Having problems playing Allies



  • Man, this is so frustrating.

    First off, long time player.  Began with 1ed back in '84.  Played 2ed for many, many years.  It’s almost impossible for the allies to lose that game.  Recently began playing revised.  I’ve got maybe 20 games under my belt.  As the allies, my opponent plays a strategy that I simply cannot find an answer to.

    Normally R1, I’m stocking up on Inf, attacking WRus and maybe Ukraine.  It seems attacking Ukraine on R1 can leave you mighty thin for defense.

    G1, my opponent purchases all armor.  With a bomber, fighter, and sub, Germans take out UK navy in 2.  With fighters, Germans destroy UK BB in 13.  With German BB, germans destroy destroyer in 15, then land troops from Southern Europe into Anglo along with Lybian forces.

    G1 may or may not try to reclaim WRus, plus options on Karelia, Ukr.

    This leaves UK without any navy.  Sure they have the Indian/Aus navy, but Japan will wipe that out J1 unless UK moves india navy to South Africa.  UK has to spend a couple rounds rebuilding a navy.  Russia is going full defense because of the constant waves of Ger Armor since G has no threat for a  couple turns from UK.  USA is a couple turns from Shuck Shuck and always seems to get there too late.

    Japan always drops a J1 IC on mainland.  Begins taking India, China, Siberia.  Drops tanks every turn and builds mroe IC’s when it is safe to increase tanks/turn.

    I think in this situation, US needs to put pressure on Japan.  Getting started is the hard part.  I tried a BB and AC on USA1.  Japan has the firepower left in the Pacific to sink this formidable US navy on J2.  I’m wondering about Super Subs to help clear the pacific and start shucking from Alaska into Siberia ASAP.

    With waves of tanks from Germany and waves of tanks from Japan, Russia is slipping fast!!



  • Welcome Anonymous_User:

    R1 buy needs a little adjustment.  If you are from AA (Classic), the mentality is to buy inf!  Need to break that mentality.

    Arm/tanks are 3/3/5.  It’s worth it.  Most people including myself find that 3 inf, 3 arm buy for R1 is a strong buy for a counter attack.  But this buy also depends on what you attack on R1.

    If G1 is taking out your Sz 2, 1 sub, 1 ftr, 1 bmb vs. 1 trn, 1 sub, 1 bb (10 vs. 7).

    As Russia it might be advisable to take out Norway, without Norway that attack is not possible.

    3 inf, 1 ftr in Norway vs. 3 inf (Kar), 1 arm (Arc), 1 ftr (Kar) might be a tough battle but it’s something Russia might have to do.

    And from what you are saying, I am assuming you are not playing with a bid?

    Please take a look at the play boardgame section and find a game by DM (Darth Maximus_, JWW, KGB.  You would need to download AA battlemap, all the moves are posted, buys, comtat, non-combat.

    You need to see the whole game to see why the purchases, the moves are what it is.  It builds on each other.

    Good gaming!



  • Twice I have invaded Norway on R1 and both times were failures (one was a unspeakable failure).  The loss of troops on the russian front was devastating for the remainder of the game.  Russia does not have the income to loose troops like that.

    Yes, the G1 move to Sz2 seems to cost germany a good chunk of its air force, but the loss of the UK navy and the time needed to rebuild benifits germany greatly.

    I’ve actually had decent luck with 4 inf, 1 fgt on R1.  I’ll give it a go with 3 inf/3 arm next time.

    Can russia build a strong enough defense on in europe to start pushing west into asia to slow Japan?

    BTW, going to look for the downloads you recommend now.



  • Most games it comes down to holding Russia until reinforcements arrive.

    There are two generic Allied strategy.

    The most common is KGF (Kill Germany First), where Allies ignore Japan and focus on Germany, I think this is easier to do and effective.

    The second is KJF (Kill Japan First), where Allies focus on Japan, this is harder to do as from R1 you need to be committed.

    If Russia falls before Allies have enough pressure on Germany than Axis usually wins and vice versa.



  • @gnasape:

    Most games it comes down to holding Russia until reinforcements arrive.

    Yes, that is what I’m saying I am having a problem with.  Ignoring Japan, they become huge on the mainland dropping 9-11 armor per turn.  Germany is dropping 6 or more.  UK is out of it for a few turns due to loss of navy.  USA simply takes several turns to be effective.

