J1–>Alaska; J3 Game Over.

[Tragedy]

• I understand the concept of defending with Infantry…When u have 60ish some odd points to spend on U.S. 2 and u can only produce 10 units, suggesting all infantry is obviously inefficient. As Stoney229 said its apples and oranges.

The suggestion of 5 infantry, 4 fighters seems the most logical. I’m not sure if it will be enough. I’m not looking to fight a battle that depends on how well I roll the AA gun.
The Japan strat that was used can be tweaked to allow more planes to hit Western U.S. on turn 3. Japan could afford to use less in Asia and buy more on turn 2 then what was done in the game I played. I guess what I’m asking is, why not go bare minimal planes in Asia?

• I agree, attacking the Japan fleet in S.Z. 10 with the U.S. fleet + Planes would prolly work.
  Which got me thinking; What if the Japan Fleet in S.Z.6 moves to S.Z.2, and blocks S.Z.1 and 9 with Destroyers? It seems like that would cause problems for the U.S. fleet. They can’t really attack, and if they move to Hawaiian Isles they can be blocked from getting back to S.Z.10. Thoughts?

• Taking back British Columbia and more importantly Alaska before the planes can land (Complex Built) is the key, the U.S. player couldn’t find a way to do it, and honestly I had no good suggestions for him. I don’t think Trading British Columbia will stop an imminent J3 invasion.

• As far as Asia goes, (I was playing U.K. /China) I had the U.K. stacked in Yunnan /w China. I was planning on taking Kwangsi on U.K. 3 and then take back Kwangtung (Japan consolidated in Kwangtung). I also had a Mech and Tank in the pipeline so I can start blitzing through Asia. I don’t really see what I could do differently in 2 turns. Japan bought a Major complex on J3 to place in Kiangsu (lol). China was stacking with U.K. and I had a couple infantry moving north to take back lost territories.

If Western U.S. goes down and Japan collects U.S. points, asking U.K./ ANZAC to win the game by conquering Japan is a tall order imo. Especially with a Major Complex in Kiangsu and a boat load of points to spend.

:-)

[Autarch]

An effective US first strategy requires some deception but also depends on what the US player does. J1 US attack is too easy to counter. I make the normal J1 purchases (minor IC and 2 AP) and keep the IJN in home waters. That way I can either fork SZ1 and Hawaii, or continue my normal J2/J3 attacks depending on the US player’s action.

[Panz3r L3ad3r]

@Gwlachmai:

Fighters can only scramble from islands.

…. with a not damaged airbase :-)

[ZehKaiser]

Did you build that minor IC in alaska? Is this legal placement? I think you may have edited out the fact you placed it in Alaska, but I think it was in your original post.

[Mino1124]

@ZehKaiser:

Did you build that minor IC in alaska? Is this legal placement? I think you may have edited out the fact you placed it in Alaska, but I think it was in your original post.

It’s absolutely legal. Minor ICs can be placed on any non island territory with a production rate (dunno if that’s the right term but the mumber in the circle) of 2 or more. Alaska is worth 2 ICPs so it fits.

[Tragedy]

@ZehKaiser:

Did you build that minor IC in alaska? Is this legal placement? I think you may have edited out the fact you placed it in Alaska, but I think it was in your original post.

Huh?

I have edited out nothing in any post.

As Mino1124 said, Minor in Alaska is legal.

My question is:
How do you pry Alaska back from Japan when they take it on turn 1, along with British Columbia and use boats to block crucial Sea Zones?
And yes their will be a minor complex their at the end of turn 2. Which wasn’t even needed or used in the game I played.

[Gwlachmai]

I don’t think it really matters if you take Alaska back as long as you build a solid defense. Unless the US player doesn’t see it coming, a move against the Western US is a bad strat.

[Tragedy]

@Gwlachmai:

I don’t think it really matters if you take Alaska back as long as you build a solid defense. Unless the US player doesn’t see it coming, a move against the Western US is a bad strat.

The pros and cons of not taking Alaska back are debatable imo. The combination of Escorted Bombing Raids and Japan subs in S.Z.10 can be a massive economic disruption and really ties the U.S. up logistically.

