Where to place Bid Builds?

I’ve tested a bit with a Japanese arty in French Indochina. It does the work of a fighter in the battle for China, but often it’s not decisive later. And even then, there may be 1J situations even more overwhelming.
For the remaining 5 IPC: tank in Libya, or even inf (and save 2 for Japan to build 4 transports)

True, but not all use the LH rules. And without long range, sub in sz8 means bomber, 1 fighter and 2 subs against 1 trannie, 1 sub, 1 BB(assume USSR joins fleet). You still have 3 fighters against Gibraltar BB and italian BB against Israel destroyer. German should save at least the bomber, maybe even the fighter.

@axis_roll:

If you’re a firm believer of gathering African IPCs as fast as possible, place the units in Libya and also transport units to AES from southern.  Make AES impervious to a UK counter round 1.

I’ve actually attacked w/both TRN units AND bid units into Anglo-Egypt, and lost the battle as the germans, or had only 1-2 armor left for the UK to blow up. :(

It can happen more often than you think that you get no hits in your first attack, and then if the defender gets some, and your 2nd round is also sub-par… Hence I like to go for overkill. However I also like to move the med fleet west, so it’s usually just bid units for me that get used in Egypt (+ Libyan forces)

If only the Alg and Libya forces were switched around for G1, it would make G1 so much easier…

I liked Jap arty in French Indochina enough to test it repeatedly. Useful, but not as much as Libya. See “1UK explosion > 1J counter” topic.

Someone mentioned 2inf in Ukraine. I’ve even seen 3inf - totally deterrent, more than counterbalancing a weak Egypt. Forbidden in the TripleA Ladder to add more than 1 unit per area. Can anyone say in which tournament version is this allowed ?

@Funcioneta:

The 2 USSR fighters in England is annonying … for USSR. It avoids any useful fighting in R1 (cannot hit west russia) and maybe even R2. And lets Caucasus almost undefended in R1 if you do Ucrania attack.

Russia can still attack Wrus with 12 inf, 2 rt, 4 arm.  They take it out in one rd with 10 inf, 2 rt, 4 arm remaining.

It would be a bad bad bad idea to attack Ukr with 3 inf, 1 rt, 3 arm only and split the Wrus attack.

Leaving 1-2 inf Cauc on R1 is a nice way to get Germany to over extend early if they fall for the trap.

For your R2 attacks, your fts can still be used in Kar and you have Rt/arm for Belo/Ukr.

I see players constantly throwing away 3 Russian armor in Ukr on R1, so if you save them you are certainly free to use 1 or 2 on R2 if you need them.

@axis_roll:

@DarthMaximus:

I don’t see the loss of the ftrs for a turn or two as that big of a deal.  You can still hammer Wrus with everything on R1 while Germany will be struggling in Afr and have no added units to help the push on Mos to show for it.

hmmm… 2 extra inf in karelia G1 is not considered pushing on Moscow?  
It’s analogous to Ukraine…

Not really.  8 =/= 6   :-)
Why not just bid 6 then and place the units on Ukr?  Or bid the 8, place two inf on Belo or Ukr and have 2 extra in cash?  Why waste all 8 on a trn just to get 2 units to Kar during G’s NCM, you could even bid 6 to EE and do that.

Transporting 2 extra inf from Ger or WE to Kar is a whole territory behind direct placement on Belo or Ukr, at least those bids can be used to threaten Wrus/Cauc immediately.

IMO the only reason to bid to Sz 5 is to infact try and scare the UK since it is more cost effective to place the ground units directly in Europe or if you choose to go with a Germany naval strat b/c it is likely you’ll need to buy an AC on G1 for protection anyway, otherwise you’ll lose your bid trn to Allied aircraft in round 2.

Darth,

Are you a Caspian Sub member?
I am not a main stay there so I only know some of the members.

CSub is an advocate of the sz5 tpt bid as well as a third tpt on G1.

