koba, you have been extremely helpful over the last week. I have also been reading some of the post that you and others Q & A over the last couple months. I’m gearing up for when my map gets here. Much will be answered just by playing. I think we’ll be fine just figuring it out as we go (and making stuff up as we need to LOL).
Thanks for all the great questions Wild Bill! And also, thank you to koba for all the help on the answers. I will be filling in as answers guy for Tigerman for a bit while he whips up his next masterpiece. See my official answers in red below:
@WILD:
Bump, some unanswered questions above, I have a couple more.
Using 5.0 Rules, need a couple clarifications. Are the set-up sheets going to be updated to v5.0 (still v4.1), or do they need to be?
Not sure. I’ve asked too.
We may find after some minor rules changes that they need to be cleaned up. For now, use 4.1
Fortifications (pg30) sound pretty cool. I get that they all play a slightly different roll in their def of a said territory by the table given (I will take a closer look when my game gets here). Are you still in the development phase for fortifications?
A lot of the original fortifications have different facing rules. When I buy new ones they defend the entire territory.
This is correct.
- I see that Fortifications roll 2-12d in def at 5 or less for the first round of battle, and all def inf (assuming it includes special inf too) also get +2 in that first round of battle. Where I get lost is after the first round what happens. The charts for all the powers have fortifications def @2*. So do they continue to roll at 2 or less once the first round is over, and do they roll just one dice at that point?
Fortifications defend in the first round of combat only. They are not taken as a casualty. If the territory changes hands, they are destroyed.
This is correct. All “special rules” for fortifications only last for the first round.
- Russian elite inf, need to clarify intent (pg15).
“These are inf units that attack at 3 or less and def at 5 or less in original Soviet territories”
Does “original Soviet territories” apply to both attack & def values, or only def value. I ask because the Russian set-up page has attack value at 3, and def at 4*. The 4* I believe means def at 5 if you meet the requirements (orig Sov tt). The 3 attack has no *
I believe your assumption is correct. Defend at a 5 in original Soviet territories.
This is correct. Defensive bonus only.
- I have a couple questions about air/navalbases, and NB AA being used to defend ships in air attacks in an adjacent sea zone.
3a). If the naval base is inoperable (3 or more damage) NB AA can’t be used to def sea zone vs air right.I believe if installation is inoperable, AA is inoperable.
This is correct. Non-op is non-op.
3b) If naval base was SBRed on that turn, but didn’t get shut down (only 2 damage), can the NB AA still def the sz. (would be pulling double duty).
Cannot see why not.
Yes.
3c) By rule you can SBR an AA gun to remove it from play. Is there any thought of if a base (air or naval) is inoperable at 3 damage or more that it also shuts off the built in AA gun?
Same as above. Base inoperable, AA inoperable.
This is correct.
3d) If you roll to repair a ship, do you have to follow through (I would assume yes). Or can you write it down to do it next turn, or even re-roll next turn?
I always follow through. Never considered otherwise. Good question for developers.
If you choose to repair a ship, you must roll and pay. It’s like the A&A research rule in a way.
3e) An airbase needs to be operational for a bmr to transport an inf, paratrooper, or commando right?
Sounds right to me.
That’s correct. A non-op base is as good as no base at all until it’s repaired.
- SBR targeting AA guns (haven’t done this before, sounds kinda cool). After the AA gun fires, shouldn’t the bomber have just one round to to kill the AA gun rolling its attack value (8 or less). The last part of the sequence on pg9 seems kind easy/cheesy “If target is AA gun, it is destroyed”
I’ll leave that one to the developers.
The thought here is for every bomber that gets through the SBR process, it rolls to see how many hits it inflicts. It is assumed that every bomber will have some level of success as it is a potentially costly mission and must remain a viable option for rules sake. Since AA guns are single hit units, it is assumed it takes at least one hit automatically and is such destroyed. You are of course welcome to play it anyway you like!
- Is there any thought to changing AA guns to how they work in Alpha+3.9. Roll three dice each, used as casualty etc…. Have you guys done this in games, and how did it go?
