GenCon Indy 2012

[Gargantua]

Will you write a check for the clocks?

You know what. YES. I would cut the cheque and pay the bill.

Provided you actually listen to fan input, instead of -relegating- people to the “suggestion box”. Hold me to it.

From what I can tell, apparently speaking in person about the tourney style is a totally unacceptable form of communication, and damned is anyone who tries to encourage change.

Writing online also seems to ill-advised as anyone who DARES to have another opinion should be overlooked or invalidated, because their paperwork didn’t make it to the “suggestion box” at the event.

It’s clear from the history of the tourney, and it’s attendee’s, limited interest and ear is being lent to the players. Not when Pride is on the line. (Infact, from what I’ve read here, only -eye- is lent to written submission, everything else is veto’d irregardless of content)

Maybe we’re wrong, maybe Smorey does have it figured all out perfectly, but maybe it’s time to try it differently?

Regardless of how you slice the cake, GENERATING INTEREST in GEN CON should be the primary objective of the pre tourney-effort, not pigeon-holing play style, and excluding/belittling alternate opinions.

What a great way to treat people.

In my -obviously- worthless opinion, the tournament should suit the players/attendee’s, not the other way around.  I hope someone prints that and puts it in the “suggestion box” for me.

[squirecam]

http://www.nextag.com/chess-clocks/stores-html

Theres the website.

You can order 30 clocks or cut a check for the cost plus shipping.

After delivery I’d be happy to discuss your suggestions personally and in detail.

[Gargantua]

Just 30 clocks will do?

Am I allowed to advertise on them?

[DizzKneeLand33]

Seriously, $1000 that is “reusable” every year (we used to beat the hell out of the clocks during blitz and they still survived – how many times would it be touched during AA50?) doesn’t seem that unreasonable.

But, I have a cheaper idea.

My cell phone comes with a stopwatch (I time my grilling by it).  How about yours?

[Asterios]

Think 30 clocks is overkill since that would indicate you get 60 players for the event, I’m thinking more like half or less, 15 clocks would be more then well enough, since with the attitudes being shown by the event coordinator is not winning over many people (especially on the forums here) to go to the con and play.

[DizzKneeLand33]

Or if the event is 2 v 2, that would infer 120 players for the event….

[Gargantua]

I’ve sources some clocks as cheap as $15.

DizzKneeLand is also correct too, there’s probably an APP for that.  Or a program people could use on a laptop.  Or a walmart watch.

I could also possibly secure a corporate sponsor, IF that’s allowed.  Or maybe I’ll just put my face all over them. :D

If we buy these clocks, it’s then implied that you MUST use them?  As there is no sense in buying something that won’t be used.  What are your thoughts/comments Squire?

[squirecam]

If someone actually invests in clocks for everyone, custom/face painted/advertised or not, I’d say they should be tried.

Whatever is used though must be uniform. Cant have people using “watches” or “phones” or trust me I’m keeeping a written sheet…Which is why chess clocks would be uniform and not able to be manipulated.

Of course, until I actually saw said clocks, I’d be skeptical.

[squirecam]

@DizzKneeLand33:

Or if the event is 2 v 2, that would infer 120 players for the event….

IIRC, GC Milwaukee used to draw 54+ unique teams. So its not unheard of in the past.

Dont think AA42 second ed will garner that record though. Due to limited edition of AA50, that also would never hit 50 teams, cause many people dont even have the game.

BTW, I do have a mint sealed spare copy. Sincere offers always accepted.

[Gargantua]

Trade you your copy for some clocks? :P

How much does Gencon cost to attend?  and how many people/teams does it usually see?

[Imperious Leader]

You don’t need to waste so much on these Chess clocks because you only need a timer for making moves only not out of a larger time allotment.

