13L Playoffs Hobo (axis) vs Gamerman01 (allies +12)

[gamerman01]

Well that’s a good change, 'cause you used to complain constantly  :-)

[boldfresh]

@Gamerman01:

Well that’s a good change, 'cause you used to complain constantly  :-)

exactly - major shift in perspective.

[hobo]

I always seems to deal with people who don’t work well with probability it seems.

The odds of that Italian bomber killing the cruiser without dying was 40%.  I took 1 less hit on z97 than average, or almost a 50/50 coin flip on the cruiser roll which would have been the 3rd hit to make “average” losses.

The odds of the first round for z110 where I only hit twice(2%) and you hit 5 out of 6(10%) combined is less than a 1% occurrence.  The odds of z109 where I lost 2 subs was a 5% occurrence.  The odds of all 3 Italian naval units missing on defense on the UK turn was an 10% occurrence.  The odds of all Japanese units missing in round 1 for Yunan was a 5% occurrence.  The odds of that happening again in the second round as well was less than a 0.5% occurrence.  Then the odds of China getting 6 hits! was a 0.1% occurrence.

When I start 10% battles and win, then I’ll say I was damn lucky.  Then again I don’t start 10% battles since I lose plenty of 80-90% battles as it is.  When the outcomes are 40-50% occurrences, not much else needs to be said.  This is not even discounting the fact that the odds are a consequence of cumulative events.  Had the Italians hit once in z97 or the Chinese not getting 6 hits, it would have changed subsequent events on counter attacks.

[gamerman01]

I don’t work well with probability?  That’s a laugher.

You look at median outcomes, but that is not the whole story.  There was a pretty significant chance of DISASTER in Z97.  And “1 or 2 hits” is HUGE when we’re talking German air!!

I understand cumulative effects just fine.  You are talking to one of the top players on the site.  I don’t win 90% of my games by being stupid about probability.  I will point out that I never said anything about you not understanding it.  You are also a top player on the site.

You complained about 0/4 naval hits on UK1, yet you turned around and drilled the cruiser in 96, nullifying that miss, and the fact that you only took 2 hits in 97 pretty much nullified the 2 misses there.

I’m not going to spend any more time talking probability with you.  You have displayed your misunderstandings about probability quite clearly when trying to explain SBR results.  I’ll be nice and just say we don’t look at it the same way.

All I was saying, very briefly in the first little complaint about you being silent when your luck turns, is that you had quite favorable results in several recent battles, yet…… silence.  That’s annoying, when you complain about every single time the luck goes against you, right from G1.

[gamerman01]

I think YOU don’t understand probability too well given the number and type of units you took into Z110 and at Hunnan.  Yes I got lucky in both battles, but you gave me too much chance to get lucky IMO.  You probably don’t lose 3 units in Hunnan and then the 4th on China’s turn, if you take in more available air.

But we’ll get on each other’s nerves real quick if we criticize each other.  This is the championship game and we’ve both proven ourselves over and over again, so this would be pretty silly.

ALL I was saying is that if you complain about every time you get below average results, you should acknowledge some of the above average results, or you will get on people’s nerves quickly.

[gamerman01]

So in short, quit complaining.  It’s disrespectful to your opponent.  I was very gracious through the first several turns, agreeing with you and even sympathizing with you about your bad luck, being a good sport.  If you can’t be a good sport, then I hope we can stop commenting altogether.  I prefer to play with interesting and fun comments, but with some people you just can’t do that.  All complaining and no acknowledging good luck - that’s not good sportsmanship.

[hobo]

Oh I didn’t know I was complaining.  I was merely pointing out freak low percentage occurrences that happened to me in succession.  If I was on the other end of that, I’ll be the first to acknowledge it.  Comparing 40-50% results to 1-2% results is like apples and oranges.  So I had a few coin flips go my way and the odds are even again?  Try adding the “average” ipc loses for all the battles so far and see who’s way ahead.  And if 1-2% freak results continue to happen against me, I’m going to continue to acknowledge it.  Had a 2% outcome, say for z110 where UK lost everything and Germany only lost 2 subs, I already know what would have been said.

All I said was that I wasn’t surprised anymore by those kinds of results.  You guys don’t know what real bitching is.  I remember a certain opponent whining for DAYS about how an initial 40% battle turned into a 10% battle in the second round yet he continued to roll the dice and of course things went horribly as they should if you initiate a 10% battle.  Or how about a certain opponent remembering what happened YEARS ago about a certain game.