We’ll be trying that this weekend (funny you asked).
China is still confusing me (from pg27).
6a) The US and Nat China share a turn, but it doesn’t say they can attack at the same time (unlike Russia & Red China, or UK/Commonwealth that can fight/attack together). Can you flip flop them, and have Nat China go first, then next turn have the US lead the way? Or am I wrong on my assumption and they do attack move/attack together?
U.S. and China are separate. I think the U.S. goes before China.
Per page 4, Nat. China and U.S. take their turn at the same time. You could even build at the same time. The difference is they may NOT move and attack at the same time. The Russians/ Com. Chinese get this advantage but the Nat. Chinese/ U.S. do not. The U.S. player may choose which country goes first (Nat. China or U.S. This will be clarified in rules 5.1 when I release them.
6b) Nat China- “May liberate or capture any Japanese held territory” Does this mean they can go into original Russian or Mongolian territories that Japan has captured like Olgiy (Mongolia), Vladivostok, Novosibirsk, or even all the way to Moscow as long as the Japanese have left them a trail of conquered territories to get there? I’m talking about the Nationalist here, but would pose the same question for the Red Chinese too. I know that the original FEC (UK) territories (except Hong Kong) are off limits for the Nat Chinese under any circumstances, but the Russian/Mongolian are fair game as long as they are liberating from Japan?
We play it that Chinese cannot go outside of China whether Japanese held or otherwise except for the French colonies listed.
For now, it is played the way it is described in the rules. Let us know if we need to change this to a more restricted rule. We wanted to remove China’s unrealistic restriction of not being allowed to leave China.
6c) I’m unsure of the Red Chinese income (couldn’t find it on the Russian set-up sheet, or on pg 27 of the rule book). From pictures of the map it looks like 3 IPCs to start. Is it a fixed 3 IPCs, and any conquests go to Russia, or does their income fluctuate as they gain/lose territories?
Red China gains/loses IPCs depending on territories held. Rules state Communist China will take over unoccupied Nationalist Chinese territories whether it is Communist Chinese or Soviets walking in.
This is correct.
6a) The Chinese tiger gets +1 in attack & def. It can’t attack if the B-road is closed? � Why not just a reduced attack value, or is this to show fuel shortages? Maybe it will revile itself to me when I play later this week, counting down the days (should get map in a day or two).
Will leave that one to developers/
From a rules standpoint, consider it an incentive for the Japanese player to push for the Burma Road. From a historical perspective, I think it has more of a political motive than a logistical one.
I’m sure I’ll have more questions WB
PS I did up an attack and def combat chart for 12d that I will share when I figure out how to upload it. It might help some newcomers to the game.
Awesome. That will be cool to see.
Wild Bill. I hope I was of some help.
Please see answers in red:
Hey i got some questions…
If paris is liberated, do all vichy france controlled territories and units revert to free french or france as a whole? I would think so…
How about using Germany’s Vichy chart again to see who comes back to the Allied side? Otherwise, yes revert all back.
If japan attacks dutch east indies when holland is in german control does this cause a provoked declaration of warer with uk/anzac/commonwealth? I understand that all those dutch territories become pro allied because germany attacked holland. Just need some clarification
No. Japan would not provoke war with the U.K. in this case. Assuming no other provocations are made, the UK player could not declare war on Japan until turn 3.
Communist china does not collect income correct? all ipcs generated by them go to the soviet union. and soviet union can purchase infantry for communist china. is this correct?
No. Com China collects their own income and purchases their own units. But it is all done at the same time as Russia. Both of these powers should be played by the same player.
Thanks a bunch! :)
This question refers to HBG Battle Marker Optional Rules 6/1/12
Do the option 1 minefields defend like AA guns? For every land unit roll one die or is it one die per minefield?
You roll one die per minefield at one unit. It is then expended whether it “hits” or not. You must use each active minefield this way until either minefields or targets run out.
Thanks Variable and koba for your help, I have a pretty good understanding and intent for most of the rules and how things work. I also like that it is a work in progress to a point.
Where is this " HBG Battle Marker Optional Rules 6/1/12" located that koba mentioned? Would like to check it out for the future.
