Do you do the fighter strafes in the order that the units are moved or in a random order?
crockett36 l vs The Good Captain x
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Game History
Round: 10 Purchase Units - Japanese Japanese buy 1 armour, 1 bomber and 2 infantry; Remaining resources: 6 PUs; Combat Move - Japanese 1 battleship, 1 carrier and 4 submarines moved from Philippines Sea Zone to East Indies Sea Zone 2 fighters moved from Manchuria to Yakut S.S.R. 2 infantry moved from Manchuria to Yakut S.S.R. 1 bomber moved from Manchuria to North Pacific Sea Zone 1 bomber moved from Manchuria to India 1 bomber moved from Germany to Caucasus 1 bomber moved from Caucasus to Russia Combat - Japanese Strategic bombing raid in India Bombing raid in India rolls: 6,2,5 and costs: 13 PUs. Bombing raid costs 13 PUs Battle in Russia Japanese attack with 1 bomber British defend with 1 bomber; Russians defend with 1 aaGun and 1 factory Russians roll AA dice in Russia : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits Japanese roll dice for 1 bomber in Russia, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 2.00 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 bomber in Russia, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits 1 bomber owned by the British lost in Russia Japanese win with 1 bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 15 Casualties for British: 1 bomber Battle in North Pacific Sea Zone Japanese attack with 1 bomber Americans defend with 2 submarines Japanese roll dice for 1 bomber in North Pacific Sea Zone, round 2 : 3/3 hits, 2.00 expected hits 2 submarines owned by the Americans lost in North Pacific Sea Zone Japanese win with 1 bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 16 Casualties for Americans: 2 submarines Battle in East Indies Sea Zone Japanese attack with 1 battleship, 1 carrier and 4 submarines Americans defend with 1 submarine Japanese roll dice for 4 submarines in East Indies Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/4 hits, 1.33 expected hits 1 submarine owned by the Americans lost in East Indies Sea Zone Japanese win with 1 battleship, 1 carrier and 4 submarines remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8 Casualties for Americans: 1 submarine Battle in Yakut S.S.R. Japanese attack with 2 fighters and 2 infantry Russians defend with 1 armour Japanese roll dice for 2 fighters and 2 infantry in Yakut S.S.R., round 2 : 1/4 hits, 1.33 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 armour in Yakut S.S.R., round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 1 armour owned by the Russians lost in Yakut S.S.R. Japanese win, taking Yakut S.S.R. from Russians with 2 fighters and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 2 Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry Casualties for Russians: 1 armour Non Combat Move - Japanese Russians lost 6 PUs to rocket attack by Japanese Rockets roll: 6 1 bomber moved from Russia to East Europe 1 bomber moved from India to Manchuria 1 bomber moved from North Pacific Sea Zone to Manchuria 1 infantry moved from Manchuria to China 1 fighter moved from Yakut S.S.R. to Manchuria 1 fighter moved from Yakut S.S.R. to China Place Units - Japanese 1 armour and 2 infantry placed in Manchuria 1 bomber placed in Japan Turn Complete - Japanese Japanese collect 32 PUs; end with 38 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Japanese regular : -0.67 Russians regular : 0.50 Russians AA : -0.17J10.tsvg in the current board condition, throwing for tech as Japan is part of my overall strategy. I basically don’t change what I do as the Axis from game to game. I have a video on my YouTube channel where I lay this all out if you were interested (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnJReTMIlU8).
In short, Germany “waltz’s” on the East Front (as you saw) while Japan expands and purchases a bomber or two when convenient. This serves the dual purpose of both providing a stream of bombers to hit the Russian complex ‘ad nauseum’ while at the same time leaving the door open for the end game “hail mary” if things start to turn sour.
The hail mary is heavy bombers (or the Atom bomb as your friend, Mr. Harris originally envisioned it). And this is why I feel very confident that if any version of axis and allies survives the test of time, it will be the Milton Bradley, 2nd Edition.
It is the only version that allows the player who has started to lose the game a path to victory, however narrow. Even if it doesn’t work out, the adrenaline rush and nervousness around the board is worth it for its own sake. If it does work out (as in this case) the game continues. In my opinion, this is genius.
I love most versions of axis and allies, but no other version comes close to what this version can do in this regards. The original heavy bombers and tech rules were like the olive in a martini. Perfection.