I like what is makes the allies do (like Russian ftrs in UK) as well as getting a quick channel of inf to karelia and norway trading.  You havent’ really commited that much $ in the navy ($16), so it might be worth it.  The allies will need to invest in some more planes to take out 2 subs, 3 tpts and a DD, so that’s another thing it makes the allies do… as well as not get too close to sz5 as those tpts are cheap fodder for the Luftwaffe.  At least THIS $16 does more than provide a landing strip for ftrs, it moves inf quicker to the front lines.

I am not the BIGGEST fan of this move, but I think it has some night merits, like many other bids.

No, I am not a member there, but I am aware of some of their ideas, although probably not in great detail.

I agree it could have merit, and like other bids might just come down to personal preference.

My main hang up is I typically don’t like to do anything that declares my intentions before I have to, and I think a bid to sz 5 does that.
I like a bit more flexability, and while the trn gives the Germans  flexability against the UK/Atalntic and Nor/Kar area it takes away from the Ukr/Cauc area which I feel is more important.  If I have the choice I want the Germans killing Russians units, not British or American.

I’m also not a big fan of building Germany naval units and I think that bid almost guarantees a naval buy for a follow-up (such as an AC or more trn(s), etc).

I also think many people under estimate how strong Russia can be, while one trn here or an AC there for Germany might not matter too much when trying to hold off Russia, if Germany starts getting too carried away Russia should most definitely make them pay for it.

I gotta try that one day. :)

If nothing else, it will save my 3 infantry in Belorussia.  That’s +9 IPC with the loss of 1 transport (a transport that makes good fodder while I shoot down British planes since most of you suicide against SZ 5.)

@Craig:

@Funcioneta:

True, but not all use the LH rules.

I understand, but most here are talking about this subject under the assumption that they are playing online in one of the forums and/or sites.  In those cases, LHTR are the rules that are normally used.

Maybe the original question needs to be stated with some parameters as to what context the game is being played under.  That way the bid discussion will be apples to apples.

Another example of this kind of misunderstanding is the difference between a bid that is given in online play versus one given in ftf tournament play.  Or even between different ftf tournaments because of differences in scoring systems, time limits for each game, and even whether the player/team that receives the bid can retain any leftover IPCs for use in a later turn.

Craig

I keep seeing this assumption where LHTR is the standard online.  I don’t think that’s true.

I’ve seen Jap trans bid in East Indies, but I don’t think that bid is better than the Libya/Algeria bid.
And I seen art+tank in Fic, Kwang, which let Jap take India early, and the tank in Kwang also threatens
J1 assault on Bury.
With Germany I always worry about the med., so I would go for Afr. just to keep allies take afr back
and so use a little more time before US can take SE.
As for bids generally, I will usually not play axis with less than 8 bid.

Good analisis everyone. I’ll remember that LH stuff. Still I think letting axis get a free transport is too much, either in Mediterranean Sea or, as someone said, in East Indies or even Carolines (Australia conquered, J1  :-o). So never greater than 7 bid.

Strange that im the only one that think 1 trn SZ37 for japan and 1 ipc to japan is a killer bid.

Strat with Germany is to brace for impact from round 1. Making Japan the big bad boy coming on against russia with severe force.

UK will be crippled really quick, especially if they counter Egypt.

@Nix:

Strange that im the only one that think 1 trn SZ37 for japan and 1 ipc to japan is a killer bid.

Strat with Germany is to brace for impact from round 1. Making Japan the big bad boy coming on against russia with severe force.

UK will be crippled really quick, especially if they counter Egypt.

I think it’s a very solid $9 bid.

Perhaps people think Germany needs a little more than Zero from the bid to be able to hold off the triple team, and/or Japan will be able to become the big bad boy without any help.

Not many people will give/get that amount.

I’m with Funcioneta about that $8 threshold, but it’s almost as if the axis NEED that as the allied KGF with contain Japan is very strong….

The difference between an 8 and 7 bid is not that significant if you do the standard Libya bid. It’s just an Inf/Arm instead of an Inf/Art. Both add the same punch and count to the attack on Egypt, but the tank just adds more skew, and the ability to blitz African territories. However, any surviving tanks in Egypt may be killed by UK anyway.