If Western U.S. falls do you feel Allies can still win?

This is a all or nothing strat. Japan is “all in” on round 3. Either they take Western U.S. and essentially win imo, or they fail and have wasted their resources to a point they can’t recover from. There is no middle ground or stalling tactics.

Which leads to the next natural progression of this strat (I’ve been play A&A vs. this player for a looong time, and he has always been the most aggressive player at the table). At some point he will try to hit Western U.S. with everything on the board on Round 3. At the very least I would like to be prepared in the event it does happen.

I’m 99% sure I can tweak the Japan strat to bring more then enough to beat: 11 Fighters, 3 Tac, 1 Tank, 1 Art, 1 Mech, 13 Inf, Couple Bombers. (Approximate numbers from memory)
I will think about it some more and post later.

If you would like to play a forum game so you can show me why this is a bad strat that would be great. I’m not saying I don’t believe you, I’m saying show me.
The “That should never happen, It’s easy to counter” comments with not much backing it up are getting old.

[gamerman01]

@Tragedy:

@Gwlachmai:

I don’t think it really matters if you take Alaska back as long as you build a solid defense. Unless the US player doesn’t see it coming, a move against the Western US is a bad strat.

The pros and cons of not taking Alaska back are debatable imo. The combination of Escorted Bombing Raids and Japan subs in S.Z.10 can be a massive economic disruption and really ties the U.S. up logistically.

If Western U.S. falls do you feel Allies can still win?

This is a all or nothing strat. Japan is “all in” on round 3. Either they take Western U.S. and essentially win imo, or they fail and have wasted their resources to a point they can’t recover from. There is no middle ground or stalling tactics.

Which leads to the next natural progression of this strat (I’ve been play A&A vs. this player for a looong time, and he has always been the most aggressive player at the table). At some point he will try to hit Western U.S. with everything on the board on Round 3. At the very least I would like to be prepared in the event it does happen.

I’m 99% sure I can tweak the Japan strat to bring more then enough to beat: 11 Fighters, 3 Tac, 1 Tank, 1 Art, 1 Mech, 13 Inf, Couple Bombers. (Approximate numbers from memory)
I will think about it some more and post later.

If you would like to play a forum game so you can show me why this is a bad strat that would be great. I’m not saying I don’t believe you, I’m saying show me.
The “That should never happen, It’s easy to counter” comments with not much backing it up are getting old.

For the sake of every reader of this thread, please do play a game with this strat.  As Tragedy said, it’s an “all-in” strat.  I am inclined to think it could be stopped with a high rate of chance, but then I haven’t played this version of A&A that long, and it’s never been tried in my games.

Tragedy, if he won’t do it, I would like to try to defend against it in PBF with you as Japan - again - just to help you, me, and everyone else assess the viability of this radical strat.

The point someone made earlier about WUS only being worth 10 is silly.  It’s worth 50 to the WUS, and if the US is out of the game that early, this game is unwinnable by the Allies (to answer your question, Tragedy)

[Tragedy]

@gamerman01:

For the sake of every reader of this thread, please do play a game with this strat.  As Tragedy said, it’s an “all-in” strat.  I am inclined to think it could be stopped with a high rate of chance, but then I haven’t played this version of A&A that long, and it’s never been tried in my games.

Tragedy, if he won’t do it, I would like to try to defend against it in PBF with you as Japan - again - just to help you, me, and everyone else assess the viability of this radical strat.

The point someone made earlier about WUS only being worth 10 is silly.  It’s worth 50 to the WUS, and if the US is out of the game that early, this game is unwinnable by the Allies (to answer your question, Tragedy)

Yeah dude, I will play anyone that is interested. The invitation isn’t only for Gwlachmai.
I’m not here to beat my chest and spin this as an amazing I Win Button. Honestly I really hope it is easy to counter. I’m interested in experimenting with the progression of this tactic and see what it is capable of. As far as beating a competent/alert opponent with it, everyone knows exactly what I’m going to do.  :wink:

[Gwlachmai]

I’m down for a game. I’d love to see this in action. Feel free to start a forum game. At the very least, either way it should be quick.

