AA50 Airunits ending Noncombat in Hostile Seazone

[Teferi]

Hello there! In the Axis and Allies League we are running right now, a Rules question came up. I shall summarize / quote the relevant rules sections as I understand them first ; outline the specific situation then, and do ask for your input:

1. Permissive Ruleset: Generally you are only permitted to do specific actions which you are given specific permission for - this is a Foundation of how the rules work, I think.

2. AA50, Rules, Phase 3: Combat: "(…) Move as many of your units into as many hostile territories and hostile seazones as you wish. Movement into a hostile territory counts as combat movement

3. Sea Zones "(…) Hostile sea zones contain enemy surface warships. (…)

4. Phase 5: Noncombat Move: In this phase, you can move any of your units (…) Only aircraft and submarines may move throgh hostile spaces during this phase.

5. (dito) Air Units: (…) Only fighters may land in a sea zone with a friendyl carrier present. (…) Additionally: (*) a fighter may land in a sea zone that is adjecent to an industrial complex you own if you will be placing an aircraft carrier that you previously purchased in that zone.

the specific Scenario: The British Fleet is in the Baltic SZ. The German Player has purchased Carriers and wishes to end his noncombat move with his fighters inside the hostile seazone of the Baltic Seazone. He stipulates, that he is permitted to end his move inside a hostile seazone, because he has bought and will place Carriers in the Mobilization Step of his turn.

The opposing stipulation is ; that you are only permitted to do specifically what you are being given permission. Moving into hostile spaces, both territories and seazones, is only permitted in the Combat Move. In the Noncombat Move, specifically, aircraft are only permitted to move through hostile spaces ; but are not given an exception to move into hostile spaces and end their movement. The additional rule does not negate other provisions such as moving through or ending in hostile spaces, as is given permission in Combatmove Phase - but rather, onto the given permissions, it adds another clause, but not an exception.

Which side is correct ?

[AndrewAAGamer]

The Axis Player.

Air units may enter a hostile space (makes no difference if land or sea) to conduct combat. They MUST have a legal landing zone to enter combat. Placing newly bought carriers into the Friendly or Hostile (depending on the battle results) sea zone is allowed. Therefore, the Air Units do have a legitimate landing space as described by landing on the future placed carrier(s)…

[AndrewAAGamer]

Reading it again it sounds like there is no combat occuring in the Baltic sea zone; that everything is happening during non-combat and mobilization. That doesn’t change things since the German Player is still landing his fighters in a legal landing area.

[Teferi]

@andrewaagamer
Correct, everything occurs in Noncombat move and Mobilization.

Why would you assume, that the additional Rule (not replacing, not exempting, but adding) about the carrier vehicle permitting landing, would overrule the immediately previous rule, in the same paragraph, that Aircraft may move through hostile spaces, where only the Combat Move Phase specifically tells you that you may move into hostile spaces?

Why would an additonal rule ontop of the previous Statement in Noncombat Move create an Exception? Why does it specify moving through hostile spaces in noncombat as permitted for aircraft, but not into

whereas meanwhile, in the Combat Move Phase, specifically, moving into hostile spaces is permitted.

.

I do not understand I think, at which point it is decided that the additional option will ignore other restrictions. Moving into a Seazone with a Carrier does not permit moving into a hostile seazone in noncombat at any point.

Can you try to explain further?

[AndrewAAGamer]

No additional rules are being added. The fighter is following the pre-existing rules.

A) it has a legitimate landing zone on a friendly carrier
B) that landing zone may be on a newly built carrier

The fact that the SZ is Hostile is irrelevant as the Combat Phase is over and as the rules state fighters can ignore the Hostile sea zone they are flying through during the Non-Combat Phase to get to their legitimate landing area. In this case a carrier that happens to be in a Hostile Zone; that the carrier is also allowed to ignore based on the mobilization rules.

[AndrewAAGamer]

I think what is confusing you is you are thinking of the sea zone as Hostile and it is not as far as the air unit is concerned.

Since the air unit treats the Hostile sea zone as Friendly it then can land on the legal carrier slot being newly placed.

[Sensenschwarm]

Rulebook 2017 Page 21;

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„A Fighter may land in a seazone (even a hostile one) that is adjacent to an industrial complex you own if you will be placing an aircraft carrier that you previously purchased in that zone.

[Teferi]

@sensenschwarm thank you.

this rule was expanded in the reprint of anniversary edition - but not in the PDF Rulebook on axisandallies.com, and not in the FAQ/Errata, and in my physical copy of the original AA50, it is the version which I had quoted above.

The issue is resolved! Thanks alot! :-)