    There are two generic Allied strategy.

    The most common is KGF (Kill Germany First), where Allies ignore Japan and focus on Germany, I think this is easier to do and effective.

    The second is KJF (Kill Japan First), where Allies focus on Japan, this is harder to do as from R1 you need to be committed.

    If Russia falls before Allies have enough pressure on Germany than Axis usually wins and vice versa.

    VS. the Axis strategy listed, I don’t see how KJF would even be remotely possible.  I’m definitely ATTEMPTING KGF, but losing russia far too early before reinforcements arrrive.



  • What are your typical buys for R1, UK1, US1?

    A tank rush by Germany and Japan leaves them open to counter attack and stall the rush.

    My typical buy for R1 is:

    3 inf, 3 arms with placement of inf in front lines (3 inf, 1 arm to Cau, 2 arms to Russia).  If I need to counter attack, I can immediately use all my units.

    My typical buy for UK 1 would be:

    1 AC, 1 trn, 2 inf or 1 dd, place in Sz 8

    My typical buy for US 1 would be:

    1 AC, 7 inf, 1 arm

    If doing KGF, move 1 bb, 1 trn from WUS to EUS (will take 2 turns), the 1 dd, 2 trn (with 2 inf, 1 art, 1 arm to UK via trn) meet up with UK fleet in Sz 8 and add ftrs to AC if there isn’t 2 UK ftrs on it.



  • With this on G2, the German airforce would be depleted due to G1 battles and it’s going to be hard taking out:

    4 trn (2 UK, 2 US), 1 dd (US), 1 AC (UK), 2 ftr (UK/US) vs. whatever is left

    18 hit dice vs. ??

    Or

    3 trn (1 UK, 2 US), 2 dd (1 US, 1 UK), 1 AC (UK), 2 ftr (UK/US)

    20 hit dice vs. ??

    If Germany attacks this on G2, it won’t have much air support left.

    As for Japan, question, do you stack Bury?  Don’t expose valuable Russian troops to senseless slaughter unless you are doing KJF.


  • '16 '15 '10

    Reinforce Sz 2 with the russian sub.  That swings the odds in your favor.  Germany should already be paying a price by losing a fighter at SZ 13.  Now he’s likely to lose 2 more planes attacking SZ 2.

    I think Ukraine is safe enough if you use the full 3 inf, 1 art, 3 arm, 2 fig–you need to trim Germany’s Luftwaffe a bit…plus skipping Ukraine puts you at risk in other areas.  Everything else to West Russia.

    Use some of the Eastern troops to put pressure on Japan and jump on openings there.  I like 4 inf to Sink and 6 to Bury with 2 fighters landed in Kazach to exploit opportunities, but then I like to be aggressive against Japan and possibly buy land factories or USA naval if Japan misplays J1.  However if you know he’s going to buy all armor with Germany  you might use it against him and pull all Russian infs West for a full onslaught…but then you are giving Japan a free pass.  It depends whether your oppo’s strategy would adapt if you come at him with all 3 allies–in this case he ought to buy infantry and play defensive, but if he keeps buying armor you should be able to take Germany apart before Japan can mount a serious threat to Moscow.

    Against all armor G1 using all 3 allies against Germany is a good bet.  You need to be landing in Europe with UK/USA by Turn 3 or sooner perhaps.  With UK/USA, be buying mainly transports (4-5 with UK, 7-8 with USA) and inf/arm pairings.  If the BB dies and you need a carrier, buy one.

    I think the error you are making is each ally is essentially isolated and fighting its own war, rather than helping each other.  You are better off picking one of the Axis powers and coordinating an assault with all 3 Allies.  In this case I would probably forget about Japan unless his Japan isn’t hitting the key J1 targets (Pearl and China) with sufficient force.  Spend every UK and USA dollar taking down Germany–even if Germany plays defense, once you have Africa and secure Moscow’s borders you have economic parity.



  • Thanks Zhukov44,

    Sorry, I had assumed that the Russian sub goes to Sz 2.

    @gnasape:

    If G1 is taking out your Sz 2, 1 sub, 1 ftr, 1 bmb vs. 1 trn, 1 sub, 1 bb (10 vs. 7).



  • Hi all,

    If G1 is taking out your Sz 2, 1 sub, 1 ftr, 1 bmb vs. 1 trn, 1 sub, 1 bb (10 vs. 7).