[gamerman01]

@Tragedy:

Yeah dude, I will play anyone that is interested. The invitation isn’t only for Gwlachmai.
I’m not here to beat my chest and spin this as an amazing I Win Button. Honestly I really hope it is easy to counter. I’m interested in experimenting with the progression of this tactic and see what it is capable of.

I understand.  I am kind of a rookie at AAP40, but not of A&A in general.  I am in the middle of my second game of AAP40 against a good player, but I haven’t taken the Allies yet.  Just giving you full disclosure before you start the effort of playing (at least a 3-4 turn) a game with me.  That said, I think I can stop Japan from taking over the WUS, and if I can’t (knowing that it’s coming, as you said) then that will give us all important information as well.

As far as beating a competent/alert opponent with it, everyone knows exactly what I’m going to do.  :wink:

Good point.  So we’ll find out if a rookie of AAP40 (but, I suppose, veteran of worldwide A&A games) who knows its coming, can stop it.  I think that will give us all some valuable information.

Thanks for taking the time to try the strat with me.  I appreciate it, and I’m looking forward to it.  I should be able to post my move at least once a day, never less than once every 3 days, I think.  It is my busy season at work, but I’m never too busy to play A&A  :-)

Please start J1, and put a link to the thread on this page.  Then everyone can easily find it, and observe what happens.  I invite commentary as you play (possibly tell us what you’re thinking in some decisions) so we can more fully analyze this animal of a Kill USA First strat in AAP40.

Finally, as you and others have said, in USA2 if under full Jap attack, I would buy a suitable purchase for max defense (an appropriate mix of infantry, air, and possibly a destroyer block).  Also, though I haven’t played this one too much, I think I understand the rules quite well, except for all the non-J1 attack crap (I always attack J1 so far) so that will not be a problem.  Game on!

[gamerman01]

@Gwlachmai:

I’m down for a game. I’d love to see this in action. Feel free to start a forum game. At the very least, either way it should be quick.

I don’t know if you want to play 2 at once, Tragedy, but if you just want to play Gwla, I understand.  Just let me know.

[Gwlachmai]

Honestly, if you move against Alaska on turn one, I’m not sure how you cannot see that coming. Likewise if the entire Japanese fleet consolidates in Japan on turn 1 I assume it’s to move against the US.

[Gwlachmai]

@gamerman01:

@Gwlachmai:

I’m down for a game. I’d love to see this in action. Feel free to start a forum game. At the very least, either way it should be quick.

I don’t know if you want to play 2 at once, Tragedy, but if you just want to play Gwla, I understand.  Just let me know.

Lol, either way they’d both be quick games, this start is really kind of a make or break move.

[gamerman01]

@Gwlachmai:

Honestly, if you move against Alaska on turn one, I’m not sure how you cannot see that coming. Likewise if the entire Japanese fleet consolidates in Japan on turn 1 I assume it’s to move against the US.

Definitely.  I totally agree.

[gamerman01]

@Gwlachmai:

Lol, either way they’d both be quick games, this start is really kind of a make or break move.

Sure is.  I’m thinking mostly “break”, but maybe we’ll find out…

[Tragedy]

I think it would be awesome to play 2 games at once.

I am busy atm, give me a couple hours to get home, setup my board, make some tweaks, and examine variations (for example I might try basically the same opening move with some subtle differences); then I will start the games.

I appreciate u guys taking the time to work on this with me.  :-)

gamerman01: Feel free to make your moves at your leisure, it’s all good.

[Gwlachmai]

Do you know how the play by forum works, and do you have the battlemap downloaded? If not gamerman can point you at some links that will describe how it all works. I can do it too, but, you’ll have to put up with Mr. Awesome drool.

[Tragedy]

@Gwlachmai:

Do you know how the play by forum works, and do you have the battlemap downloaded? If not gamerman can point you at some links that will describe how it all works. I can do it too, but, you’ll have to put up with Mr. Awesome drool.

Yes and Yes.
I like having the board setup too, it helps me see things from a “different” angle.
Lol, sorry about that.