Classic 2nd edition, CrazyIvan (Allies) vs AcesWild (Axis), RR no bid regular dice, Game 2

[The_Good_Captain]

TripleA Turn Summary: Germans round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Classic, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - Germans
        Germans buy 5 armour and 2 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Germans
        2 armour, 1 fighter and 3 infantry moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 armour, 1 fighter and 3 infantry moved from East Europe to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 armour, 1 fighter and 3 infantry moved from Finland Norway to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 fighter moved from Germany to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 armour moved from South Europe to Karelia S.S.R.
        2 armour moved from Germany to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 bomber moved from Germany to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 fighter moved from West Europe to Karelia S.S.R.
        2 infantry moved from Germany to Baltic Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Baltic Sea Zone to Karelia S.S.R.
        2 infantry moved from South Europe to Central Mediteranean Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from Central Mediteranean Sea Zone to Black Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Black Sea Zone to Caucasus
        1 battleship moved from Central Mediteranean Sea Zone to Black Sea Zone
        1 submarine moved from West Spain Sea Zone to East Canada Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Algeria to French West Africa
              Germans take French West Africa from British
        1 armour moved from Libya to Congo
              Germans take French Equatorial Africa from British
              Germans take Congo from British

    Combat - Germans
        Battle in East Canada Sea Zone
            Germans attack with 1 submarine
            British defend with 1 transport
                Germans roll dice for 1 submarine in East Canada Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 transport owned by the British lost in East Canada Sea Zone
            Germans win with 1 submarine remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
            Casualties for British: 1 transport
        Battle in Caucasus
            Germans attack with 2 infantry
            Russians defend with 1 infantry
                Germans roll dice for 1 battleship in Caucasus, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Caucasus, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Caucasus
            Germans win, taking Caucasus from Russians with 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
        Battle in Karelia S.S.R.
            Germans attack with 7 armour, 1 bomber, 5 fighters and 11 infantry
            Russians defend with 1 aaGun, 1 factory, 2 fighters and 18 infantry
                AA fire in Karelia S.S.R. : 2/6 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                2 fighters owned by the Germans lost in Karelia S.S.R.
                Germans roll dice for 7 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 11 infantry in Karelia S.S.R., round 2 : 8/22 hits, 7.50 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 2 fighters and 18 infantry in Karelia S.S.R., round 2 : 7/20 hits, 7.33 expected hits
                8 infantry owned by the Russians and 7 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Karelia S.S.R.
                Germans roll dice for 7 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 4 infantry in Karelia S.S.R., round 3 : 8/15 hits, 6.33 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 2 fighters and 10 infantry in Karelia S.S.R., round 3 : 5/12 hits, 4.67 expected hits
                8 infantry owned by the Russians, 4 infantry owned by the Germans and 1 armour owned by the Germans lost in Karelia S.S.R.
                Germans roll dice for 6 armour, 1 bomber and 3 fighters in Karelia S.S.R., round 4 : 4/10 hits, 5.17 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 2 fighters and 2 infantry in Karelia S.S.R., round 4 : 2/4 hits, 2.00 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Russians, 2 fighters owned by the Russians and 2 armour owned by the Germans lost in Karelia S.S.R.
            Germans win, taking Karelia S.S.R. from Russians with 4 armour, 1 bomber and 3 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
            Casualties for Germans: 3 armour, 2 fighters and 11 infantry
            Casualties for Russians: 2 fighters and 18 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Germans
        1 fighter moved from Karelia S.S.R. to Germany
        2 fighters moved from Karelia S.S.R. to East Europe
        2 infantry moved from Germany to East Europe
        1 bomber moved from Karelia S.S.R. to East Europe
        2 armour moved from West Europe to East Europe
        1 infantry moved from West Europe to Germany
        1 aaGun moved from South Europe to East Europe
        1 aaGun moved from West Europe to South Europe
        1 infantry moved from Libya to French Equatorial Africa

    Place Units - Germans
        5 armour and 2 infantry placed in Germany

    Turn Complete - Germans
        Germans collect 41 PUs; end with 42 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans : 2.00
AA fire in Karelia S.S.R. : : 1.00
Russians : -0.33

Savegame

[CrazyIvan]

I’m still having some issues, it seems.

