really think that this will become a standard rule like the 2-hit battleships. If the artillery would have a 3 in defens instead it would be close to a game breaker or superior (or almost) infantry.


  • I dunno… 3 for inf on the defense?  :|
    My initial impression: sounds kind of too lethal, too easy.

    I guess I’d rather see a Fortress piece or something to signify elaborate strategic defenses reflecting what arty + inf can do… but make it rare or special investment rather than make every arty + inf combo automatically get it.

    Still, worth playtesting and definitely food for thought.


  • @allboxcars:

    I dunno… 3 for inf on the defense?  :|
    My initial impression: sounds kind of too lethal, too easy.

    I guess I’d rather see a Fortress piece or something to signify elaborate strategic defenses reflecting what arty + inf can do… but make it rare or special investment rather than make every arty + inf combo automatically get it.

    Still, worth playtesting and definitely food for thought.

    You don’t get it. It is not a 3 in defens for inf, but a 1:1 match for inf and arty. One could say that arty defends on a 3 as long as it is protected by a inf. This increased defence capabillity is lost once there are no inf (cannon fodder) to match with it in the combat. It is not over powered, I have play tested it for like 20 times. I also tried the 3 in defens for arty, but it turned out that one bought as many arty as inf, were as one buy less arty on the 1:1 match.


  • @Dreadnaught:

    You don’t get it. It is not a 3 in defens for inf, but a 1:1 match for inf and arty.

    OK, so which one of us doesn’t “get” the proposed house rule?

    @Game:

    When an infantry defends along with an artillery, the infantry’s defens increases to 3.

    Trust me, I got it thanks. :wink:
    I just don’t agree with that increase in lethality for every arty + inf combo. Big difference between Stage 6 dug-in and Maginot Line… and that’s where I draw it. IMO, naturally.

    Now, as expressed in another thread, I can get behind the idea that arty defends at 1 and Armour at 2 AND those types of units receive a +1 on defense when paired with inf on a 1:1.


  • @allboxcars:

    I dunno… 3 for inf on the defense?  :|
    My initial impression: sounds kind of too lethal, too easy.

    I guess I’d rather see a Fortress piece or something to signify elaborate strategic defenses reflecting what arty + inf can do… but make it rare or special investment rather than make every arty + inf combo automatically get it.

    Still, worth playtesting and definitely food for thought.

    Well, ask your self if not a tank is superior to an artillery. I never buy artillery if I can afford to buy a tank instead, due to its mobility and defensive capabillity. By making the artillery unit a little bit more defensive, but still not better than a infantry, I would buy them more often. Such a defensive artillery unit would favor a more offensive play by all players, because a infantry/artillery combo would be a better buy than just two infantry units. Such a combo would cost 1 IPC more than two infantry, but increases the combat capability with 1 more hitpower in defens and 2 more hitpower in offense. The fact that the attack and defens bonus only last as long as there are any infantry to be matched with the artillery wont make it to a game breaker. One will most likely buy 2 infantry per artillery unit. The artillery conquers, the infantry occupies.

    My suggestion for a revised artillery unit is certaintly balanced and not a game breaker; when an infantry defends along with an artillery, the infantry’s defens increases to 3. It is easy and simple, and is also more historical correct. Try it, and you will find out your self, but please let me know what think about it after a few rounds of playtesting. Remember that the artillery unit we have today were made when the armour unit still defended on a 2, in A&A Europe.


  • AAE40 has tanks at 3-3-2-6  8/6= 4/3

    so…. the artillery costing 4 and moving 1…  should be a 5/4 or 6/4 to maintain the same ratio of value to cost.

    so you got either 5 or 6 points to play with and you have to account for the +1 for infantry which is not possible to account for.

    so how bout artillery is a three on attack as long as it has infantry supporting it?

    the game has too many defending values on land to overcome and this makes the artillery the ‘battlefield shaper’

    Artillery is always fired first to start the battle and soften up the defenders. The defender uses it as well, but setting up massive artillery is not the point of defense.