@Ender:

The difference between an 8 and 7 bid is not that significant if you do the standard Libya bid. It’s just an Inf/Arm instead of an Inf/Art. Both add the same punch and count to the attack on Egypt, but the tank just adds more skew, and the ability to blitz African territories. However, any surviving tanks in Egypt may be killed by UK anyway.

In terms of units into AES, yes, I agree

In terms of Med fleet strength, I disagree.

You have two transports now, and they’re both protected by a capital ship.  If you bought one G1, you’d have to protect it.  That’s a big difference in my book.

It’s hard to believe that the German trans bid in baltic is discussed again!!!
With even players, axis need 8-9 to win. This is a fact.
If Germany tries the sealion G1 it’s gonna fail 70%.
And it’s no problem whatsoever to agree to atleast the first rnd attack on capitals is forbidden, with or
withouth LHTR.
If some of you really belived this crap then go to the triplea lobby, take 8 bid and place trans in baltic….
You’re gonna lose bigtime.
This is a really bad bid place (sz5) for Germany. At least if Germany is gonna try sealion G1.
Another issue is only one unit place pr. TT.
I personally wouldn’t allow any more.
All you have to do is to place 3 inf in ukr…with 9 bid then axis will have much bigger advantage.

As for bid placements I think art+tank Afr. is the better alternative, or 1 inf in Belo, EE, Balkans, or Norway,
to put maximum pressure on Russia from rnd 1.
With reg dice it can be fun to try the sub place bid in sz8.
Could kill all UK navy G1.
That would really hurt the allies if it succeds.

@Lucifer:

It’s hard to believe that the German trans bid in baltic is discussed again!!!
With even players, axis need 8-9 to win. This is a fact.
If Germany tries the sealion G1 it’s gonna fail 70%.
And it’s no problem whatsoever to agree to atleast the first rnd attack on capitals is forbidden, with or
withouth LHTR.
If some of you really belived this crap then go to the triplea lobby, take 8 bid and place trans in baltic….
You’re gonna lose bigtime.
This is a really bad bid place (sz5) for Germany. At least if Germany is gonna try sealion G1.
Another issue is only one unit place pr. TT.
I personally wouldn’t allow any more.
All you have to do is to place 3 inf in ukr…with 9 bid then axis will have much bigger advantage.

As for bid placements I think art+tank Afr. is the better alternative, or 1 inf in Belo, EE, Balkans, or Norway,
to put maximum pressure on Russia from rnd 1.
With reg dice it can be fun to try the sub place bid in sz8.
Could kill all UK navy G1.
That would really hurt the allies if it succeds.

With all due respect, I think an LHTR and Triple A bid are too different to discuss as ‘the same’ when it comes to bidding.

Two reasons:
The Triple A bid is $9, which is three units… all in different territories

The LHTR bid is 6-8 (two units), and can be placed in same territory.

kinda likes apples and oranges.

Strange that im the only one that think 1 trn SZ37 for japan and 1 ipc to japan is a killer bid.

Why do you create the strawman of you being so special? (“strange that I’m the only one”)

If we were used to having such a high bid, maybe we could come up with that as well.

With all due respect, I think an LHTR and Triple A bid are too different to discuss as ‘the same’ when it comes to bidding.

Two reasons:
The Triple A bid is $9, which is three units… all in different territories

The LHTR bid is 6-8 (two units), and can be placed in same territory.

kinda likes apples and oranges.

I agree with this. LHTR bids are lower because you can stick 2 units in the same territory, which greatly changes the odds of that battle.

I think they come close when the bid is 8 because then either way in Anglo you would have an extra inf/arm to attack, but otherwise they are different. 8 IPCs would be the minimum I would try if I used the Triple A/Caspian sub method. 6 seems to be ok in the style of this forum. I remain unsure because I have heard from who I consider to be better players than me that the bid is about 9-11 for Triple A…

Just to be clear, people keep saying “Triple A” but what you really mean is the triple a war club ladder, where they have a standard bid of 9.

Using the triple a program itself though you can use any bid you want.

Anybody know what the Axis win % is at the triple a war club?