    This actually seems like a pretty low odds move by Germany.
    Cobat round 1 They are probably going to loose 1-2 units and UK can absorb 1st round hits on the BB and Russian Sub or tranny.

    Round 2 They will probably start losing planes

    Overall I would expect either mutal elimination or UK wins with BB surviving. In that situation UK has options to join up with canadian tranny and turn 1 purchases (CV + tranny). Also deploying German units in this manner improves the odds for further success for UK in the Med.

    That means UK gets 4 units into Finland on turn 2



  • I have been playing the game for over 15 years and I have seen many things done with both sides.  I can win with both sides, but no matter what stratagy you use, you have to have teamwork from your ally.  I can usually criple germany in 3 rounds with Russia and use the rest of the allies to clean up germany by round 6.  The key is to be smart and aggressive.  Let me explain, and see if you can adapt this to your style of play……

    This game to me is a game of options… You always have options with what to do every round.  The trick to winning is to limit the enemy to options that they have and increasing yours.

    This is where teamwork comes in.  Most people I have played against, see’s russia as very weak, and they play them defensively.  I can’t play that way.  My first round purchases for Russia is 6 artillary.  This will do a few things for you…it creates options.  Doing this for your first 3 rounds along with attacking Germany every turn will make you stronger.  Buying the artillery adds an offensive option to you your stratagy.  First round combat movements should consist of attacking Norway with 2 fighters and 3 infantry from karelia.  You will limit the fighter from norway from attacking the british fleet in SZ2, and it gives you an easy 3 ipc’s.  Then attack west Russia with everything else from russia, your tank in archangel, and artillary and tank from caucas.  You should win both battles with little loss.  Your non combat phase, move 3 infantry from archangel into Karelia and land 2 fighters into karelia.  Move 2 infantry from kazakh into Caucasas.  2 infantry from yakut to Buryatia.  2 infantry from novosibursk into sinkiiang. 2 infantry from E.N.O into Novosibirsk.  Move your submarine from sea zone 4 to 2. Place your 6 artillary into caucasas.  What this does is creates a wall for germany to attack.  If Germany goes on the offensive they will be very weak for a counter attack by britian and russia.  Caucasas will have 5 infantry and 6 artillery to defend with.  Karelia will have 3 infantry and 2 fighters to defend with.  West Russia will have 3 tanks, artillery and at least 1 infantry to defend with.  If Germany attacks either one of these they will have to attack in force.  They will be hurt badly and then you’ll be able to clean up with your other units the next round.  Doing this will put you at +5 ipc’s for your next round, and will give you alot of firepower to attack Ukraine in round 2 from west russia and caucasas.

    If I am Germany my focus is to keep britian land locked.  I usually will use 1 sub from zone 8 to attack 2.  Fighter from Norway and bomber from Germany to attack sea zone 2 also.  Sinse Russia took norway, Germany no longer has that fighter.  So you limited Germany on its options.  Germany lands a tank and an infantry into Norway and captures it losing the infantry.  Germany loses the sub and bomber leaving the battleship and troopship for britian.  German bomber hits the Russian Sub for fodder.  germany then attacks your battleship in gibralter and you lose that, at a cost of 1 fighter for them.  Basically your British fleet is still intact for future assaults on Europe.

    Britian… Purchase 1 IC to be placed in India and 1 troopship, 1 infantry, 1 artillary to be placed with northern fleet at Sea zone 3.  Combat moves should be bringing a tank from canada and infantry from britian to land in Norway.  Bring BB from sea zone 2 to 3 for bombardment with troopship carrying 1 tank and another infantry from britian for support. You can use your 2 fighters to attack German surface fleet in the baltic.  Your bomber can support the fighters, but Taking more money from Germany is more important.  Use sub from australia and attack Japanese Sub in sea zone 45.  Use carrier fighter to attack transport in 59.  You want to maximize your limited naval strength in the pacific for defense.  Don’t attack the Japanese fleet. But make them chase after you.  I’ll explain later.  Non combat moves…land fighter back on carrier.  Bring fighter fromegypt and land it in india for support.  Move infantry from jordan to egypt.  Infantry from persia to india.  Infantry from S. Africa north.  Land fighters from baltic back in britian.  Bomber the same.  Move destroyer from sea zone 15 to the rest of the fleet in 35.  Place new units with fleet in sea zone 3.  New IC in India.  Britians goal is to attack Japanese interests in Asia, limiting their options for attacking Russia.  Build 3 tanks in India the next few turns and keep putting 1 infantry, artillary, and a troopship in the atlantic.  The next round you should still have Norway, so britian could build an IC in Norway so they can keep building tanks and moving them into the Russian lines later in the game.  Britians purchases for turn 3 should be 6 tanks.  3 for Norway, 3 for India.  Basically with tanks in india you should take Burma and kwantung by the 3rd round.  British units should be mixed in with Russian units in Europe.