[CrazyIvan]

Ok, so I was attempting to play around using the TripleA engine, with our game, and run through several turns of different ideas. I didn’t save/post any turns, as I was just trying out some ideas, and I couldn’t actually get to the USA 1 turn without having the Japanese do nothing on J1, so I just wanted to playtest some stuff out, but it looks like I cannot playtest a game without generating actual dice server emails.

Not sure if this is because I loaded up a PBF save game, in PBF mode, and then playtested it, or should have loaded it up as a local game in order to playtest it, or if there is some other way to playtest a given position, without it triggering dice server roll emails.

I’m ok with the playtest results if you want me to use those dice rolls, but I don’t have a save game file from that stage. I ran up to R3 in my playtest, IIRC, but the dice server emails seem to have only covered my B1 turn.

I’m sorry, I don’t mean to be a problem, I’m just having trouble figuring things out. So I should probably ask the following questions:

1. When playing a PBF game, is there a way to playtest out different options/ideas, without triggering dice server emails in the process?

2. If you do playtest out several turns ahead, is there a way to go back and just save the game at the point where you should have saved it as an actual turn?

Because right now, when I tried to go back and recreate B1, I tried to just walk the game to the end of the B1 turn, and save at that point, thinking that even though I had not actually been sure I wanted to go that route, that was the closest I was going to be able to come to a legit B1. Unfortunately, the autosave file is from B2 or B3, which is where I had playtested too until called away, and when I returned, that is when I discovered the playtesting had in fact triggered server dice roll emails for my B1 runthrough.

[CrazyIvan]

Actually, now that I’m looking at it, every allied turn in round 1 seems to have generated dice rolls, including B2, and the taking of western europe. I keep having throbbing, pulsating pain in my right eye, and it is coming and going for the last several hours.

[The_Good_Captain]

@CrazyIvan I’ve made this mistake before. The trick to playtesting your turn without reporting is to “Start Local Game” after you download the most recent file. Then you can roll away to your hearts content and it wont saturate my inbox haha.

As to what is going on with your game, I’m not sure. You might want to ask the forum vets to help you out. I’m not a AAA expert I’m sorry to say.

I’d prefer that you complete B1 followed by an immediate post die roll post of your turn. I haven’t looked at the rolls and my vote is to just redo B1 and submit successfully, then we’ll count it.

[CrazyIvan]

TripleA Turn Summary: British round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Classic, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 1 carrier, 1 infantry and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
                AA fire in East Europe : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits
        1 bomber moved from United Kingdom to Black Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from West Mediteranean Sea Zone to Black Sea Zone
        1 submarine moved from East Mediteranean Sea Zone to Black Sea Zone
        2 fighters moved from United Kingdom to Baltic Sea Zone
        1 armour moved from Anglo Sudan Egypt to Algeria
              British take Libya from Germans
              British take Algeria from Germans
        2 infantry moved from India to Indian Ocean Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from Indian Ocean Sea Zone to Red Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Red Sea Zone to Anglo Sudan Egypt
        1 infantry moved from Syria Jordan to Anglo Sudan Egypt
        1 infantry moved from South Africa to Kenya-Rhodesia
        1 armour moved from East Canada to West Canada
        2 infantry moved from United Kingdom to North Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from North Sea Zone to Finland Norway
              British take Finland Norway from Germans

    Combat - British
        Battle in Baltic Sea Zone
            British attack with 2 fighters
            Germans defend with 1 submarine and 1 transport
                British roll dice for 2 fighters in Baltic Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 transport in Baltic Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits
                British roll dice for 2 fighters in Baltic Sea Zone, round 3 : 0/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 transport in Baltic Sea Zone, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits
                British roll dice for 2 fighters in Baltic Sea Zone, round 4 : 0/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 transport in Baltic Sea Zone, round 4 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits
                British roll dice for 2 fighters in Baltic Sea Zone, round 5 : 1/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 transport in Baltic Sea Zone, round 5 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits
                1 submarine owned by the Germans lost in Baltic Sea Zone
                British roll dice for 2 fighters in Baltic Sea Zone, round 6 : 2/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 transport in Baltic Sea Zone, round 6 : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits
                1 transport owned by the Germans lost in Baltic Sea Zone
            British win with 2 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 16
            Casualties for Germans: 1 submarine and 1 transport
        Battle in Black Sea Zone
            British attack with 1 battleship, 1 bomber and 1 submarine
            Germans defend with 1 battleship and 1 transport
                British roll dice for 1 submarine in Black Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                British roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 bomber in Black Sea Zone, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 1.33 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 transport in Black Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0.83 expected hits
                1 battleship owned by the Germans and 1 transport owned by the Germans lost in Black Sea Zone
            British win with 1 battleship, 1 bomber and 1 submarine remaining. Battle score for attacker is 32
            Casualties for Germans: 1 battleship and 1 transport

