Worst Alpha Modifications



  • Wow, well I’ve always played that the aa gun fires for each ‘class’ of air.  So you roll dice for ftrs, then for tacs, then for bmbs to see which aircraft were shot down……now were talking about land battles and not SBRs correct?


  • Customizer

    @JimmyHat:

    Wow, well I’ve always played that the aa gun fires for each ‘class’ of air.  So you roll dice for ftrs, then for tacs, then for bmbs to see which aircraft were shot down……now were talking about land battles and not SBRs correct?

    Yes, this is strictly land battles, not SBRs.  All facilities have their own built in AA defenses and thus have their own rules as to how to employ them.  The AA Guns that we place on the board are only involved in actual land battles between the military units.
    Also JimmyHat, you were doing it correctly by rolling for each class of aircraft through Alpha+2.  Up through Alpha+2, we just had 1 AA gun that got a shot at each attacking aircraft and you were supposed to roll by type of aircraft (roll for fighters, roll for tacs, roll for bombers).  Now in Alpha+3, we have multiple AA Guns that are limited to 3 shots per gun, or total number of planes whichever is less (Example:  7 planes attack 3 AA guns, AA guns only get 7 shots, not 9).  Also, now you simply roll for ALL aircraft attacking and any hits are designated by the attacker.  So, unless you have a REALLY lucky roll, odds are you will not hit a strategic bomber unless that is the only aircraft the attacker is bringing to battle.



  • Ugh, thats a punch in the guts.  The only way to hit bmbs used to be the aa gun….now there is no way.



  • knp’s right, Jen.
    Before Alpha 3, every single attacking plane had an equal chance to be shot down; the attacker could not choose losses to AA.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @JimmyHat:

    Ugh, thats a punch in the guts.  The only way to hit bmbs used to be the aa gun….now there is no way.

    Aye.  That’s the idea.  You can even insulate yourself against facility AA Guns by bringing Tactical Bombers in to soak hits on “their” runs against a base so you could preserve your strategic bombers.


  • Customizer

    @Cmdr:

    Aye.  That’s the idea.  You can even insulate yourself against facility AA Guns by bringing Tactical Bombers in to soak hits on “their” runs against a base so you could preserve your strategic bombers.

    That’s only if you bring both Tacs and Strats to attack a base, right?  In SBRs against ICs, you can only have Strategic bombers so any AA hits will take out a strategic bomber.

    By the way, how many of you SBR air or naval bases?  How often?  We don’t SBR very often, and when we do it’s always against ICs.  I don’t think we have EVER SBRed an air or naval base.  Never really see a reason to do so.  Yeah, it would be nice to eliminate the repairing ability and extra move of a naval base or to eliminate the extra move and scrambling ability of an air base.  I guess since we don’t end up doing a whole lot of SBRs, when we do we want to concentrate on the enemy’s production capabilities rather than the perks given by bases.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Against England?  I do it on Round 2 EVERYTIME.  2 Tacticals to the Airbase, 2 Strategics to the Complex.  That way I have great odds of doing 12 damage to England and losing an 11 IPC tactical bomber.


  • Customizer

    @Cmdr:

    Against England?  I do it on Round 2 EVERYTIME.  2 Tacticals to the Airbase, 2 Strategics to the Complex.  That way I have great odds of doing 12 damage to England and losing an 11 IPC tactical bomber.

    Do you do that before attacking the Royal Navy (paricularly SZ 110) so England can’t scramble?  You know what?  That’s a pretty good idea.  I always want to sink the Royal Navy as Germany but have so much trouble because UK scrambles and I end up losing a lot of planes.  Maybe better to go after the airbases first then attack the navy next round.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @knp7765:

    @Cmdr:

    Against England?  I do it on Round 2 EVERYTIME.  2 Tacticals to the Airbase, 2 Strategics to the Complex.  That way I have great odds of doing 12 damage to England and losing an 11 IPC tactical bomber.

    Do you do that before attacking the Royal Navy (paricularly SZ 110) so England can’t scramble?  You know what?  That’s a pretty good idea.  I always want to sink the Royal Navy as Germany but have so much trouble because UK scrambles and I end up losing a lot of planes.  Maybe better to go after the airbases first then attack the navy next round.

    No, the Royal navy is dead.  I don’t need any fighters or bombers for France anymore, it’s a pushover and I usually get at least France and W. France without any aircraft help, sometimes if I feel high and mighty, I take S. France too.

    It’s round 2 attack because I need the airforce for round 1.  Smack the crud out of England on Round 2 so they can’t build as much and then pull out on round 3 so they get a nice, fat paycheck for you to take round 4.  Since on Round 4 everyone can attack anyway, there’s no deterrant.



  • When you SBR the industrial complex the aa gun rolls independently of the naval/air base aa gun. So when you SBR an IC you do risk your SB from being taken as a casualty


  • Customizer

    @Cmdr:

    No, the Royal navy is dead.  I don’t need any fighters or bombers for France anymore, it’s a pushover and I usually get at least France and W. France without any aircraft help, sometimes if I feel high and mighty, I take S. France too.

    It’s round 2 attack because I need the airforce for round 1.  Smack the crud out of England on Round 2 so they can’t build as much and then pull out on round 3 so they get a nice, fat paycheck for you to take round 4.  Since on Round 4 everyone can attack anyway, there’s no deterrant.

    I see now.  By round 4, even if the Russians do attack you have enough stuff along the border that they won’t get very far while you are finishing off England.  Then on round 5, you have all those lovely British Pounds to spend and really focus your attention on the Red Menace. 
    So you don’t try to convoy raid them with your subs, right?  Just pound their factories, let them spend money on repairs which of course means less on units, then collect a full income for you to take round 4.  Good thinking!