@WILD:
Thanks Variable and koba for your help, I have a pretty good understanding and intent for most of the rules and how things work. I also like that it is a work in progress to a point.
Where is this " HBG Battle Marker Optional Rules 6/1/12" located that koba mentioned? Would like to check it out for the future.
Download it here:
https://historicalboardgaming.3dcartstores.com/assets/images/HBG/HBGMarkers/HBG Marker Rules.pdf
I got my game yesterday, and have set-up the board. It looks great. I see that pro neutral (axis/allied) get to add one inf every two turns if still neutral. Just wanted to make sure that the strict neutrals don’t get this too. I have seen some setups on (game geek ?), and there are more units on the South American territories. I also caught a post from like march that said the neutrals (strict), might get tweaked, hows that going?
PS just saw the Swedish navy WOW, the allies better do whatever it takes to keep Moscow, or the Germans get a Sea lion fleet.
Edit:
Couple quick question. Are any of the the minor axis powers (once activated) able to attack Yugo or Hungary {meant to say Greece instead of Hungary} (before at war w/Russia), or does Germany & Italy have to do the heavy lifting there. Was mainly asking for Romania that isn’t tied to either pro allied territory.
2nd question, is the blitzkrieg move also allow you to double hit with units in sea battles, or is it only for land battles. Can you position yourself in the 1st impulse to hit sea units (Brits) in the 2nd impulse using subs and air etc…?
3rd you are allowed to use newly built units bought in the first impulse to hit stuff in the second impulse right (say a couple bombers)
@WILD:
I got my game yesterday, and have set-up the board. It looks great. I see that pro neutral (axis/allied) get to add one inf every two turns if still neutral. Just wanted to make sure that the strict neutrals don’t get this too. I have seen some setups on (game geek ?), and there are more units on the South American territories. I also caught a post from like march that said the neutrals (strict), might get tweaked, hows that going?
PS just saw the Swedish navy WOW, the allies better do whatever it takes to keep Moscow, or the Germans get a Sea lion fleet.
Edit:
Couple quick question. Are any of the the minor axis powers (once activated) able to attack Yugo or Hungary (before at war w/Russia), or does Germany & Italy have to do the heavy lifting there. Was mainly asking for Romania that isn’t tied to either pro allied territory.The Axis wouldn’t attack Hungary, they are Axis Minors and are activated by Axis units as usual. For Hungary, Romania, and Bulgaria– they cannot leave their respective country until they meet the condition specified on pages 23 and 24. If one meets the condition specified, it can be treated as a normal Axis unit and activate/attack other countries.
2nd question, is the blitzkrieg move also allow you to double hit with units in sea battles, or is it only for land battles. Can you position yourself in the 1st impulse to hit sea units (Brits) in the 2nd impulse using subs and air etc…?
Yes. Actions are followed per page 14.
3rd you are allowed to use newly built units bought in the first impulse to hit stuff in the second impulse right (say a couple bombers)
Correct.
Thanks, BTW I meant to say Greece instead of Hungary in my first Q
Fortification question:
Oslo Fortification defends against an attack from any sz, does that refer to only amphibs?
When a fortification says it def from any sz, does that include a paratrooper and other air units flying in from across a sz w/o an amphib??
I’m looking at taking Oslo with inf from Narvic, and air & paratroopers from Berlin (fling across the straight).
Oslo Fortification defends against an attack from any sz
@WILD:
When a fortification says it def from any sz, does that include a paratrooper and air units flying in from across a sz?
I would think yes
Correct. If a fortification lists a particular boarder or sea-zone it defends against, it is a coastal fortress or border fortress. The others, including the new ones that are built, are inland and must be attacked by any enemy units.
Ok let me reword it, was still in thought process before :?
Fortification question:
Oslo Fortification defends against an attack from any sz, does that refer to only amphibs?
When a fortification says it def from any sz, does that include a paratrooper and other air units flying in from across a sz w/o an amphib??