    Non Combat Move - British
        2 fighters moved from Baltic Sea Zone to Russia
        1 fighter moved from India to Russia
        1 bomber moved from Black Sea Zone to Anglo Sudan Egypt

    Place Units - British
        1 infantry placed in United Kingdom
        1 carrier and 1 transport placed in North Sea Zone

    Turn Complete - British
        British collect 31 PUs; end with 32 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans : -1.67
British : -1.67
AA fire in East Europe : : -0.17

Savegame

[CrazyIvan]

Alright! And sorry for all the problems. Let me hit that real quick.

[CrazyIvan]

Alright! Got that turn done, AND properly posted, back to Japan for their J!.

10:21pm, June 4th.

[The_Good_Captain]

TripleA Turn Summary: Japanese round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Classic, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - Japanese
        Japanese buy 3 transports; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Japanese
        3 infantry moved from Manchuria to China
        2 infantry moved from Kwangtung to China
        1 infantry moved from French Indo China to India
              Japanese take India from British
        1 fighter moved from French Indo China to China
        1 fighter moved from Manchuria to China
        1 fighter moved from Japan to China
        1 bomber moved from Japan to China

    Combat - Japanese
        Battle in China
            Japanese attack with 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 5 infantry
            Americans defend with 1 fighter and 2 infantry
                Japanese roll dice for 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 5 infantry in China, round 2 : 4/9 hits, 3.00 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 1 fighter and 2 infantry in China, round 2 : 2/3 hits, 1.33 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Japanese, 2 infantry owned by the Americans and 1 fighter owned by the Americans lost in China
            Japanese win, taking China from Americans with 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 3 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 12
            Casualties for Japanese: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Americans: 1 fighter and 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Japanese
        3 fighters moved from China to Manchuria
        1 bomber moved from China to Manchuria
        1 infantry moved from Japan to Japan Sea Zone
        1 infantry and 1 transport moved from Japan Sea Zone to Okinawa Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Okinawa to Okinawa Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from Okinawa Sea Zone to Japan Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Japan Sea Zone to Manchuria
        1 infantry moved from Philippines to Philippines Sea Zone
        1 infantry and 1 transport moved from Philippines Sea Zone to Japan Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Japan to Japan Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Japan Sea Zone to Manchuria
        1 fighter moved from Caroline Islands Sea Zone to Japan Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Philippines to Japan Sea Zone
        1 carrier moved from Caroline Islands Sea Zone to Japan Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from Caroline Islands Sea Zone to Japan Sea Zone
        1 submarine moved from Solomon Islands Sea Zone to Japan Sea Zone

    Place Units - Japanese
        3 transports placed in Japan Sea Zone

    Turn Complete - Japanese
        Japanese collect 30 PUs; end with 31 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Americans : 0.67
Japanese : 1.00

Savegame

[CrazyIvan]

TripleA Turn Summary: Americans round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Classic, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 1 infantry and 4 submarines; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Americans
        1 fighter moved from West US to East Canada Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from East US to East Canada Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from East US to East US Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from East US Sea Zone to West Spain Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from West Spain Sea Zone to West Europe
        1 bomber moved from East US to West Europe

    Combat - Americans
        Battle in West Europe
            Americans attack with 1 bomber and 2 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 infantry
                Americans roll dice for 1 bomber and 2 infantry in West Europe, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in West Europe, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in West Europe
            Americans win, taking West Europe from Germans with 1 bomber and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry
        Battle in East Canada Sea Zone
            Americans attack with 2 fighters
            Germans defend with 1 submarine
                Americans roll dice for 2 fighters in East Canada Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                1 submarine owned by the Germans lost in East Canada Sea Zone
            Americans win with 2 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
            Casualties for Germans: 1 submarine

