No scrambles
Ksmckay (Axis) vs Amon-Sul (Allies +17) BM3
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i asked gamerman a few days ago and he confirmed it.
but i dont have problem waiting for him to confirm again
cheers
its odd, but it can be done.
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is it legal for the soviets to enter burma before uk pacific is at war with japan?
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Wow that’s a good question. I assume Russia is at war with Japan because that’s required for them to enter China, so yes. UK is at war with Germany and Russia is at war with Japan, so Russia is at war on the Pacific map and is an ally of UK since Russia is at war with Japan. I’m playing my first game in 2 years, so there’s that caveat, but I believe this is correct
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That doesnt make sense as an answer. I wont hold the game up over this but
Russia is at war with Germany, US is at war with Germany, US is at war with Japan on pacific side of map, so Russia and US are at allies so US can land forces in russian territories.
Exact same argument. But that is clearly against the rules.
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@Krieghund Can Russia move into UK pac territories if UK pac hasnt declared war on Japan? (Japan and Russia are at war).
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We can wait for the rule confirmation.
As for triple part, this thing isnt mentioned in the
engine does not do list
So if i am wrong, then triple a is wrong too
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tripleA has some definite bugs and dealing with this issue for US/Russia is one of them - exact same scenario in my opinion. TripleA allows a number of different rule violations. (gets most of them right, so no complaining but far from perfect).
Im working on it but wont get to do the turn regardless till tonight. So as of right now its not holding things up.
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When not yet at war with Japan, in addition to the normal restrictions (see “Powers Not at War with One Another,” page 15) - page 38
When two powers on opposite sides are not yet at war with one another, they operate under some special conditions and restrictions.
Neutral Powers: When a power is not at war with anyone, it is neutral. While a power remains neutral, it operates under even tighter restrictions. A neutral power can’t move land or air units into or through neutral territories. It can’t move units into or through territories or onto ships belonging to another power or use another power’s naval bases, nor can another power move land or air units into or through its territories or onto its ships or use its naval bases.
- Page 15
Due to its separate treaties with Germany and Japan, the Soviet Union is in a unique position in its relationship with the Axis powers. As a result, if the Soviet Union is at war with Axis powers on only one map, it is still under the restrictions of being a neutral power (see “Powers Not at War with One Another,” page 15) on the other map. In other words, a state of war with Japan lifts those restrictions from the Soviet Union on the Pacific map only, and a state of war with Germany and/or Italy lifts those restrictions on the Europe map only.
Spelled out for soviets - fair since there is zero separation of powers - unlike UK/UK Pac which have some differences.
I can certainly see your move being legal, but I dont think its as obvious as you make it out to be. To me its the exact same scenario which is spelled out for the soviets. Perhaps since it isnt spelled out the same way for UK pac is evidence enough, but I still think there is a little uncertainty.
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No need to rush. We wait for the exp ones to give their comment
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It, seems that, for Soviets when they declare war or are in war on one theatre, they are allied with other allies there no matter if those allies are at, war with axis on that, side of the board
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@Amon-Sul said in Ksmckay (Axis) vs Amon-Sul (Allies +17) BM3:
It, seems that, for Soviets when they declare war or are in war on one theatre, they are allied with other allies there no matter if those allies are at, war with axis on that, side of the board
This is 100% wrong. It might only be wrong for the soviets though.
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maybe I misread that. that might be the case for the same side of the board, but definitely not the opposite side of the board.
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Either way I will proceed later tonight with Japan when I have time and just assume its legal. I just like to know these things so that when I decide your strategy is awesome and I try to adopt it, it doesnt get rejected later on.