I regret what technology rules have evolved into.
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@crockett36 that’s not to denigrate what you and the other axis and allies teams did. I have extraordinarily high respect for any name in the credits of any game branded ‘axis and allies’. They’re exceptional games, the whole lot. I say this as someone who has stacked a lot of time over many war board games.
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Game History
Round: 11 Purchase Units - Germans Germans buy 10 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - Germans 15 infantry moved from Germany to West Europe 1 armour moved from East Europe to West Europe 1 bomber moved from Germany to West Europe 3 fighters moved from East Europe to West Europe 1 infantry moved from Germany to West Europe Combat - Germans Battle in West Europe Germans attack with 1 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 16 infantry British defend with 9 infantry; Americans defend with 2 infantry Germans roll dice for 1 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 16 infantry in West Europe, round 2 : 5/21 hits, 5.33 expected hits British roll dice for 11 infantry in West Europe, round 2 : 6/11 hits, 3.67 expected hits 6 infantry owned by the Germans, 2 infantry owned by the Americans and 3 infantry owned by the British lost in West Europe Germans roll dice for 1 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 10 infantry in West Europe, round 3 : 2/15 hits, 4.33 expected hits British roll dice for 6 infantry in West Europe, round 3 : 1/6 hits, 2.00 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Germans and 2 infantry owned by the British lost in West Europe Germans roll dice for 1 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 9 infantry in West Europe, round 4 : 3/14 hits, 4.17 expected hits British roll dice for 4 infantry in West Europe, round 4 : 3/4 hits, 1.33 expected hits 3 infantry owned by the Germans and 3 infantry owned by the British lost in West Europe 3 fighters owned by the Germans and 1 bomber owned by the Germans retreated 6 infantry owned by the Germans and 1 armour owned by the Germans retreated to Germany British win with 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0 Casualties for Germans: 10 infantry Casualties for Americans: 2 infantry Casualties for British: 8 infantry Non Combat Move - Germans 3 fighters moved from West Europe to East Europe 1 bomber moved from West Europe to East Europe 2 infantry moved from Germany to East Europe Place Units - Germans 3 infantry placed in South Europe 7 infantry placed in Germany Turn Complete - Germans Germans collect 20 PUs; end with 20 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Germans regular : -3.83 British regular : 3.00 -
Well, the first tech dice have been rolled for the Allies. We missed. Perhaps soon, we will be dropping A bombs on Berlin or Tokyo. This is a lot more fun than I anticipated. For some reason I thought you didn’t like tech. I’ve never had a martini.
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@crockett36 I like the sub rules. So how many attempts did it take for you to get heavy bombers? How many tech do you have?
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@crockett36 found it. So how much money? Just gauging the luck differential.
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@crockett36 the land battles have been atrocious for the axis and …land is where the IPC are so, I still think this is an Allied win but am glad that this is as interesting as it has been for sure. Really enjoy it. To answer your question, everything can be found in the history tab. I’m not exactly sure EXACTLY what you mean by “how much money”, but I think Japan threw seven or eight dice over two turns and made two breakthroughs.
I don’t like tech dice in any version but this one (but in almost every other version its optional, here it is not). I haven’t had a martini either, I just heard the expression ;)
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@the_good_captain LOL! Wow. seven or 8. good to hear. I always assume I’m getting screwed by the dice EXCEPT for once in a blue moon.
Don’t you think the Anniversary edition tech token system (theoretically a laboratory) is better. The fact that it is optional is an absurdity. And the fact people insist on not playing with it tells me they are engineers or accountants. They don’t want anything to mess up their calculations. That’s why I do full frontal infantry assaults. Yes, I know the odds, but 20 percent of the time you are going to lose badly or win big.
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I am learning and relearning sooooo much. I really am trying to plum the depth of any kJF strategy. The thing I hate about tripleA is the fact that you miss the drama of the enemy turn. If you are ever doing a turn and want to call me, feel free. I am available as a UPS driver with a good headset. And even at night. It adds quite a bit of fun to game especially for the big battles or the atomic bomb runs.
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Don’t you think the Anniversary edition tech token system (theoretically a laboratory) is better. The fact that it is optional is an absurdity. And the fact people insist on not playing with it tells me they are engineers or accountants. They don’t want anything to mess up their calculations. That’s why I do full frontal infantry assaults. Yes, I know the odds, but 20 percent of the time you are going to lose badly or win big.