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        2 fighters moved from East Canada Sea Zone to North Sea Zone
        1 armour moved from East US to East Canada
        2 infantry moved from West US to West Canada
        1 carrier, 1 fighter and 1 submarine moved from Hawaii Sea Zone to West US Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from West Europe to United Kingdom

    Place Units - Americans
        4 submarines placed in West US Sea Zone
        1 infantry placed in West US

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 40 PUs; end with 41 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans : -0.33
Americans : 0.00

Savegame

[CrazyIvan]

TripleA Turn Summary: Russians round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Classic, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Russians
        Russians buy 8 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Russians
        3 armour moved from Persia to India
        1 infantry moved from Persia to India
        1 armour moved from Novosibirsk to India

    Combat - Russians
        Battle in India
            Russians attack with 4 armour and 1 infantry
            Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 4 armour and 1 infantry in India, round 2 : 2/5 hits, 2.17 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in India, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese lost in India
            Russians win, taking India from Japanese with 4 armour and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Russians
        6 infantry moved from Yakut S.S.R. to Novosibirsk
        1 infantry moved from Soviet Far East to Yakut S.S.R.

    Place Units - Russians
        8 infantry placed in Russia

    Turn Complete - Russians
        Russians collect 18 PUs; end with 18 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Russians : -0.17
Japanese : -0.33

Savegame

[CrazyIvan]

Almost forgot to do the Russians 2.
12:46 am, June 6th.

[The_Good_Captain]

TripleA Turn Summary: Germans round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Classic, version: 2.0

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Germans
        Germans buy 14 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Germans
        2 infantry moved from Germany to West Europe
        1 armour moved from Germany to West Europe
        4 armour moved from Karelia S.S.R. to Russia
        2 infantry moved from Caucasus to Russia
        2 fighters moved from East Europe to Russia
        1 bomber moved from East Europe to Russia
        1 fighter moved from Germany to Russia
        2 armour moved from East Europe to Russia
        1 infantry moved from Germany to West Europe

    Combat - Germans
        Battle in West Europe
            Germans attack with 1 armour and 3 infantry
            Americans defend with 2 infantry
                Germans roll dice for 1 armour and 3 infantry in West Europe, round 2 : 0/4 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 2 infantry in West Europe, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 armour and 3 infantry in West Europe, round 3 : 1/4 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 2 infantry in West Europe, round 3 : 1/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Germans and 1 infantry owned by the Americans lost in West Europe
                Germans roll dice for 1 armour and 2 infantry in West Europe, round 4 : 0/3 hits, 0.83 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 1 infantry in West Europe, round 4 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in West Europe
                Germans roll dice for 1 armour and 1 infantry in West Europe, round 5 : 1/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 1 infantry in West Europe, round 5 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Americans lost in West Europe
            Germans win, taking West Europe from Americans with 1 armour and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Germans: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Americans: 2 infantry
        Battle in Russia
            Germans attack with 6 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 2 infantry
            British defend with 3 fighters; Russians defend with 1 aaGun, 1 factory and 8 infantry
                AA fire in Russia : 0/4 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 6 armour, 1 bomber, 3 fighters and 2 infantry in Russia, round 2 : 9/12 hits, 5.50 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 3 fighters and 8 infantry in Russia, round 2 : 4/11 hits, 4.67 expected hits
                8 infantry owned by the Russians, 2 infantry owned by the Germans, 2 armour owned by the Germans and 1 fighter owned by the British lost in Russia
                Germans roll dice for 4 armour, 1 bomber and 3 fighters in Russia, round 3 : 6/8 hits, 4.17 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 2 fighters in Russia, round 3 : 2/2 hits, 1.33 expected hits
                2 armour owned by the Germans and 2 fighters owned by the British lost in Russia
            Germans captures 18PUs while taking Russians capital
            Germans win, taking Russia from Russians with 2 armour, 1 bomber and 3 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 34
            Casualties for Germans: 4 armour and 2 infantry
            Casualties for British: 3 fighters
            Casualties for Russians: 8 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Germans
        1 armour moved from Congo to French West Africa
        1 infantry moved from French Equatorial Africa to French West Africa
        1 aaGun moved from South Europe to West Europe
        1 aaGun moved from East Europe to South Europe
        2 infantry moved from East Europe to Karelia S.S.R.
        3 fighters moved from Russia to Karelia S.S.R.
        1 bomber moved from Russia to Germany

