13L G40 Boldfresh (Allies +12) vs. Me1945

[Me1945]

Thanks arathorn for your opinion. I’d add that Bold treats posting a scramble decision as a dice roll. It’s somewhere in his game with Cow thread.

2 Bold: the game cant be friendly after the unfriendly tournament game with you particularly after your refusal to adjust our ANZAC NCM.

[seth4god]

@Me1945:

Thanks arathorn for your opinion. I’d add that Bold treats posting a scramble decision as a dice roll. It’s somewhere in his game with Cow thread.

2 Bold: the game cant be friendly after the unfriendly tournament game with you particularly after your refusal to adjust our ANZAC NCM.

Well, both of you have edited your moves in this game (Bold moreso than you). And Bold DID tell you he was changing things around and this was your response.

@Me1945:

No problem. Take your time.

You can’t say that there’s no issue with it ahead of time and then go back and complain that Bold shouldn’t be able to do it. I’d be in your camp had you not posted that or if he’d just arbitrarily made the edits. But he posted what he was wanting to do in general terms and you ok’d it. The only issue I see here is he didn’t ask for scramblers the second time around. But he did say that you could make that decision and roll combat if that’s what you wanted to do. Otherwise, I think everything is on the up and up.

[Me1945]

I am unable to ok any changes before I see what my opponent exactly is doing. Note, no a new file attached. My No problem. Take your time post is strictly related to his previous post where he asks for thinking longer. Would you confirm what even your opponent doesn’t know for sure?

[boldfresh]

@Me1945:

Thanks arathorn for your opinion. I’d add that Bold treats posting a scramble decision as a dice roll. It’s somewhere in his game with Cow thread.

2 Bold: the game cant be friendly after the unfriendly tournament game with you particularly after your refusal to adjust our ANZAC NCM.

That was specific to the cow game since it was as far from a friendly game as possible.  Even then I would have allowed them to change as long as they were bringing less not more.

Clearly you have been laying in wait for me since our tourney game.  And just so you know, I was for allowing you to change your move.  Dutch was adamant however and since it was his theater he had the ruling.

[seth4god]

But that inherently means that you were ok with the fact that he was going to be making changes to his combat moves after he’d asked for and gotten a scramble decision. And your beef with his move is that he made changes . . .

[boldfresh]

Other than you looking to try and pin something unjust on me since you feel I did it to you, what do you think the merits would be of denying the changed move where no dice were rolled and the attack in the zone of scramble was not substantially changed?  You dont have any problem with the added combatoves or do you?  Also, are you attempting to say that the walkins (as every land battle was) should not be allowd to change due to the fact that you gave a simple scramble choice which was clearly no chance of being a scramble in either case?

[Me1945]

Bold, you broke the rules. Combat goes after scramble, not CM adjustments. I did a favor for you before allowing some changes after rolling, but not in this case. What I am definitely NOT going to do is having any theoretical discussion with you.
Btw, if what Garg says is true, we are just waisting the time.

[seth4god]

The axis DON’T have the needed VCs for a win.

[boldfresh]

What do you mean about what garg says?  He says let your opponent play at their best game… so what are u concluding from that?

[boldfresh]

@seththenewb:

The axis DON’T have the needed VCs for a win.

Exactly seth.  It wasnt until me realized this (I told him) that he raised the stink.  :wink:

[seth4god]

@Boldfresh:

What do you mean about what garg says?� He says let your opponent play at their best game… so what are u concluding from that?

I think he was referring to the victory conditions?

[boldfresh]

So what are you saying you want to allow Me?  I mean, exactly what ARE you saying?   :roll: :lol:

[seth4god]

@Boldfresh:

@seththenewb:

The axis DON’T have the needed VCs for a win.

Exactly seth.� It wasnt until me realized this (I told him) that he raised the stink.� �:wink:

To be fair to Me, he’d already ‘raised a stink’ before you mentioned your sneaky Russian inf.

[boldfresh]

No first thing he said is “lets me make sure I understand the victory conditions (which I had been hinting at) before I raise a stink”  :wink:

[boldfresh]

@Me1945:

There are a couple issues with the turns you just posted. Before I bring the issues to the thread that I don’t like to do, let me ask you a question to make sure we are in the same page.
GLOBAL RULES:
How the War is Won
The Axis wins the game by controlling either any 8 victory cities on the Europe map or any 6 victory cities on the Pacific map for a complete round of play, as long as they control an Axis capital (Berlin, Rome, or Tokyo) at the end of that round.

I took the 8th VC in J6 and control the capitals. So, the game is over if Allies fail to take one of the Europe VCs I control now or Tokyo by the end of Rus 7 when the round of play is completed, right?

Not too hard to read between the lines.  :lol:

[seth4god]

Ok, true. I’ll give you that one. But we still need to wait for a league mod to voice in.

[boldfresh]

Bottom line he was fine allowing me to redo the turn (as any reasonably experienced player would be) until he realized he didnt have the game won, at which point he decided to start grasping at rule technicalities in a (lame) attempt to save his hide.   :wink:

[boldfresh]

jenn and gamer where are you?    :-)

[gamerman01]

@seththenewb:

Ok, true. I’ll give you that one. But we still need to wait for a league mod to voice in.

There’s only 1 league moderator, and that’s Cmdr Jenn, so you guys will have to get her ruling unless you come to a mutual agreement yourselves.

I read the discussion from today, but haven’t looked back at what actually happened.  Anyway, I’m not going to pick a side (yet, anyway) because I don’t completely understand what exactly happened.

It sounds like there was a scrambling decision made by Me, and then after that, Bold noticed some walkins that he wanted to do?  And then didn’t re-confirm the scrambling decision?  And then Me is protesting that he should have been asked again for the scrambling decision because the combat move had been changed (possibly a valid protest depending on what walkins we’re talking about here), so he is wanting to disallow the walkins because he wasn’t given another opportunity to confirm the scramble decision?

Is the above paragraph accurate so far?
Which territories were walked into after the initial scrambling decision?
Isn’t the solution to allow the walkins because no dice had been rolled when the walkin decision was made (a little late, but before dice), and allow Me to change the scrambling decision if he wants, and if dice have been rolled after Bold assumed no change in the scramble decision, to ignore those dice and re-roll?
Or is there a relevant fact that I haven’t listed above?

[seth4god]

There’s a couple things that I think are relevant that you didn’t touch on.

1. In a series of rapid posts, Bold stated a couple different changes and then just said he was going to redo his move.

2. Me initially Ok’d edits after Bold said he’d redo the move. Now Me’s saying he was only okaying them provisionally and wanted to know what edits Bold was making. However he doesn’t make that clear at all in his post that simply says “No problem. Take your time.” I don’t know what he meant when he posted that. But it does seem to give Bold an ok to make the changes he posted and doesn’t indicate that he’d have any issues with anything.

3. Bold didn’t bring ftr/tac to sz112 for the redo. So you could argue that the scramble equation changed. So now it was 2 dd, 3ca, bb vs potentially 2ftrs instead of 2dd, 3ca, ftr, tac, bb vs the 2 ftrs. Still not great odds to that scramble.

4. Bold landed heavily in Algeria and to a lesser extent Morocco instead of Denmark and added a combat of ss, dd, tac vs ca in the med.

The only reason I’m leaning towards Bold in this one is because of #2 above