This babarossa deployment map and what to do with it


  • 2017 2016 2015 Organizer '14 Customizer '13 '12 '11 '10

    http://www.krunch.ru/map2015.php

    This map shows by every unit where it was deployed by both sides on June 22, 1941


  • Customizer

    Hard to credit that Stalin refused to believe the Germans were preparing to attack. He insisted it was just a ruse by Churchill to get Russia into the war.



  • @Flashman:

    Hard to credit that Stalin refused to believe the Germans were preparing to attack. He insisted it was just a ruse by Churchill to get Russia into the war.

    I guess Stalin had watched how Churchill had lured Poland and Norway into war, and was afraid he was next.


  • 2017 2016 2015 Organizer '14 Customizer '13 '12 '11 '10

    Yea Churchill was worse than Hitler and Vlad the impaler



  • No, I did not say he was worse than Adolf, I said ha had a habit to get others in trouble, big difference. My apologies for highjacking your thread


  • 2016

    @Narvik:

    No, I did not say he was worse than Adolf, I said ha had a habit to get others in trouble, big difference. My apologies for highjacking your thread

    How did Churchill drag Poland into a war?
    The whole war in Europe started with Hitler declaring war on Poland over Danzig.



  • OMG dont derail this thread any more, if you are unsure what the topic is, read the headline. If you want to discuss Poland, start a new thread


  • 2016

    @Narvik:

    OMG dont derail this thread any more, if you are unsure what the topic is, read the headline. If you want to discuss Poland, start a new thread

    (You mentioned Poland first.) cough



  • I know, but I were responding to Flashmans post, before I suddenly realized, with a chill down my back, that the topic of this thread is Barbarossa. To follow up the Poland issue will be as good as flame baiting, so please start a new thread if you want to pursuit Poland. IMHO. No offense


  • Customizer

    Churchill wasn’t evil he was incredibly lucky. He got Britain involved in a war (with Germany) it couldn’t possibly win but ended up on the winning side because:

    1. Finland surrendered to Russia just 2 days before British troops were due to land in Finland to fight the Red army, thus he avoided being at war with both Hitler and Stalin simultaneously (we’ll ignore the fact that Britain declared war on Germany for invading Poland, but not on Russia when it did the same thing).

    2. Hess landed in the wrong place in Scotland and thus got arrested before he could make contact with the anti-Churchill peace faction (WC was very unpopular at this time).

    3. Hitler stopped his armour short of Dunkirk to allow the British army an escape, hoping this would bring about peace.

    4. Hitler and Stalin fell out and attacked each other rather than keeping to the terms of their treaty (which involved partitioning the British Empire).

    5. Japan attacked America thus bringing the US into the war.

    6. Hitler decided to declare war on America thus bringing about American intervention in Europe.

    So WC was able to ride to victory despite the poor performance of British armed forces and his own less than brilliant military strategy.

    By the by, he also won an election in 1950 with fewer votes than the opposition a la Trump.

    Further, he escaped blame for starting WWI despite the fact that he, more than anyone, tricked the British government into going ahead with a conflict that could still have been prevented.



  • Interesting to see how the German/Axis deployment in the southern sector looks sparse, at first glance. Maybe key to why Army Group South struggled more than the other two did in the early stages? That and the Soviet commander of the Southwest Front (Kirponos) being more competent than the other four?


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