Poker timers cost $10 each and are digital. Just reset it every combat move.

here is one for under 3$!

http://www.discountcasinogear.com/Official-Poker-Tournament-Timer-p/1274.htm?utm_source=google+product&utm_medium=versafeed&utm_term=1274&utm_campaign=toys+games+game+timers&utm_content=official+poker+tournament+timer&v_traceback=c0718_0730_f0718_0756&Click=13965&gclid=COq3iOOzqbECFYUaQgodJQYA5A

[squirecam]

@DizzKneeLand33:

So far, I’ve played 6 PBEM games of AA50-41 in my life, and here are the results:

One non-league game:  11 rounds, opponent resigned when Germany fell

League game 1:  12 rounds, opponent resigned when Russia fell
League game 2:  6 rounds (opponent resigned early)
League game 3:  currently in the 17th round
League game 4:  currently in the 23rd round
League game 5:  currently in the 20th round

Quite frankly, I don’t see how a quality game of AA50 (at least the 1941 setup) could end consistently in 7 rounds.  The game is too full of possibilities.  Therefore, it must be very difficult to come up with tourney rules to shorten the game.

Let me address this for a moment. Some of you may be familiar with a group of folk who used to frequent the “caspian sub” forum. Back in the day, these gamers used to guarantee lots of things, some which they could back up and some not. But what they did have was a “math” scheme to get the allies into france for good by turns 5-7, or USSR defeated by then. Not saying they were right, but by turn 6-8 you did have a good idea which side was ahead.  That game being revised. Now, I have had revised games that went 20+ turns too.

I’m not saying AA50 can be determined in 6 rounds. But with a 42 start you can get a good judge of how the game is going after 7 rounds.

But AA50 requires a “winner”. which makes it simple. Allies have 10 VC. If they dont lose one when time is called, they win. That’s why the axis gets a bid of units, because they have to win the game in that span.

[squirecam]

@Gargantua:

Trade you your copy for some clocks? :P

How much does Gencon cost to attend?  and how many people/teams does it usually see?

This really depends on your # of friends. Because the badge is like $60 for the 4 days. The hotel bill though will be expensive if its just you. You wont find one cheaper than $140 a night anywhere close to the con, and thats through the housing block. If you would drive and stay at the airport its cheaper.

[DizzKneeLand33]

Did Larry Harris state that you have to be “guaranteed” to get anywhere by turn 5-7?  10 VC’s is simply madness.  At LEAST make it 12, like the bare bones minimum of the rules.  And, all of the games (of my own) that I reference are here on our website under league or casual PBF games, so indeed no “BS” there with regard to my comments….

[DizzKneeLand33]

@squirecam:

But what they did have was a “math” scheme to get the allies into france for good by turns 5-7, or USSR defeated by then. Not saying they were right, but by turn 6-8 you did have a good idea which side was ahead. � That game being revised. Now, I have had revised games that went 20+ turns too.

I’m not saying AA50 can be determined in 6 rounds. But with a 42 start you can get a good judge of how the game is going after 7 rounds.

So, in essence, you are a gaming god then.

For, it’s quite humourous your quote.  One of my games is with me as the Allies, where Russia fell a LONG, LONG time ago, and I have never stepped a TOE into France.  And yet…. I think that I’m at least equal, if not a bit up.

Granted, Japan has about 957 fighters (or maybe just 34), but nothing else…

So, at GenCon you would have declared me the loser 13 turns ago… I would have spent travel money and money to get into the convention to have you tell me I’m the loser, since I didn’t get into France by round 7 and Russia has fallen…

LMFAO.

Italy owns Russia, Germany owns Arch, Japan owns Urals.  And yet… it’s still an AWESOME game.  Glad souL and I didn’t play our game at GenCon…

[squirecam]

@DizzKneeLand33:

@squirecam:

But what they did have was a “math” scheme to get the allies into france for good by turns 5-7, or USSR defeated by then. Not saying they were right, but by turn 6-8 you did have a good idea which side was ahead. �� That game being revised. Now, I have had revised games that went 20+ turns too.

I’m not saying AA50 can be determined in 6 rounds. But with a 42 start you can get a good judge of how the game is going after 7 rounds.

So, in essence, you are a gaming god then.