    Japan has to build an IC in Asia to match the brits, otherwise They will starve to death and britian will overwhelm the pacific.  Japan most likely will not attack Russia this round.  If they do they will be very weak for the british armor onslaught that will happen in the next few turns.  The Japanese fleet will have to respect the US fleet as well as the British fleet.  Japanese options are limited at this point…

    US… purchases- 2 troopships, 3 infantry, 3tanks, All to be placed in the eastern US.  Combat moves… Move 2 transports, 1 destroyer, 1 tank, 1 artillary, 2 infantry, and 1 bomber and attack algeria.  If you still have China use fighter and attack any troopship of the japanese.  If you still have your fleet in hawaii merge them with your transport and battleship.  You can meet them in wake and attack wake island using 2 fighters, bombardment, and 2 infantry.  This will basically show Japan that you are there and you will attack anything open.  They will have to put some energy towards your fleet.  Don’t attack their fleet, let them attack you.  Carriers defend best and a fully loaded carrier will wipe out a small fleet on defense.  This fleet is basically there to keep Japan honest.  They won’t be able to divert all there attention on mainland asia and if you don’t lose your fleet, you don’t have to build anything else until Germany gets wiped out.  This will allow you to focus shuttling units into Europe.  Germany will most likely lose interest in Africa by round 2 because of the russian advance and the british buildup in Norway.  Non combat moves… move destroyer from sea zone 20 into 10.  land bomber in egypt.  Move fighter from E. US and land it in britian.  Fighter from W. US lands in Hawaii, or on carrier.  Fighter in China should stay.  Move infantry from sinkiiang into China.  Place new units in Eastern US.  Your purchases for the next few rounds should be the same as your first round purchases.  If Germany doesn’t attack your transports in sea zone 12 their next round, you can send them back to the US to bring more units later, or you can keep them around Europe and land them in places in europe to help with taking it.  Doing this constantly will keep Germany pressured from 3 sides and you will limit their options.

    After you get Germany weakened by round 2, try and develope combined bombardment, with Britian and the US.  This will give you more firepower later on.  If you get combined bombardment, you can buy 2 destroyers for every one battleship.  Thats twice the amphibious firepower for your money.  If you build a fleet with at least 2 fully loaded carriers, 4 destroyers and, and at least 4 transports, you will have a powerful navy that has alot of bite.  Play with it and see what happens.  I promise, you will never purchase a battleship ever again.

    The key to this stratagy is teamwork.  There will be times that Britian and the US will play a supporting role to Russia.  Russia will have to do alot of the dirty work, but during the British and US turns, they will reinforce the Russian lines.  The British and Us bombers should strategic bomb germany every round.  For every dollar germany loses thats one less tank or infantry that they can buy.  Every bit helps.

    Stick to the gameplan I set up, and the allies will have Europe captured by round 5 or 6.  Japan will be weakened drastically and will fall by turn 10.

    Try this out, and let me know what happens.



  • US…… purchases- 2 troopships, 3 infantry, 3tanks, All to be placed in the eastern US.  Combat moves… Move 2 transports, 1 destroyer, 1 tank, 1 artillary, 2 infantry, and 1 bomber and attack algeria.  If you still have China use fighter and attack any troopship of the japanese.  If you still have your fleet in hawaii merge them with your transport and battleship.  You can meet them in wake and attack wake island using 2 fighters, bombardment, and 2 infantry.  This will basically show Japan that you are there and you will attack anything open.  They will have to put some energy towards your fleet.  Don’t attack their fleet, let them attack you.  Carriers defend best and a fully loaded carrier will wipe out a small fleet on defense.  This fleet is basically there to keep Japan honest.  They won’t be able to divert all there attention on mainland asia and if you don’t lose your fleet, you don’t have to build anything else until Germany gets wiped out.  This will allow you to focus shuttling units into Europe.  Germany will most likely lose interest in Africa by round 2 because of the russian advance and the british buildup in Norway.  Non combat moves… move destroyer from sea zone 20 into 10.  land bomber in egypt.  Move fighter from E. US and land it in britian.  Fighter from W. US lands in Hawaii, or on carrier.  Fighter in China should stay.  Move infantry from sinkiiang into China.  Place new units in Eastern US.  Your purchases for the next few rounds should be the same as your first round purchases.  If Germany doesn’t attack your transports in sea zone 12 their next round, you can send them back to the US to bring more units later, or you can keep them around Europe and land them in places in europe to help with taking it.  Doing this constantly will keep Germany pressured from 3 sides and you will limit their options.

