Okay, help me please. Alpha 1? 2? +2? What the…

[Woodstock]

Okay….someone…please…if you’d be so kind…provide me a brief overview of what the frigg is going on.

Last time I was here was in August or September, and I played one game of Global, with the original rules, corrected with the Official Errata that were posted up rather quick after launch of Global.

Now I see Alpha 1, Alpha 2, whatever. I know there was much debate about the balance, and Larry was busy redoing a lot of stuff…when I lost my interest.

So…with a new game with my playgroup coming up in a week…where are we at?

[Dark_Destroyer]

For Alpha +.1 to play…
http://harrisgamedesign.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=4060

Or if you want to play Alpha+.2
http://www.harrisgamedesign.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=4167

[Woodstock]

Djeebus…

Can I also just stick to the old rules…  :?

[Krieghund]

Of course.  There’s no reason to play with anything else if the box rules work for you.

[Woodstock]

@Krieghund:

Of course.  There’s no reason to play with anything else if the box rules work for you.

Well….I’m a bit frustrated here…
I paid a fair amount of money for a huge game. Which already turned out as a bummer when I opened it. (the usual rants…no Russian units, crappy battleboards etc).

Then I play one game, which was pretty good.

Then I find here all kinds of stuff how unbalanced it is, and that the designer of the game himself is redefining the rules and such.

I have no way time to figure out all of the changes, get it acquainted in my playgroup, get the right game additives adjusted etc in a week, so next week we will play by the old rules.

…while all the time I am thinking…great…somewhere on the internet, the designer of this game is admitting it’s rather bad and redefining a lot of stuff.

I bought a board game, for a lot of money, and I expect it to work.

If I continue playing by the old rules, and never show my face on the internet again, will my playgroup suddenly say…“Dude, this game actually sucks. The Axis/Allies have a huge advantage and it is unbalanced. Let’s go back to AA50.” ?

[Battlingmaxo]

@Woodstock:

Djeebus…

Can I also just stick to the old rules…  :?

Sure you can,  Beta will be out shortly and you can try your luck at that.

[Dark_Destroyer]

Here’s what I’d do in your shoes… go to http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=21845.0 and print off the new NO’s and placement .pdf’s.  That makes it easier for your play group to understand what is going on.  (Really it’s not that bad to switch over.)

Read up on the new changes and you’re ready to go!  It’s just like a patch for a video game, board games like this have to have time to balance.

[Krieghund]

Look at it this way, Woodstock.  You played the game once, and you enjoyed it.  Play it again, and again.  Maybe you’ll eventually find that it doesn’t work for you, maybe you won’t.  If you do, how long do you think it will take to find that out?  Months?  Years?  Meanwhile, you’ll be having fun with it.

All the while, we’ll be working on Alpha.  If you find that the game ends up sucking, you can always switch to the completed Alpha then.  It will be like getting a whole new game for free.  As Dark_Destroyer pointed out, there will be fan-made components out there to replace the ones that came with the game, so there won’t be any problem keeping up with the changes.

Does that sound like a plan?   :-)

[lnmajor]

I think what WOODSTOCK is getting at for the amount of money he invested he feels that more effort could have been put into playtesting and getting it more dialed in before launching it.

[questioneer]

Hey Woody,

Don’t freak out, Alpha +2 is the best revision yet- playtested and more balanced.  According to Larry- it sounds like he will make it the final soon- to be reprinted on every Pac40 and Euro40 game from here on out- so get yourself familiar with it.  You won’t be disappointed.

Quit your belly-aching and try it. :wink:

[Woodstock]

What Inmajor said. I expect to buy a game that’s finished.

But I guess I have to settle with it, when it’s true what questioneer said. I have plans of heavily expanding my playgroup and competing other playgroups throughout the Netherlands. It’s quite handy when we are all one the same page……

Is there somewhere, apart from the setup charts and NO’s , one clear definite list of rule changes? I can see the forum thread at Larry’s forum, but that’s a lot of text and a lot of discussion.