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TripleA Turn Summary: Japanese round 3
TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 3.4
Game History
Round: 3 Purchase Units - Japanese Japanese buy 1 fighter and 10 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 6 SuicideAttackTokens; Politics - Japanese Japanese takes Political Action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Americans from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and British from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and UK_Pacific from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and ANZAC from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Dutch from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Germans and Americans from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Italians and Americans from Neutrality to War Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Americans from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and British from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and UK_Pacific from Concordant to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and ANZAC from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for British and Americans from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for UK_Pacific and Americans from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for ANZAC and Americans from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and French from Neutrality to Allied Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Allies from Neutrality to Friendly_Neutral Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Axis from Neutrality to Unfriendly_Neutral Trigger Russians Allied Americans 5: Changing Relationship for Russians and Americans from Neutrality to Allied Combat Move - Japanese Trigger Japanese Unrestricted Movement: Setting movementRestrictionTerritories cleared for rulesAttachment attached to Japanese 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 37 Sea Zone to 41 Sea Zone 1 infantry moved from 41 Sea Zone to Sumatra 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 37 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from 35 Sea Zone to Philippines 1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 36 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 42 Sea Zone to Java 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 36 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone 1 infantry moved from 43 Sea Zone to Borneo 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 34 Sea Zone to 44 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from 44 Sea Zone to Celebes 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 34 Sea Zone to Celebes 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 36 Sea Zone to Philippines 2 bombers moved from Kwangsi to Philippines 1 marine moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone 1 cruiser and 1 marine moved from 6 Sea Zone to 21 Sea Zone 1 marine moved from 21 Sea Zone to Guam 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone 1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 35 Sea Zone to Philippines 3 mech_infantrys moved from Kiangsu to Kwangtung 1 infantry moved from Kwangsi to Kwangtung 2 infantry moved from Hunan to Yunnan 1 infantry moved from Chahar to Suiyuyan Japanese take Suiyuyan from Chinese 1 fighter moved from Kwangsi to 44 Sea Zone 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 37 Sea Zone to Java 1 battleship and 1 cruiser moved from 37 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Kwangsi to Yunnan 2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from Anhwe to Japan 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Kwangsi to Kwangtung 2 fighters moved from Kwangsi to Kwangtung 1 tactical_bomber moved from Kwangsi to Yunnan 1 infantry moved from Anhwe to Hopei Japanese take Hopei from Chinese 1 infantry moved from Anhwe to Chahar 1 infantry moved from Siam to French Indo China Japanese take French Indo China from French Combat - Japanese Battle in Borneo Battle in Sumatra Battle in Guam Battle in 44 Sea Zone Japanese attack with 1 fighter and 1 transport ANZAC defend with 1 transport 1 transport owned by the ANZAC lost in 44 Sea Zone Japanese win, taking Borneo from UK_Pacific, taking Sumatra from UK_Pacific, taking Guam from Americans with 1 fighter and 1 transport remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7 Casualties for ANZAC: 1 transport Battle in Java Japanese attack with 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber ANZAC defend with 1 infantry Japanese roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 cruiser in Java, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 1.17 expected hits ANZAC roll dice for 1 infantry in Java, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the ANZAC lost in Java Japanese win, taking Java from ANZAC with 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for ANZAC: 1 infantry Battle in Kwangtung Japanese attack with 3 fighters, 1 infantry, 3 mech_infantrys and 1 tactical_bomber British defend with 2 infantry; UK_Pacific defend with 1 harbour Japanese roll dice for 3 fighters, 1 infantry, 3 mech_infantrys and 1 tactical_bomber in Kwangtung, round 2 : 5/8 hits, 2.83 expected hits UK_Pacific roll dice for 2 infantry in Kwangtung, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 2 infantry owned by the British lost in Kwangtung Japanese win, taking Kwangtung from UK_Pacific with 3 fighters, 3 mech_infantrys and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry Casualties for British: 2 infantry Battle in Philippines Japanese attack with 1 artillery, 2 bombers, 1 fighter, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber Americans defend with 1 airfield, 1 harbour and 2 infantry Japanese roll dice for 1 artillery, 2 bombers, 1 fighter, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in Philippines, round 2 : 5/8 hits, 3.50 expected hits Americans roll dice for 2 infantry in Philippines, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits 2 infantry owned by the Americans lost in Philippines Japanese win, taking Philippines from Americans with 1 