Alpha 3 European Allied Defense (Need Help)

[Clyde85]

I think using the remaining UK fleet in a suicide charge against the German fleet is the best option I’ve heard so far. The more damage you can cause to the German invasion force the better, and IF you manage to wipe his surface fleet, but lose everything in the process then you’ve still won as the German ability to invade London will have gone. So even though its a big loss of material for the UK you will have safeguarded the capitol.

I would try that in conjunction with a Soviet build up on the German border, the more you pressure him the better.

[theROCmonster]

Honestly though hearing from what you are saying UK falls almost every game… Seems to me like somethings got to give :/

[otahere34]

What exactly are the new rules? this doesn’t sound like the alpha 3 version I have.

[Guest]

Don’t scramble, fly planes home, build infantry, pray for good dice, and move on.  America is coming.

[Redjac]

The very latest Alpha 3 removed the British Fighter in Normandy, the Airbase in Gibraltar, and added 1 Bomber to both London and Berlin.

In addition, the bombing rules changed to make Bombers do 1d6+2 damage on strategic bombing raids. Combined with a change to make all aircraft hit on a 1 on a d6 during air combat before a raid means it is very possible to bomb London on G1 and G2 to reduce the number of defenders you face as the German on G3.

Favoring the Allies, the Axis no longer have a NO bonus when occupying London, and the Russians (and the Americans) can declare war on their turn anytime after London has fallen to the Axis. So you can set up the Russians to invade Poland, Romania, etc, on R3. I have just never tried it, so was asking the forum if anyone had and for their results.

We are playing again this weekend. I will play all the allies. I will buy 6 Russian Tanks on R1 if Germany does a Sea Lion build on G1, and set up to invade Romania on R3 if he builds the transports on G2. We will see how it plays out.

[Clyde85]

@Redjac:

Combined with a change to make all aircraft hit on a 1 on a d6 during air combat before a raid means it is very possible to bomb London on G1 and G2 to reduce the number of defenders you face as the German on G3.

I think this is a misunderstanding of the rules, as I think that those rules are for Strategic Bombing Raids (or SBR) and only count if the German bomber is trying to bomb one of your bases or IC. If the Germans send their bombers to hit ground targets(infantry, arty and what-not) then everything hits at normal defense. Meaning that the German player has sent his bomber on a suicide run, which is kinda dumb.

[Redjac]

Clyde is correct. The new aircraft rules apply only to strategic bombing raids. And that is what I am talking about.

Imagine London is not bombed via strategic bombing raids on G1 and G2. Assume also no convoy disruption and DD and TR are killed off the coast of Canada. What do they have for defense for Sea Lion on G3? They have 21 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 7 Fighters, 1 Tactical Bomber, 4 Anti-Aircraft Guns, and 1 Bomber for defense. This assumes they built maximum Infantry and saved enough to build a Fighter on UK 2 and flew the planes from Africa to England.

Now if the Germans successfully attack with strategic bombing raids on G1 and G2? What do the English have to defend on G3? They have only 16 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 6 Fighters, 1 Tactical Bomber, 4 Anti-Aircraft Guns and 1 Bomber. This assumes 11 damage on each strategic bombing raid and all other facts the same.

The Germans roll over the English on G3 easy. Only way to even slow it down is to get lucky on some sea battles on UK1 or UK2.

[Clyde85]

If by the end of G1 you have 1 battleship and 2 destroyers off the coast of England, and the Cruiser in sz91 then I would say that on UK1 you should go for an all out attack on the German position in sz112 along with all your airforces. Its a suicude rush I know and you wont likely win, but you will cause a lot of damage and disrupt their invasion plan for a turn and that could make all the difference. Its risky but I’d bet the German player wont be expecting it. I’d even go so far as to say he might not have his airforce concentrated in W. Germany to scramble in response becuase he’ll be thinking you’re going to husbanding your forces to try and hold London.

Now, before everybody can call me crazy for suggesting this, I know that its risky and that odds are you will lose everything. I also know that this is completely subjective to what happens on the Germans first turn, what goes where, how many casualties they take, what they buy. I also know that this is likely only going to work once against an opponent, as once they see it happen they will always make sure to guard against it in later games, and before everyone picks this apart with the usual “well i’d just do X if you did Y” please realize that if you know a move like this is comming you can always find ways to counter it. That said, a bold an unexpected move can radically change a game and un-nerve a player and the is something to be said for gaining a psychological edge over an opponent.

[Redjac]

Clyde,

I tried the British attack on the German fleet on UK1. With 1 DD, 1 BB, 2 CA, 3 FTR, and 1 SBR attacking the fleet it went very well. The German AC, BB, CA and were burning wrecks and his planes went down in the ocean. At that point Germany must build a new navy, which means less money for transports, or give up Sea Lion.

Nevertheless it is a risky attack in that both sides are about equal strength. But when you realize you have nothing really to do with the remainder of the British navy and that you can retreat after the first round of combat to save your planes then it is not such a bad attack. Roll well the first round, stay and wipe out the German navy. Roll bad, take the losses on the British navy and retreat the planes back to England.

Also it is not so easy for the Germans to defend against even when they know it is coming. One of the fighters flies on to Italy after the battle. A good many of the others land in Belgium/Holland preventing them from scrambling to help the German navy’s defense. For example any fighters or tactical bombers that attack London proper in a raid or attack the DD and TR near England cannot land in Western Germany. They must land in Holland/Belgium.

So if he commits a number of fighters to the strategic bombing raid on London, at least those planes must land on a carrier or Holland/Belgium. It is something at least.

[theROCmonster]

This really breaks the game. If germany builds a carrier destroyer sub first turn I don’t see how UK can attack the fleet as germany has like a 90% chance at least to win. I really think UK needs some more defense or something. I don’t know how the allies can win with a succesfull sea lion early on like this…

[Clyde85]

See, in my old games I wouldnt place the fighter ment for Normandy in Normandy, I’d but it in London. Since its removal from the game with Alpha 3 I continue to place it in London so I usually have an extra fighter. It makes the defense a bit stronger.

[Redjac]

theRocmonster,

You are correct that if Germany builds a carrier, destroyer and submarine on G1 and brings in some planes to scramble from Western Germany it is very hard for the British navy to drive them from the sea on UK1.

The German assault on England via Sea Lion on G3 is not automatic. They have to successfully complete two strategic bombing raids and repel the British navy on Uk1 with little or no loss to their air force. But you are right, if they do, they only face 16 Infantry (on average), 1 Artillery, 6 Fighters (assuming they lost none in interceptor duty), 1 Tactical Bomber, 1 Bomber, and 4 Anti-Aircraft Guns. The Germans will bring 22 ground troops, 5 Fighters, 5 Tactical Bombers and 2 Strategic Bombers. Even with the Anti-Aircraft Guns the Germans should roll over the British.

But I don’t see any way to stop Sea Lion. Unless the game designer intended for Sea Lion to be a weak strategy because of the removal of the German NO for London and the new rule allowing Russia to invade if London falls.

I just have not played any games where London fell under the new rules so I don’t know how the Russian offensive strategy will play out vs Germany and the Balkans on R3. As soon as I do, I will let you know.