    I disagree. Unless Japan has self destructed the US does not want an early conflict in the Pacific. Japs can bring 2 Carrier battle groups + land based air to the party. Any early losses by the Allies delay their build up and give Japan more time to capture resources and deploy land units into Asia. Secondly there are no easy IPCs that the US can capture in the Pacific.

    The attack on Algeria risks loosing a lot of TRNs as SZ 12 is easilly with range of Germanis naval air patrol from Western Europe. The minimum fleet defence I would go to algeria with is 3 DD + 4 TRN which is easilly achievable by turn 2.



  • I agree…… but you have to think long term in this game.  Yes you will be succeptible to German air attack and you may lose that little fleet.  But the US can replace it the next turn.  You would have already landed units in Africa and german lines there are weakened.  But if Germany pulls all their fighters and commits them to attack the navy, those are fighters that aren’t used on the Russian Front.  You will make Germany lose a plane or 2 and they can’t be replaced as easily do to Russia and britian gaining ground in the east.  In the long run leaving bait for the germans is good.  Yes you will sacrifice some but the object of the game is to defeat the germans.  The US can land in fortress Europe, but in the first few rounds you will not have enough units to keep it.  You might not agree with sacrificing these naval units, but it helps in the long run.  I promise…



  • @jbriggs:

    First round combat movements should consist of attacking Norway with 2 fighters and 3 infantry from karelia.  You will limit the fighter from norway from attacking the british fleet in SZ2, and it gives you an easy 3 ipc’s.  Then attack west Russia with everything else from russia, your tank in archangel, and artillary and tank from caucas.  You should win both battles with little loss.  Your non combat phase, move 3 infantry from archangel into Karelia and land 2 fighters into karelia.  Move 2 infantry from kazakh into Caucasas.  2 infantry from yakut to Buryatia.  2 infantry from novosibursk into sinkiiang. 2 infantry from E.N.O into Novosibirsk.  Move your submarine from sea zone 4 to 2. Place your 6 artillary into caucasas.  What this does is creates a wall for germany to attack.  If Germany goes on the offensive they will be very weak for a counter attack by britian and russia.  Caucasas will have 5 infantry and 6 artillery to defend with.  Karelia will have 3 infantry and 2 fighters to defend with.  West Russia will have 3 tanks, artillery and at least 1 infantry to defend with.  If Germany attacks either one of these they will have to attack in force.  They will be hurt badly and then you’ll be able to clean up with your other units the next round.  Doing this will put you at +5 ipc’s for your next round, and will give you alot of firepower to attack Ukraine in round 2 from west russia and caucasas.

    First, you can only place 4 units in Caucuses (not all 6 arts in your purchase).  I would welcom this attack plan and placement if I headed up the Reich.  I would never attack SZ2 (nor do have I ever seen someone do so) unless I could take sub, Bom, Fig vs BB, Transport.  The odds are only even in that battle and very poor otherwise.

    What I would do is permanently cripple Mother Russia.  Those Fighters and tanks would be gone.  Russia would have 3 inf, 2 figs in Karelia and 4 arm, 2 inf, 1/2 inf in WR (and you should bring in the AA Gun).  The amount of infantry left in WR would determine the exact amount of force I would use there, but basically the attack plan would be to bring the 6 inf, 1 art from Belo and Ukraine into WR, transport 1 inf, 1 arm from WE and move the 2 inf from EE and 2 arm from Germany to Karelia.  There
    are now 3 armor and 2 figs that can reach either WR or Karelia.  If the AA is in WR, I would not risk fighters there. These leaves sub, 2 figs, Bom to attack the Gib BB, and a fighter to hit either SZ 15 or Egypt depending on the bid.  I would probably risk the Med BB v. SZ 15 DD in this attack if necessary.