  • @Imperious:

    AAE40 has tanks at 3-3-2-6  8/6= 4/3

    so…. the artillery costing 4 and moving 1…  should be a 5/4 or 6/4 to maintain the same ratio of value to cost.

    so you got either 5 or 6 points to play with and you have to account for the +1 for infantry which is not possible to account for.

    so how bout artillery is a three on attack as long as it has infantry supporting it?

    the game has too many defending values on land to overcome and this makes the artillery the ‘battlefield shaper’

    Artillery is always fired first to start the battle and soften up the defenders. The defender uses it as well, but setting up massive artillery is not the point of defense.

    Well that new 6 IPC tank wont be in AA42, right! By the way your counting does not include the fact 6 IPCs of infantry can take two hits. A artillery and infantry combo cost 7 IPCs and have 4/4 and can take two hits vs a tank for 6 IPCs 3/3 move two. No boy, this will be another infantry push machanic, don’t you think. Otherwise one need combined arms for tanks and fighters, like my national advantage for Blitzkrieg. As I said before try it, then talk. I will try the tank at 6 IPCs, but some how it will need some changes in the start up for the units on the board.


  • Well.
    Defesive artillery isn’t necessary.


  • The new offensive abilities like tac bmr & mech inf in AA40 will tilt the advantage to the attacker.  Some type of def bonus to counter it will be needed. Making art more versatile is a good way to do it without adding new pieces. The pairing inf/art to achieve this goal has precedence and will be easy to implement. There are a few ways floating around to achieve it.

    1. This tread pairing inf/art giving inf +1 in def as well as offense is a good rule IMO.
    2. As read in another tread pairing inf/art allowing art to fire its 2 preempt (casualties don’t fire back) is also a good idea.
    3. I also like art being able to fire over boarders (maybe w/rocket tech) 1 for 1 w/inf going in.

    All in all there is a lot of talk about art, meaning many think there is room for improvement here. Much of it focuses on def against amp assault.  I just hope through testing and reading all these post (lot on Larry’s sight also) they do something here.


  • its become semi perminant in all my games that Arty defend pre-emptively on the first round of amphibious invasions. Gives them more defensive roles, counters the power of shore bombardment, and solves the “blockhouse” question nicely.

    For instance, in my games, Gibraltar starts with an artilery to simulate the fortress there, better than an infantry.


  • oztea,
    Yea I like that as well. With just some minor adjustments at set-up it seems to be very fitting. I was thinking in AA50 that def of shore lines is adequate, but was wondering if it should apply to all art in AA40. In AA40 your going to have much more fire power coming at you with the new units introduced. Being able to set up def on tt that don’t touch the sea may be necessary.


  • you could just have artilery fire preeptively on defense first round in land and amphibious battles
    or artilery defend preemptively on the first round when defending victory cites and amphibious invaisons
    but that might get too powerful

    People buy infantry as cheap defense and wound fodder
    people buy artilery to give their stacks a bigger punch
    people buy tanks for their speed and superior attack capiblities

    artilery deserves a second reason to purchase it, because it falls between tanks an ifantry in combat capiblities and cost, and already has a puropse on attack, making its defense better rounds it out as a great unit.

    my biggest fear is a german player putting 7 artilery in france, and making it untouchable, but then again thats semi-realistic, the bigger you make the atlantic wall, the harder it is to break

    and im not a fan of blockhouses, its just not a fun unit. and armies have divisons and corps of men, tanks planes, etc….not divisons of bunkers and forts, those come with the territory and have to be filled with men.

    Long story short…make arty more defensive…using the simplest method possible


  • I agree 100% art needs a boost defensively to keep its place in the game, especially with the new units introduced.

Suggested Topics

  • 3
  • 5
  • 12
  • 5
  • 11
  • 3
  • 4
  • 8
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures

35

Online

17.0k

Users

39.3k

Topics

1.7m

Posts