Go look at all my games.  When something dramatic goes my way I admit it.  When I lose I admit it.  When someone outplayed me I admit it.  And sure when big battles go horribly against me, I’m going to comment on it.  I made a comment on the dice rolls.  Your comment was directed against a person.  So what’s good sportsmanship?

[Commando Brado]

Hobo, stop your whining! Honestly, Gamerman is right. You complain about every dice roll that doesn’t go your way and don’t acknowledge it when you get good dicing or justify your whining because you got a few bad dice rolls. Your lengthly explanations about your version of probability is boring and no one cares. If you lose because of extremely bad luck then explain your point graciously after the game is done. Don’t do so after every dice roll. You sound like we’re back in high school again.

And your comment about an opponent remembering a game years ago? Really? You’ve been complaining about games and your bad dicing for decades. And Gamerman’s comments about bad sportsmanship is spot on. Don’t complain and whine every single time. It’s exhausting and uncalled for. I could post many stories about your unsportsmanlike conduct in the past. I won’t. Just play the game and don’t complain/whine every single time, if you can help it. I mean all this as constructive criticism of course. LOL!  :-D  :wink:

[gamerman01]

Hobo, I appreciate your response.

I will point out that I never thought or said that the odds are even again.  I don’t think they are.  Pointing out that you were SILENT when getting obviously lucky results, after pointing out just about every single thing that went wrong for you, was my only point.  No personal attacks intended.

[hobo]

Brado is my life long troll  :lol:

[Commando Brado]

@hobo:

Brado is my life long troll  :lol:

That’s the best you can come up with? You suck with the zingers! Snooze! You can talk smack about me when you move out of daddy’s house and get a car. Are you still living in the garage? The movies Step Brothers and 40 Year Old Virgin come to mind when I think of you. LOL! If Gamerman wins you can give him one of the Madonna posters you had on your wall in college.  :-D  :-o  :lol:  :roll:  :wink:

[Guest]

@Boldfresh:

@Gamerman01:

Well that’s a good change, 'cause you used to complain constantly  :-)

exactly - major shift in perspective.

It is a change in behavior if you still complain about it, but wait till the end of the game to do it.

[boldfresh]

@Nozdormu:

@Boldfresh:

@Gamerman01:

Well that’s a good change, 'cause you used to complain constantly  :-)

exactly - major shift in perspective.

It is a change in behavior if you still complain about it, but wait till the end of the game to do it.

Is that a statement or a question?  Lol

I may still state that my luck was bad but I like to wait till the end because of the possibility of it changing.  It’s the most annoying when the guy that starts complaining up a storm ends up being more lucky overall.

[gamerman01]

I’m sorry, I’m unable to play during the day this week, and when I get home I’m exhausted.  Sorry about the delay - I may move tonight, tomorrow night, or Saturday…

[gamerman01]

Moving now

[gamerman01]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.8

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - Russians
            Russians buy 12 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs;

Combat Move - Russians

Non Combat Move - Russians
            6 infantry moved from Yakut S.S.R. to Yenisey
            2 aaGuns moved from Buryatia to Yakut S.S.R.
            1 cruiser and 1 submarine moved from 113 Sea Zone to 115 Sea Zone
            2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Russia to Novgorod
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Russia to Bryansk
            1 submarine moved from 111 Sea Zone to 125 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from Rostov to Ukraine
            3 artilleries moved from Ukraine to Western Ukraine
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Bryansk to Western Ukraine
            5 infantry moved from Novgorod to Belarus
            1 armour and 1 mech_infantry moved from Novgorod to Belarus
            1 aaGun moved from Bryansk to Ukraine
            3 infantry moved from Buryatia to Sakha
            1 infantry moved from Buryatia to Sakha
            8 infantry moved from Buryatia to Yakut S.S.R.
            1 mech_infantry moved from Bryansk to Belarus
            1 mech_infantry moved from Volgograd to Rostov
            1 aaGun moved from Belarus to Bryansk
            1 armour moved from Belarus to Bryansk
            11 infantry moved from Belarus to Bryansk
            1 artillery moved from Belarus to Novgorod
            1 armour moved from Belarus to Bryansk

Place Units - Russians
            3 infantry placed in Novgorod
            3 infantry placed in Ukraine
            6 infantry placed in Russia