    So we would be looking at:

    Karelia:

    3 Inf                3 Inf
    3 Arm        v      2 Figs
    2 Figs

    Expected result - German victory with 1 or 2 armor left (Russia loss - 29 ipcs v. German loss 14/19 ipcs.)

    WR

    6 Inf                3  Inf/Art
    1 art        v      4 Arm
    3 arm

    Expected Result - German Victory with 1/2 Armor left.

    I may even use the Bomber in this area rather than the med/egypt, or use the Italian BB to take out the Gib BB, as that would help free up a plane.

    You simply can’t expose both your Russian Fighters and Tanks to G1 counter-attack and expect to live very long.

    I would likely purchase all inf/ 1 art on G1 and Split Arm/Inf on G2 and then tank dominated purchase on G3.

    On G2 I would trade Norway and Karelia (assuming Brits took out the tanks there on UK1) But by G3 there would be a huge stack of inf/arm ready to crush into WR or Karelia.  Other factors could be used to determine whether I wanted to push or bleed off Russian forces as Russia would not have fighters to trade territories and few tanks either.

    You would be better served if you wanted to work along this battleplan to use the archangel tank and Karelia forces to take Norway (still not a guaranteed victory) so that the Fighter can land in Moscow or Cauceses and put more forces into WR so that Germany can’t counter very easily.



  • well, I only wished you lived by me.  lol.  I’d be willing to show you how bad things would go for germany in the long run.  Short term yes you would have an upperhand.  Long term, however you’d leave yourself spread a little thin.  I have seen a counter attack like that a few times and I have tried it myself.  Attacking Karelia in force like that does strengthen your northern border but still leaves you 2 turns away from Russia, and leaves your interior a little thinned out.  You seem to play aggressive with Germany and that is fine, however you need to remember that Russia will have a slight advantage.  Since R1 Norway was taken and WR was taken, Russia is up + 5ipc’s.  Recapturing them only brings you back to even.  Russia will still be able to block your forces in archangel and counter attack WR from caucasas.  Yes casualties will be high for Russia but the bulk of your force will have been depleted.  You wouldn’t have the reinforcements needed to completely hurt Russia until your tanks were brought in.  Yes you would have infantry, but they are slow and very weak by themselves.  Since you left Britians fleet alone you will be counterattacked by British fleet at WE or Norway.  You will be forced to divert units to recapture WE the next round.

    Think long term…… Short term yes you will hurt Russia, but your aggression can possibly come back to haunt you.  I know this… I’ve seen it happen on both sides.

    However… If you are going to counter Russia you need to set up a supply line your first round.  What I always do is my first round purchase, I get an IC and place it in EE.  5 tanks for germany.  That will give you more firepower and flexibility.  You will see better results against Russia if you build an IC closer to the Russian Front.  You can get bigger units and your slower units to the front faster.  As Germany I always go after the british fleet first.  Troopships are my targets.  If I get rid of them, that buys me an extra round or to to keep sending huge amounts of tanks into Russia before I am forced to respect Britian.



  • I can’t see the EE IC working out for Germany(feel free to try it when we play and you get the Axis, same with that Russian open if you’re Allies). If you’re determined to get infantry to the front quicker, build two transports in the Baltic. Since you’re willing to spend 15 IPC’s to get 3 infantry to the front a turn quicker, I assume that 16 IPC’s isn’t too steep to get 4 infantry to the front a turn quicker. That not only fast tracks to Karelia, it also threatens London(be sure to stage some fighters in WE in conjunction with this), keeps the Baltic ships alive at least until G2(unless the UK plays risky, dumb, or both), and allows Germany to trade Norway for a short time.

    I don’t like building boats(or IC’s for that matter) as Germany, typically I’m all inf/art/tanks, maybe a few fighters. If the conditions were good, maybe I would add a transport or two in the med if my ships are still around. The above is just IMO a better, more flexible method to get infantry to the front compared to a complex on EE and even then, you’re weak on ground purchases and without buying more, they won’t last deep into the game. G1 build 10 infantry, 2 tanks. G2 up to 10 inf move from Germany to EE. Compared to G1 build complex and 5 tanks. G2 build 3 infantry there. Perhaps over numerous rounds, the complex could get units there quicker, but a good player should probably be able to make you pay for that purchase before it has a chance to pay off. Just IMHO.