For, it’s quite humourous your quote.  One of my games is with me as the Allies, where Russia fell a LONG, LONG time ago, and I have never stepped a TOE into France.  And yet…. I think that I’m at least equal, if not a bit up.

Granted, Japan has about 957 fighters (or maybe just 34), but nothing else…

So, at GenCon you would have declared me the loser 13 turns ago… I would have spent travel money and money to get into the convention to have you tell me I’m the loser, since I didn’t get into France by round 7 and Russia has fallen…

LMFAO.

Italy owns Russia, Germany owns Arch, Japan owns Urals.  And yet… it’s still an AWESOME game.  Glad souL and I didn’t play our game at GenCon…

I was never a part of that group nor did I believe that they had an infallible system. That was also for revised and not AA50.

[djensen]

I don’t think generating interest at GenCon is a problem. It’s an enormous convention.

There are more factors at play here. One thing is that what Larry says for tournament rules goes. Next, the tournaments at GenCon are huge (from my understanding) and the budget is limited to what WotC provides for games and prizes, chess clocks not being one of those things. Another thing is that there are beginners (as compared to us) and, if you want to promote the game, they should NOT be alienated. Next, there is a limited amount of time to play in a face-to-face tournament. Finally, Greg has 19+ years of experience which gives him good wisdom about running a tournament but he knows he doesn’t have all the answers.

If we want to engage in a discussion about face-to-face tournament rules, it needs to be civilized. Don’t go around name calling or making assumptions about why or why not something is the way it is. You can’t start off by saying, “your rules completely suck.”

To this end, I would like to start a thread about tournament rules in the appropriate forum. In this discussion, there will be armchair comments and comments from those who actually played with the tournament rules.

@Gargantua:

Will you write a check for the clocks?

You know what. YES. I would cut the cheque and pay the bill.

Provided you actually listen to fan input, instead of -relegating- people to the “suggestion box”. Hold me to it.

From what I can tell, apparently speaking in person about the tourney style is a totally unacceptable form of communication, and damned is anyone who tries to encourage change.

Writing online also seems to ill-advised as anyone who DARES to have another opinion should be overlooked or invalidated, because their paperwork didn’t make it to the “suggestion box” at the event.

It’s clear from the history of the tourney, and it’s attendee’s, limited interest and ear is being lent to the players. Not when Pride is on the line. (Infact, from what I’ve read here, only -eye- is lent to written submission, everything else is veto’d irregardless of content)

Maybe we’re wrong, maybe Smorey does have it figured all out perfectly, but maybe it’s time to try it differently?

Regardless of how you slice the cake, GENERATING INTEREST in GEN CON should be the primary objective of the pre tourney-effort, not pigeon-holing play style, and excluding/belittling alternate opinions.

What a great way to treat people.

In my -obviously- worthless opinion, the tournament should suit the players/attendee’s, not the other way around. � I hope someone prints that and puts it in the “suggestion box” for me.

[Gargantua]

So, if I were you (Gargantua), and that would never happen, I would just come to GEN CON, play and see how competent you really are at playing the basics of AA whatever version. Because if you can’t win playing the basics, how competent do your really think you are playing in any rules set of AA?  It think maybe you should start with the 1941 game…that might get you a win here or there…

Greg Smorey

Well here’s one for the records folks.

GLOBAL 1940 ALPHA 3.9+ via TRIPLE-A
Gen con (MiamiUmike) -VS- AA.org (Gargantua)

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=27887.45

Gen Con surrenders US #2

Greg has 19+ years of experience which gives him good wisdom

That’s probably so, but I hope this year he’s learned humility, and to treat AA.org’ers/online-gamers with more respect and dignity.

[Gargantua]

P.S. For the Record, Mike is a decent guy, and we had an excellent game going until he let it slip! :S

I am looking forward to a rematch if he is. He’s creative and despite the showing - has definetly tasted battle before.  I regret automatically prejudging him earlier in this thread.  I hope he sticks around AA.org for alot longer!

[questioneer]

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