Turn Complete - Russians
            Russians collect 36 PUs; end with 37 PUs total
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Changing PUs for Russians from 37 to 36
            EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from Ukraine: 1 infantry
            EDIT: Adding units owned by Russians to Ukraine: 1 artillery
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Removing units owned by Russians from Bryansk: 1 aaGun
            EDIT: Adding units owned by Russians to Ukraine: 1 aaGun
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

[hobo]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.8

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - Japanese
            Japanese buy 1 carrier, 1 destroyer, 1 infantry and 3 mech_infantrys; Remaining resources: 6 SuicideAttackTokens; 2 PUs;

Combat Move - Japanese
            1 infantry moved from Chahar to Suiyuyan
                  Japanese take Suiyuyan from Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Anhwe to Hopei
                  Japanese take Hopei from Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Anhwe to Kweichow
                  Japanese take Kweichow from Chinese
            1 artillery, 2 bombers, 2 fighters, 1 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers moved from Kwangsi to Yunnan
            2 infantry moved from Siberia to Soviet Far East
                  Japanese take Soviet Far East from Russians
            2 artilleries and 4 infantry moved from Anhwe to Hunan
            5 fighters and 4 tactical_bombers moved from Kiangsu to Yunnan

Combat - Japanese
            Battle in Hunan
                Japanese attack with 2 artilleries and 4 infantry
                Chinese defend with 1 infantry
                Japanese win, taking Hunan from Chinese with 2 artilleries and 4 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for Chinese: 1 infantry
            Battle in Yunnan
                Japanese attack with 1 artillery, 2 bombers, 7 fighters, 1 infantry and 6 tactical_bombers
                Chinese defend with 5 infantry
                Japanese win, taking Yunnan from Chinese with 1 artillery, 2 bombers, 6 fighters and 6 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is 2
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 fighter and 1 infantry
                Casualties for Chinese: 5 infantry

Non Combat Move - Japanese
            2 bombers moved from Yunnan to Kiangsu
            1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Kiangsu to 6 Sea Zone
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Chahar to Suiyuyan
            1 mech_infantry moved from Anhwe to Suiyuyan
            1 aaGun and 6 infantry moved from Jehol to Anhwe
            1 armour moved from Korea to Jehol
            4 infantry moved from Manchuria to Jehol
            1 aaGun moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            3 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            2 artilleries moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun, 2 artilleries, 3 infantry and 3 transports moved from 6 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun, 2 artilleries and 3 infantry moved from 36 Sea Zone to Kwangsi
            2 fighters moved from 36 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
            1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Yunnan to 36 Sea Zone
            5 fighters and 5 tactical_bombers moved from Yunnan to Kwangsi
            1 transport moved from 36 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from Siam to 37 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 37 Sea Zone to 36 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 36 Sea Zone to Kwangsi
            1 transport moved from 5 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Korea to 6 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 19 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 19 Sea Zone to Kiangsu

Place Units - Japanese
            1 carrier and 1 destroyer placed in 6 Sea Zone
            1 infantry placed in Japan
            3 mech_infantrys placed in Kiangsu

Turn Complete - Japanese
            Japanese collect 35 PUs; end with 37 PUs total
            Objective Japanese 1 Trade With America: Japanese met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 47 PUs

[gamerman01]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.8

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - Americans
            Americans buy 1 bomber, 1 destroyer, 3 infantry, 3 submarines and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Americans

Non Combat Move - Americans
            2 infantry moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
            2 aaGuns moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
            1 transport moved from 26 Sea Zone to 10 Sea Zone
            2 aaGuns, 2 infantry and 2 transports moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 28 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            3 aaGuns moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
            3 infantry moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
            1 cruiser moved from 28 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            1 submarine moved from 23 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 48 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            1 carrier moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
            1 mech_infantry moved from Central United States to Southeast Mexico
            1 artillery moved from Central United States to Western United States
            1 mech_infantry moved from Western United States to Southeast Mexico
            1 infantry moved from Central United States to Western United States
            1 fighter moved from Guam to 26 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Hawaiian Islands to 26 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Hawaiian Islands to Western United States

Place Units - Americans
            1 destroyer, 1 submarine and 1 transport placed in 101 Sea Zone
            2 submarines placed in 10 Sea Zone
            1 bomber placed in Western United States
            3 infantry placed in Central United States

Turn Complete - Americans
            Americans collect 52 PUs; end with 52 PUs total

[gamerman01]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.8

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - Chinese
            Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
            Chinese buy 5 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs;

Combat Move - Chinese
            2 infantry moved from Szechwan to Yunnan
            1 fighter moved from Shensi to Yunnan