  • @jbriggs:

    well, I only wished you lived by me.  lol.  I’d be willing to show you how bad things would go for germany in the long run.  Short term yes you would have an upperhand.  Long term, however you’d leave yourself spread a little thin.  I have seen a counter attack like that a few times and I have tried it myself.  Attacking Karelia in force like that does strengthen your northern border but still leaves you 2 turns away from Russia, and leaves your interior a little thinned out.  You seem to play aggressive with Germany and that is fine, however you need to remember that Russia will have a slight advantage.  Since R1 Norway was taken and WR was taken, Russia is up + 5ipc’s.  Recapturing them only brings you back to even.  Russia will still be able to block your forces in archangel and counter attack WR from caucasas.  Yes casualties will be high for Russia but the bulk of your force will have been depleted.  You wouldn’t have the reinforcements needed to completely hurt Russia until your tanks were brought in.  Yes you would have infantry, but they are slow and very weak by themselves.  Since you left Britians fleet alone you will be counterattacked by British fleet at WE or Norway.  You will be forced to divert units to recapture WE the next round.

    Think long term…… Short term yes you will hurt Russia, but your aggression can possibly come back to haunt you.  I know this… I’ve seen it happen on both sides.

    However… If you are going to counter Russia you need to set up a supply line your first round.  What I always do is my first round purchase, I get an IC and place it in EE.  5 tanks for germany.  That will give you more firepower and flexibility.  You will see better results against Russia if you build an IC closer to the Russian Front.  You can get bigger units and your slower units to the front faster.  As Germany I always go after the british fleet first.  Troopships are my targets.  If I get rid of them, that buys me an extra round or to to keep sending huge amounts of tanks into Russia before I am forced to respect Britian.

    Thank god this is 2009 rather than 1989 and the internet exists so we dont have to play in your mom’s kitchen.  For kicks and giggles I decided to run your scenario on triplea playing your moves against my Axis response.

    Here is the Short-Term:  Unfortunately, you took 3 loses in WR and lost in Norway.  I actually had 1 fig and 1 inf survive against only one fighter (which Russia withdrew).  To better test your theory, I edited your second fighter back into Karelia.  Then the dice really went bad, plus I had an extra fig and inf to attack with.  WR - taken without loss - Germany has 6 inf, 1 art and 2 armor there.  Karelia - Taken with 2 inf loss - Germany holds 2 inf,  4 armor (and without any chance of losing them on counter, use 2 figs here).  SZ 13 (sub +4 figs) - taken with loss of sub, SZ 15 taken w/o loss (used Bomber and BB), Egypt - taken without loss.  I gave myself the standard 7 bid in Libya, Germany holds with 3 inf, 2 art, 1 armor.  I purchased 13 inf/1art.  Wishing know I had bought 8 tanks.

    I will let you know how it looks after Japan’s turn.



  • well see I’m still in the kitchen playing the game.  lol.  In my opinion it is more fun to sit around a table with friends and fo’s and have some beers with friendly compitition.  I’m in the process of building a game table with an enlarged map.  I just need to get ahold of your triple A game so I can play it with you online.  I might lose some, but I’ll win some as well.  message me outside this forum so we don’t confuse everyone else.  lol



  • @jbriggs:

    well see I’m still in the kitchen playing the game.  lol.  In my opinion it is more fun to sit around a table with friends and fo’s and have some beers with friendly compitition.  I’m in the process of building a game table with an enlarged map.  I just need to get ahold of your triple A game so I can play it with you online.  I might lose some, but I’ll win some as well.  message me outside this forum so we don’t confuse everyone else.  lol

    In an ideal world, thats how I would play too.  But until I conquer time and space this will have to suffice.  There is triplea software that allows you to play online located at sourceforge.net and gametableonline.com has A&A revised game online also.  If I messed up some of the sources, just google them and you should find them easily.  The thing I learned playing online is that in-preson groups fall into patterns where certain strategies might work, but if you go on-line you will find people that know better counters.



  • +1 karma to Spartan!

    Until I played by forum, I didn’t know how bad I was.  It’s really satisfying to get your butt handed to you by expert players.  Oh, I learned and learned.  I’m glad you are playing with a bid because without a bid…  It’s not funny.