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @knp7765:

    @Cmdr:

    No, the Royal navy is dead.  I don’t need any fighters or bombers for France anymore, it’s a pushover and I usually get at least France and W. France without any aircraft help, sometimes if I feel high and mighty, I take S. France too.

    It’s round 2 attack because I need the airforce for round 1.  Smack the crud out of England on Round 2 so they can’t build as much and then pull out on round 3 so they get a nice, fat paycheck for you to take round 4.  Since on Round 4 everyone can attack anyway, there’s no deterrant.

    I see now.  By round 4, even if the Russians do attack you have enough stuff along the border that they won’t get very far while you are finishing off England.  Then on round 5, you have all those lovely British Pounds to spend and really focus your attention on the Red Menace. 
    So you don’t try to convoy raid them with your subs, right?  Just pound their factories, let them spend money on repairs which of course means less on units, then collect a full income for you to take round 4.  Good thinking!

    Do neither on round 3.  You want that pretty paycheck.

    Then you can transport all those pretties back home.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    And in India, if you have to trade 3-5 aircraft to get it prior to USA coming into the war, it’s worth the investment!  No England anywhere on the map = yummy!



  • @Cmdr:

    @JimmyHat:

    Ugh, thats a punch in the guts.  The only way to hit bmbs used to be the aa gun….now there is no way.

    Aye.  That’s the idea.  You can even insulate yourself against facility AA Guns by bringing Tactical Bombers in to soak hits on “their” runs against a base so you could preserve your strategic bombers.

    Awesome, the best unit in the game…has the most movement, can hit sea and air, and rolls a 4…cannot be taken down!  I think Larry needs to add more bmb’s then!  Lets do 4 per country and see how many get shot down over the course of a game.

    I am feeling totally lost because what I assume was a great game is turning into this pile of muck that smells awful and isnt pretty to look at.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Actually, I like the bombers and AA Gun changes…I dont like all the units they took away from England it’s almost as if Larry WANTs England totally removed from the game before anyone can do anything to help them.

    I’d, personally, take Alpha 2 but with the AA Gun changes.

    @JimmyHat:

    @Cmdr:

    @JimmyHat:

    Ugh, thats a punch in the guts.  The only way to hit bmbs used to be the aa gun….now there is no way.

    Aye.  That’s the idea.  You can even insulate yourself against facility AA Guns by bringing Tactical Bombers in to soak hits on “their” runs against a base so you could preserve your strategic bombers.

    Awesome, the best unit in the game…has the most movement, can hit sea and air, and rolls a 4…cannot be taken down!  I think Larry needs to add more bmb’s then!  Lets do 4 per country and see how many get shot down over the course of a game.

    I am feeling totally lost because what I assume was a great game is turning into this pile of muck that smells awful and isnt pretty to look at.


  • Customizer

    @Cmdr:

    Actually, I like the bombers and AA Gun changes…I dont like all the units they took away from England it’s almost as if Larry WANTs England totally removed from the game before anyone can do anything to help them.

    I’d, personally, take Alpha 2 but with the AA Gun changes.

    You know what, I tend to agree with you for the most part.  Alpha +2 was a really good setup.  I don’t like that they weakend France so much.  There should be some British units in France and Normandy.  Also, I still don’t like the wording of the new Soviet NO, but we won’t get into that again.
    However, I do like the new AA Gun rules of Alpha+3.  I also like the new Italian setup, mainly spreading out the fleet a little and putting both Italian fighters on the air base.  I do like that Germany gets an extra bomber and tank, but I also agree that perhaps Sealion is somewhat too easy now.  Just not sure how would be the best way to change that.
    One other thing I DON"T like about Alpha+3 setup is losing 2 airbases for UK.  Don’t really care about the one on Malta, but Gibraltar should definitely have an airbase.



  • I totally agree with you,knp7765


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    I’m good with keeping the extra bombers for Germany, Italy and England; Alpha +2; AA Gun Rules and Placements from Alpha +3; Technology Changes in Alpha +3



  • @Axistiger13:

    @knp7765:

    One other thing I DON"T like about Alpha+3 setup is losing 2 airbases for UK.  Don’t really care about the one on Malta, but Gibraltar should definitely have an airbase.

    I totally agree with you,knp7765

    i also agree.

    As for the Malta AB: not necessary but made the game more more interesting.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    The discussions leading up to when the Air Bases were removed was revolving around saving the Italian navy.  I think that is why Larry took the two airbases off the Med.

    Edit:  I think it would have been better to add an Airbase to N. Italy in addition to the one in S. Italy and that would have accomplished saving the Italian fleets in SZ 95/97 as well without gimping England’s defense.



  • @special:

    @Axistiger13:

    @knp7765:

    One other thing I DON"T like about Alpha+3 setup is losing 2 airbases for UK.  Don’t really care about the one on Malta, but Gibraltar should definitely have an airbase.

    I totally agree with you,knp7765

    i also agree.

    As for the Malta AB: not necessary but made the game more more interesting.

    I agree too.



  • @BigBadBruce:

    @special:

    @Axistiger13:

    @knp7765:

    One other thing I DON"T like about Alpha+3 setup is losing 2 airbases for UK.  Don’t really care about the one on Malta, but Gibraltar should definitely have an airbase.

    I totally agree with you,knp7765

    i also agree.

    As for the Malta AB: not necessary but made the game more more interesting.

    I believe historically, the Malta air base was more important and used more frequently than the air base in Gibraltar.


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