I’m looking at taking Oslo with inf from Narvic, and air & paratroopers from Berlin (fling across the straight). Which of these units would be eligible targets for the fortification, and would this particular attack give +2 to the inf there?
Continuation from dcandf5 a few posts back:
Q: If japan attacks dutch east indies when holland is in german control does this cause a provoked declaration of war with uk/anzac/commonwealth? I understand that all those dutch territories become pro allied because germany attacked holland. Just need some clarification
A: No. Japan would not provoke war with the U.K. in this case. Assuming no other provocations are made, the UK player could not declare war on Japan until turn 3."
I like how the rules for Holland play out. If Germany attacks Holland (to by pass Mag Line), or takes Paris, all Holland territories becomes pro allied (allies would need to NCM in to claim them, and units there). They are most likely to become pro allied G1.
This will allow the UK/Anz to claim the Dutch islands (and units on them) in the Pac which is cool, but Japan goes before the UK.
It is also possible (not probable) that the Germans don’t attack Holland, or take Paris G1, which would keep the DEI a strict neutral. In this case the Japanese would also be able to invade the DEI to capture them by rule w/o any consequences.
Borneo is undefended, and an easy invasion J1. Celebes is also an easy mark w/bombardment.
Japan is allowed to invade the DEI (still Dutch) as pro allied or strict neutrals w/o provoking war w/FEC (UK) seems a little off, but OK that’s cool because that’s how the pro allied & strict neutrals work.
The US would find this very alarming in either case. Shouldn’t a Japanese invasion of any of the DEI while Dutch (as pro allied neutral, or still strict neutral) at the very least ratchet up the US production level.
I propose you add something to the events list that increase US production level by at least +5 if the Japanese invade the DEI when they are still Dutch (either pro allied or still a strict neutral territory).
@WILD:
Ok let me reword it, was still in thought process before :?
Fortification question:
Oslo Fortification defends against an attack from any sz, does that refer to only amphibs?
Correct.When a fortification says it def from any sz, does that include a paratrooper and other air units flying in from across a sz w/o an amphib??
No.I’m looking at taking Oslo with inf from Narvic, and air & paratroopers from Berlin (fling across the straight). Which of these units would be eligible targets for the fortification, and would this particular attack give +2 to the inf there?
In this case, the fortification would not aid Oslo. It is more of a coastal defense fortification that is used to defend against amphibious assault. What you are planning there is the benefit of using paratroops!
OK, got it.
Transports can off load into two territories adjacent to the same one sz in this game (very cool, long time house rule). Just wondering if you can also off load one unit in combat, and the other in NCM from the same transport (from the same sz of coarse). Could you also have one inf do an attack in one tt, and the other NCM in to reinforce another (or the same tt).
Another example:
One transport containing an inf & AA gun off loading to adjacent tt(s). Can you have the inf do amphib (combat), and then off load the AA gun (NCM) into the captured tt (or even a neighboring tt that is also adjacent to the same sz).
Sorry to bombard you with so many Q’s
@WILD:
Transports can off load into two territories adjacent to the same one sz in this game (very cool, long time house rule). Just wondering if you can also off load one unit in combat, and the other in NCM from the same transport (from the same sz of coarse). Could you also have one inf do an attack in one tt, and the other NCM in to reinforce another (or the same tt).
Another example:
One transport containing an inf & AA gun off loading to adjacent tt(s). Can you have the inf do amphib (combat), and then off load the AA gun (NCM) into the captured tt (or even a neighboring tt that is also adjacent to the same sz).Sorry to bombard you with so many Q’s
You may unload the same transport in combat and non-combat as you described above. The only thing to keep in mind is each transport that is loaded in the Combat Phase MUST contain a unit that is going to be used in an attack. For example, you could not load 6 inf on a transport and attack with only one. You would have to attack with at least 3. Otherwise, these transports must be moved in the Non-Combat Phase.Also, the transport used in the Combat Phase could not be moved in Non-Combat.
Last one for now Variable,
The US must end movement in a US tt, a sz next to US tt, or a US convoy zone until at war.