[TheDefinitiveS]

Hmmm tryed to get into the Harris Game Design website to view the changes but its says my IP is banned from that site, WT??? Is someone able to help me with this or put a pdf of the new rules on this site if its not already done……PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASE

[Todd7912]

Check out the first 3 posts in this thread, they were copied from Larry’s site.

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=21859.0

[BadSpeller]

@Woodstock:

What Inmajor said. I expect to buy a game that’s finished.

Maybe look at it this way, we were able to get the game 2 years before it was released.  Many addtional playtesters are tuning the game before it’s final release.

[crsluggo]

@lnmajor:

I think what WOODSTOCK is getting at for the amount of money he invested he feels that more effort could have been put into playtesting and getting it more dialed in before launching it.

I couldn’t agree more with this statement. I really feel that there was more playtesting & editing needed before this game was released.

[SgtBlitz]

@C_Strabala:

@lnmajor:

I think what WOODSTOCK is getting at for the amount of money he invested he feels that more effort could have been put into playtesting and getting it more dialed in before launching it.

I couldn’t agree more with this statement. I really feel that there was more playtesting & editing needed before this game was released.

Yup…  having played many MMOs and god knows how many boardgames out there, there’s a lot to be said for testing the quality of the product BEFORE passing it out to the unsuspecting populace.  You might lose more customers than gain, especially the die-hard fans (check my sig).

[eudemonist]

Bah.  Out of box is a fine game.  There are a couple strategies that are more effective, but finding those is part of the fun of the game to me.  If you stay off the internet and just play within your play group, you’ll probably play at least a few dozen games  before it starts to get too “dialed in”.  For me and my group, that’s like a couple years, maybe.  It’s only if you get on the internet and research the fruits of the the labor of armchair generals worldwide that it gets really out of whack.  With a game this size and complexity, I think it’s just about impossible to achieve the requisite level of fine-tuning without public examination.  Just too many man hours, and, because people tend to think along similar lines, there isn’t as much divergence.  Dunno, just my thoughts.

tl; dr  Good game.  You’ll be glad you bought it.

[SgtBlitz]

@eudemonist:

Bah.  Out of box is a fine game.  There are a couple strategies that are more effective, but finding those is part of the fun of the game to me.  If you stay off the internet and just play within your play group, you’ll probably play at least a few dozen games  before it starts to get too “dialed in”.  For me and my group, that’s like a couple years, maybe.  It’s only if you get on the internet and research the fruits of the the labor of armchair generals worldwide that it gets really out of whack.  With a game this size and complexity, I think it’s just about impossible to achieve the requisite level of fine-tuning without public examination.  Just too many man hours, and, because people tend to think along similar lines, there isn’t as much divergence.  Dunno, just my thoughts.

tl; dr  Good game.  You’ll be glad you bought it.

Okay.

“A little learning is a dangerous thing,
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring.
There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
And drinking largely sobers us again.”

• Alexander Pope

[Woodstock]

@BadSpeller:

@Woodstock:

What Inmajor said. I expect to buy a game that’s finished.

Maybe look at it this way, we were able to get the game 2 years before it was released.  Many addtional playtesters are tuning the game before it’s final release.

So I am getting a whole new updated copy once they’re done playtesting?  :roll:

[SgtBlitz]

@Woodstock:

@BadSpeller:

@Woodstock:

What Inmajor said. I expect to buy a game that’s finished.

Maybe look at it this way, we were able to get the game 2 years before it was released.  Many addtional playtesters are tuning the game before it’s final release.

So I am getting a whole new updated copy once they’re done playtesting?  :roll:

Nope, but you can BUY Larry’s NEW AND IMPROVED AXIS AND ALLIES 1941 edition ™, for only 3 easy payments of $39.99!  AND get to do the ridiculous “revised setups” B.S. all over again cause he spent all his time “fixing” the current edition!