My long form video response to that is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zg_xYjP1Xm8
In short, due to the massive increase in on board pieces in Anniversary/Global, the doubling of tech breakthroughs, and the fact that tech is now “no risk” in terms of IPC loss (i.e. you buy one tech token, you’re guaranteed one breakthrough), it injects an element of catastrophic randomness. Examples are in the video but one of them is long range aircraft relative to unescorted (or even escorted) transports.
When I did my deep dive into anniversary, the games I played with tech (some of which were played against members of that anniversary tournament we were in) another issue arouse. The fact is that all but one unit influencing tech is offensive in nature. There were no outright defensive techs except for AA guns.
There are a few other issues I cover in the video. I think the best decision from the designers was to leave that an optional rule. I feel strongly under its current iteration, it removes a significant element of skill/experience from the game. I might play with it if we were all around a table drinking and not taking things seriously.
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Can I do a reaction video of your tech video? I’ll play nice!
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@crockett36 of course - and there is no obligation to play nice. Any criticism of ideas is welcome (if it gets personal, I generally ignore that anyway - in the end the board is the best place to work out differences). I am curious where you think where the weakness is though. For context, if/when I speak, its from a position of playing experience. I have played many games against many different opponents before opening my mouth, especially in regards to tech. Can I ask if/what I may have missed? I’m always open to having my mind changed.
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Your critique of the randomness seems misplaced for a game like ana or even a historical record like ww2. I see examples!
So if the Japanese discovered jet fighters in a game, would not it be quite a hoot to play from behind and be victorious or make it close because you as the US have to now go hog wild with technology.
As to tech in anniversary favoring the aggressor, that is actually a question for historians. Victor Davis Hanson says that technology swings defensive or offensive in cycles. Also I would love to have you then offer up solutions or variations that would correct the situation AND SAVE technology.
A game of anniversary without tech is a game of 1941 or 2, not a world war 2 game. So then my question would be: if you had your dream tech rolls, what would turn 8 look like? And would that be enjoyable?
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@crockett36 said in crockett36 l vs The Good Captain x:
I think I see where at least some of the confusion or differences of opinion are:
So if the Japanese discovered jet fighters in a game, would not it be quite a hoot to play from behind and be victorious or make it close because you as the US have to now go hog wild with technology.
It would be, but in my playing experience and as I stated in the videos, simply purchasing a tech token as each power on the first turn almost guarantees that breakthroughs will occur before anyone is “behind” (statistically, by the end of turn two there are two breakthroughs).
As to tech in anniversary favoring the aggressor, that is actually a question for historians. Victor Davis Hanson says that technology swings defensive or offensive in cycles. Also I would love to have you then offer up solutions or variations that would correct the situation AND SAVE technology.
Historically speaking sure, but tech in Anniversary is a game mechanic. Historical context was never in my mind while shooting the video. In fact, I’ll just concede the historical argument. Which goes nicely into my “fix”.
My opinion is that tech was never broken. Classic had it “right”. There are six techs. They are extremely high risk to invest in and best employed as a legitimate ‘hail mary’ when there is someone who is behind in the game (as you point out).
A game of anniversary without tech is a game of 1941 or 2, not a world war 2 game. So then my question would be: if you had your dream tech rolls, what would turn 8 look like? And would that be enjoyable?
I don’t quite understand what to make of this. I’ve heard you say it before and I still don’t understand it. I’m also not sure what you mean by how I think turn 8 would look with tech.
I know from playing experience on this website and through TripleA that by turn eight, things tend to be very, very messy with tech as its written in anniversary. To be precise, I think I played against 3-4 different players in as many games. Each of those examples in the video was something I inflicted on someone or that someone else or had inflicted on me. The games generally ended more quickly and based on feedback in that player population (and including myself) all agreed to drop it.
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agree to disagree. And I am familiar with the community’s disdain for tech. But principles should drive play and playability.
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@the_good_captain Not a big fan of tech as a hail mary. It ought to be integrated and central. Front and center. Absolutely ubiquitous!
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@crockett36 the sub in the North Pacific sea zone survived. Where do you want him to retreat? Japan/Midway/Russia or Alaska? (purchases are in the bottom right)
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@the_good_captain midway
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