Are there any restrictions for Japan movement like in G40 Alpha+3. Do they have to keep a distance from the US mainland, or Alaska (maybe Hawaii). That sneak attack could actually force the US to retreat through Panama if the Japan navy floats along side it.
Japan navy (or any power) can share sz’s with powers they are not at war with correct.
Question #20 about Japans taking the DEI. I envisioned the DEI as pro-allied but not effecting the US in any way. If there are any UK/Anzac/FEC units in a territory of the DEI and Japan attacks it obviously a declaration of war. Do we need to explain this rule any better?
Question #25 on Japan naval movement in US zones. Im still looking at this but I’m leaning to adding that Japanese units can not end their turn in the same zone as US units or in a sea zone next to a US territory. This will be explained in the next revision of the rules. As for now there is nothing in the rules stopping Japan from moving into US occupied sea zones.
Question #20 about Japans taking the DEI. I envisioned the DEI as pro-allied but not effecting the US in any way. If there are any UK/Anzac/FEC units in a territory of the DEI and Japan attacks it obviously a declaration of war. Do we need to explain this rule any better?
No, that is how it comes across to me in the rules and it works for the most part IMO. Allowing a Japanese invasion of the DEI (while Dutch) w/o any consequences is what feels a little off to me. Maybe just an inf added to def Borneo so that the Japanese can’t just walk in (don’t know for sure, but seems like something should have been stationed there).
Just thought that the US event list could include a direct Japanese attack on the DEI (while Dutch) as well, even if it lowered one of the others on the list (maybe the W Hemisphere to+25). The US wouldn’t have declared war over it, but I think it would have taken notice with blatant Japanese aggression w/oil embargo and all. Not a big deal, just a thought.
**BTW Western Hemisphere can also include parts of Africa, and Europe and small part of Russia in some interpretations (don’t think that is your intent). When you say W Hem you are talking about just the Americas and adjacent islands right. Where would Greenland and Iceland fall in your rules.
Also while I’m on the subject of W Hem, I heard there might be changes to the units placement in 4.1 (upgrade to 5.0). In our first game we found it way to easy for the UK to claim Brazil (which is fine), but to just walk into the other unoccupied S American countries was a joke. We will add 1-2 inf to each of them in our next game so there is some resistance, hope the update will do something along those lines.
Question #25 on Japan naval movement in US zones. Im still looking at this but I’m leaning to adding that Japanese units can not end their turn in the same zone as US units or in a sea zone next to a US territory. This will be explained in the next revision of the rules. As for now there is nothing in the rules stopping Japan from moving into US occupied sea zones.
Ok, we will probably address it with similar restrictions until the rules get updated. Do you have any idea when the units placement and rules update will be. Are we talking soon, or a month from now?
Other things to consider in the update are including canal, and straight rules (don’t remember seeing anything, but I could be wrong). We are using G40 for that for the most part. You have ruled on the Dane straight can be used by anyone while Denmark is neutral, that doesn’t work for the Turks straight though. Is it closed from the start, or is there a trigger? Can subs move through the Gib straight?
Please don’t take these comments as criticism, we are having a great time in our first game and addressing minor things as we go. We are getting a lot of help along the way from this thread (you guys have been terrific).
**Edit, One last thing:
The role of a fighter has really change in this game. Ftrs have traditionally gotten a big def boost. I didn’t always get that because it would take time to get them in the air, but that’s the way it has always been. This game has them as a 6-6 unit. With the 12 sided dice system I would have thought they would def at 7 (not 8 which would be the same as 4 w/6D). As a whole air are pretty crappy defenders in this game. I guess it solves the allies flying ftrs to def Moscow LOL. Just seems strange seeing it be like a flying tank as far as values go on defense.
Is this under review?
Maybe give ftrs +1 from an operational air base when defending the territory the AB is in. An AB would include an early warning radar system that would allow for the +1 def value. Would need to tweak RAF in United Kingdom def to +1 (would also get +1 for AB making it +2).
Even if it was a limited +1 boost to a max of 3 ftrs def territory w/AB (maybe include tacs). Similar to an AB allows a limited number of ftrs/tacs (3) to scramble to SZs.