Combat - Chinese
            Battle in Yunnan
                Chinese attack with 1 fighter and 2 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 artillery
                Chinese win, taking Yunnan from Japanese with 1 fighter and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 4
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 artillery

Non Combat Move - Chinese
            1 fighter moved from Yunnan to Szechwan
            2 infantry moved from Shensi to Szechwan

Place Units - Chinese
            5 infantry placed in Szechwan

Turn Complete - Chinese
            Chinese collect 6 PUs; end with 7 PUs total
            Objective Chinese 1 Burma Road: Chinese met a national objective for an additional 6 PUs; end with 13 PUs

[gamerman01]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.8

Game History

Round: 2

Purchase Units - British
            British buy 5 infantry and 3 transports; Remaining resources: 1 PUs;

Purchase Units - UK_Pacific
            UK_Pacific buy 1 armour and 1 fighter; Remaining resources: 1 PUs;

Combat Move - British
            1 submarine moved from 97 Sea Zone to 93 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer moved from 81 Sea Zone to 96 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Malta to 93 Sea Zone
            1 tactical_bomber moved from Malta to 96 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Malta to 98 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from India to 39 Sea Zone
            1 armour moved from India to 39 Sea Zone
            1 armour, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 39 Sea Zone to 76 Sea Zone
            1 armour and 1 infantry moved from 76 Sea Zone to Italian Somaliland
            1 battleship moved from 39 Sea Zone to 76 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Scotland to 109 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from United Kingdom to 109 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 109 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux
            3 fighters moved from United Kingdom to Normandy Bordeaux

Combat - British
            Battle in Normandy Bordeaux
                British attack with 3 fighters and 2 infantry
                Germans defend with 1 factory_minor, 1 harbour and 1 infantry
                British win, taking Normandy Bordeaux from Germans with 3 fighters and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry
                Casualties for British: 1 infantry
            Battle in Italian Somaliland
                British attack with 1 armour and 1 infantry
                Italians defend with 1 bomber
                British win, taking Italian Somaliland from Italians with 1 armour and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 12
                Casualties for Italians: 1 bomber
            Battle in 93 Sea Zone
                British attack with 1 bomber and 1 submarine
                Italians defend with 1 cruiser
                British win with 1 bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
                Casualties for British: 1 submarine
                Casualties for Italians: 1 cruiser
            Battle in 98 Sea Zone
                British attack with 1 fighter
                Italians defend with 1 transport
                British win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
                Casualties for Italians: 1 transport
            Battle in 96 Sea Zone
                British attack with 1 destroyer and 1 tactical_bomber
                Italians defend with 1 submarine
                retreated to 96 Sea Zone
                Italians win with 1 submarine remaining. Battle score for attacker is -8
                Casualties for British: 1 destroyer

Non Combat Move - British
            1 fighter moved from 98 Sea Zone to Egypt
            1 mech_infantry moved from Ethiopia to Egypt
            1 tactical_bomber moved from 96 Sea Zone to Egypt
            1 bomber moved from 93 Sea Zone to Malta
            2 artilleries moved from Ethiopia to Anglo Egyptian Sudan
            1 infantry moved from Rhodesia to Belgian Congo
            1 infantry moved from Rhodesia to Tanganyika Territory
            1 infantry moved from Eastern Persia to Persia
                  British take Persia from Neutral_Allies
            1 mech_infantry moved from India to Burma
            3 infantry moved from Malaya to Shan State
            1 submarine moved from 111 Sea Zone to 125 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Quebec to 106 Sea Zone
            1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 106 Sea Zone to 119 Sea Zone
            1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 119 Sea Zone to Scotland
            1 mech_infantry moved from Eire to United Kingdom
            3 fighters moved from Normandy Bordeaux to United Kingdom
            2 fighters moved from India to Burma
            1 destroyer moved from 71 Sea Zone to 78 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from United Kingdom to Scotland

Place Units - British
            1 transport placed in 71 Sea Zone
            1 infantry placed in Union of South Africa
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
            1 transport placed in 109 Sea Zone
            1 transport placed in 110 Sea Zone
            4 infantry placed in United Kingdom

Turn Complete - British
            British collect 32 PUs; end with 33 PUs total

Place Units - UK_Pacific
            1 armour and 1 fighter placed in India

Turn Complete - UK_Pacific
            UK_Pacific collect 17 PUs; end with 18 PUs total
            Some Units in India change ownership: 1 armour and 1 fighter