    Allies have a big advantage in AAR and that advantage is huge against Axis but it needs coordination by all three allies, Russia, UK, US so when people talk about country specific strategy, they are missing out on the big picture.

    For a great Ally strategy, take a look at games by DM (Darth Maximus), I don’t think it get’s any better than that.  There’s an epic game going on between DM and JWW.

    Download the program AA Battlemap and download the maps for each turn and take a look at the buys, combat, and NCM and you will see what I mean.

    The strategies that might have worked in AA Classic doesn’t really work in AAR (other than the shuck shuck).

    A factory in India is what I call a Japanese IC not producing Japanese units yet, it will fall in 3 or 4 rounds unless Allies do a great coordinated KJF, which is really hard to do while keeping Germany busy.

    I still suck but suck less!



  • jbriggs,

    If it’s a game table you are building, please post pictures after you are done.

    Here is one that someone else built!

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=11461.0



  • @gnasape:

    A factory in India is what I call a Japanese IC not producing Japanese units yet, it will fall in 3 or 4 rounds unless Allies do a great coordinated KJF, which is really hard to do while keeping Germany busy.

    If things are going well elsewhere, I have no problem walling india off at FIC for awhile to build up an overwhelming force and get both battleships into position.  UK can not afford to spend 9 - 15 ipcs per turn in India and still land sufficient troops in Europe.  I can bleed off the UK resources letting them defend the undefendable.  USA in no position to help yet in Europe, while Jap moves through the northern and central routes to surround Moscow.  Jap has 4 less ipc’s a turn, but that is still a net gain in the game as UK is wasting 5-11 more per turn.


  • '16 '15 '10

    Yes I like the ignore India tact.  Transports based off Japan plus some gear in China can deadzone French Indochina.  If you push for Moscow, the Brits can wheel their tanks to Cauc to help Russia.  But if you suddenly land en masse and Fico they will need to pull back.

    Japan gets into trouble though if it loses its fleet–then India is an extra liability as Allied tanks blitz Asia.


  • 2007 AAR League

    Probe Ukr with Russia on R1. Do not take. This will save you the 3 arm plus the 1-3 you have purchased will prevent your opponent from going hard at you for many turns.  Its okay to lose battles if you take away his infantry wall. Noone in their right mind will attack without a wall of infantry in front of their armor, and if he is spending all his ipcs on armor, he will not have infantry by turn 3.



  • ah yes…… thats what I love about this game.  When I’m Germany I’ll usually attack Russia with a huge amount of tanks.  Yes they are expensive and yes I will lose a few, but using tanks will ultimately weaken the enemy and overwhelm them.  In order for me to pull this off though I usually will need an IC closer to the front lines with Russia.

    My first round purchase is usually 5 tanks and and IC to be placed in Eastern Europe.  Round 2 I purchase 8 tanks.  5 in Germany and 3 in Eastern Europe.  What this does is it gives me at least 8 tanks to hit ukraine and sweep through Russias northern territories.  I will have a few smaller units to have as fodder but my main assault force is driven by tanks.  It gives me more options in the long run and a little more mobility.  By turn 4 though I’d start getting some pressure from The allies over to the west, but With me being aggressive with my tank production to the east, I should have pushed The Russian lines back to Moscow at least and drastically cut russias options down to building infantry to defend the capital.

    I do understand that I’m leaving myself up to critisism from everyone else, but Thats ok.  I don’t do this everytime and I do vary my tactics a bit, but I like to remain unpredictable and attacking with my tanks like that usually will throw someone off their game plan a little.  Thats my overall objective.  I like to attack my opponents plans and not so much his armies.  If you throw off his plans and make him react to what you do, you in sense dictate the flow of battle and not him.  But regardless what you do you need to stick to your overall objectives.

    Like I said, I’ll get told by alot of you that this is a crappy way to play and I’m sure that alot of you will start talking statistics with me and tell me that my odds aren’t good, and I’d be losing to much IPC’s due to the cost of the tanks.  Duh… But everything doesn’t revolve around statistics all the time and you have to be willing to gamble a little.  Yes on paper throwing tanks into the grinder doesn’t seem to work out in the long run…but good commanders don’t just base their plans on statistics and odds.  If you play like that, I guarantee that you will become predictable and a smart opponent will figure out a way to overwhelm your thinking.  I will gladly sacrifice some IPC’s to remain productive.


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