artillery, 2 bombers, 1 fighter, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6 Casualties for Americans: 2 infantry Battle in Celebes Japanese attack with 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber ANZAC defend with 1 infantry Japanese roll dice for 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in Celebes, round 2 : 1/4 hits, 1.50 expected hits ANZAC roll dice for 1 infantry in Celebes, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the ANZAC lost in Celebes Japanese win, taking Celebes from ANZAC with 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for ANZAC: 1 infantry Battle in Yunnan Japanese attack with 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers Chinese defend with 1 infantry Japanese roll dice for 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers in Yunnan, round 2 : 0/5 hits, 2.00 expected hits Chinese roll dice for 1 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits Japanese roll dice for 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers in Yunnan, round 3 : 1/5 hits, 2.00 expected hits Chinese roll dice for 1 infantry in Yunnan, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Yunnan Japanese win, taking Yunnan from Chinese with 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for Chinese: 1 infantry Non Combat Move - Japanese 1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 1 submarine moved from 37 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 1 battleship moved from 36 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 1 carrier and 1 destroyer moved from 36 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 1 carrier and 1 destroyer moved from 34 Sea Zone to 44 Sea Zone 1 carrier and 1 submarine moved from 6 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 destroyer moved from 34 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 fighter moved from Kwangsi to 42 Sea Zone 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Java to 42 Sea Zone 1 fighter moved from 44 Sea Zone to 42 Sea Zone 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Celebes to 44 Sea Zone 1 infantry moved from Hunan to Anhwe 1 armour moved from Kwangsi to Hunan 1 armour and 1 mech_infantry moved from Hunan to Anhwe 2 artilleries and 3 infantry moved from Hunan to Kwangsi 1 artillery moved from Hunan to Kwangsi 2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Kwangtung to Kwangsi 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Philippines to 35 Sea Zone 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Yunnan to Kwangsi 2 bombers moved from Philippines to Kwangsi 2 infantry moved from Anhwe to Jehol 1 fighter moved from Kwangtung to Anhwe 1 tactical_bomber moved from Yunnan to Kwangsi Place Units - Japanese 3 infantry placed in Kiangsu 1 fighter and 7 infantry placed in Japan Turn Complete - Japanese Japanese collect 54 PUs; end with 54 PUs Objective Japanese 6 Home Islands: Japanese met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 57 PUs Objective Japanese 4 Control Dutch East Indies: Japanese met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 62 PUs
Combat Hit Differential Summary :
ANZAC : -0.67 Americans : -0.67 Chinese : -0.67 UK_Pacific : 0.33 Japanese : 1.00
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I was answering Amon’s questions by PM but didn’t know what game it was. I will review what you guys are saying and give you answers.
BM3 has special rules for Russia in Asia if they are not at war with Japan - they can only go into the middle east. Like I said, I’ll read what you guys are saying here now.
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@ksmckay said:
Russia is at war with Germany, US is at war with Germany, US is at war with Japan on pacific side of map, so Russia and US are at allies so US can land forces in russian territories.
Exact same argument. But that is clearly against the rules.
Russia has its own rules. In your example, the US may land forces in Russian territories, on the Pacific map only.
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@ksmckay said in Ksmckay (Axis) vs Amon-Sul (Allies +17) BM3:
@Krieghund Can Russia move into UK pac territories if UK pac hasnt declared war on Japan? (Japan and Russia are at war).
There is no such thing as UK Pac declaring war on Japan. UK (the whole board) is at war with Japan at game start.
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@ksmckay said in Ksmckay (Axis) vs Amon-Sul (Allies +17) BM3:
Spelled out for soviets - fair since there is zero separation of powers - unlike UK/UK Pac which have some differences.
I can certainly see your move being legal, but I dont think its as obvious as you make it out to be. To me its the exact same scenario which is spelled out for the soviets. Perhaps since it isnt spelled out the same way for UK pac is evidence enough, but I still think there is a little uncertainty.
You’re right, the Soviet’s diplomatic situation is unlike any other power’s. UK’s diplomacy is uniform for UK Europe, UK Pacific, and ANZAC at all times - the distinction of Europe map and Pacific map is for Soviets only. The UK’s division between maps is purely economic.
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~~Now the answer to your big question.
In BM3, Russia is allowed to move anywhere in Asia if they are at war with Japan. The UK starts the game at war with Japan. Russia and the UK are allies on the Pacific map once Russia is at war with Japan also. Russia can definitely move into Burma.~~
You need to make him pay for it with the Germans, though lol
Scratch this, I was confused. The Russians can’t move anything into Burma because Russia and the UK aren’t both at war with Japan. Those tanks will be a little closer to Moscow now, though, after Amon-Sul makes his corrections ;)
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@gamerman01 we are good, but you said a couple things that were clearly wrong but either way it’s all good
There is no such thing as UK Pac declaring war on Japan. UK (the whole board) is at war with Japan at game start.
Russia has its own rules. In your example, the US may land forces in Russian territories, on the Pacific map only.