    Place Units - Germans
        3 infantry placed in Karelia S.S.R.
        4 infantry placed in South Europe
        7 infantry placed in Germany
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Removing units owned by Germans from Germany: 1 armour
        EDIT: Adding units owned by Germans to Karelia S.S.R.: 1 armour
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

    Turn Complete - Germans
        Germans collect 45 PUs; end with 63 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans : 3.83
AA fire in Russia : : -0.67
Americans : 0.00
Russians : -0.00

Savegame

[CrazyIvan]

:skull_and_crossbones:
And Game two ends in a resounding loss for the allies.:relaxed:

[The_Good_Captain]

@CrazyIvan

It could have just as easily failed but I saw that instead of having 19 troops in Russia, you had 18. That moved the dial of success from 80% to 90%, just enough for me to take the risk. (In fact, I’ve adjusted my basic allied strategy somewhat by stripping a tank from the Middle East venture and adding it to Karelia, reducing the German chance of success to roughly 70%, which IMO is definitely not worth it as the Germans. The Russian deterrent is still quite potent with two tanks in ME.)

Otherwise, the strategy you were using looked both familiar and terrifying so I went for the opportunity that I saw available and it worked out, though I should have lost another tank and plane when taking Russia’s capital, lucky me again.

[The_Good_Captain]

@CrazyIvan

I recommend using the in game battle calculator as much as possible.

Example: At the beginning of turn 2, it may have been useful for you to notice that I had roughly a 60% chance of success with the forces I could throw at Moscow against the 8 inf and 3 fighters you decided to defend it with. Adding a single one of your Russian tanks would have reduced that to something like 43% and adding two tanks would have made it a 25%. Adding all four would have reduced it to less than 5%.

As for myself, even though I don’t like attacking with just 60% odds, in this case it was a capital and so I don’t care if i lose everything but one tank I’m taking that chance.

esp with how aggressive you were in India, poised roll the Japanese back!

*of course all this would sound meaningless if my attack had failed

[CrazyIvan]

Heh heh, I agree! I’m not good enough to hold the line it seems. Two games, two crushings, in less than two turns!

You had good rolls (more than probability would suggest) in both German attacks that mattered, but not so good that it was all that big a deal, except that the two battles were won on game-determination territories (Karelia & Russia). At one point, I saw 9 hits out of 12 rolls, and just shook my head. Keeping in mind that 12 bombers attacking @4 = 48/6 = 8 hits!! So, regular dice can tip the scales far in one direction, and no amount of skill or strategy can prevent that. When these battles are in game determining places, all is for naught.

For my own calculations, regular dice prevent any meaningful statistical visualization of how a turn will go. I saw the odds in the calculator, after I made my R1, non-combat moves, but, unless I was willing to mass virtually everything in Karelia, and thus make africa a cakewalk for G1, I didn’t see any other options open to contain Germany.

When I gamed out the standard G1 all in attack, years ago, you get the famous 7-11 + 5-1, and like in real life, the best defense is a strong offense, but RR removes that from the game. Thus, either the Russians are forced to assume a totally passively defensive stance…

My worthy opponent has just posted a turn, back after seeing what new and dastardly deeds await me. :)

[The_Good_Captain]

yes, the dice were hot for the Germans when the actual capital attack occurred, not on the karelia attack. in fact, you brought down two fighters with the AA gun. That one came through almost exactly par for the course.

And to go a step further, on the entirety of turn one, of the 10 dice where you needed a four or less to secure a hit, you did so 9 out of 10 times. All your other columns were more or less on par. I record all the hit stats and will publish them after I rack up more games but would be willing to share them with you if you give me an email to send them to.

Just to clarify, during the battle for Moscow, I agree I had very good luck with the 3 column, but 60% of the time, I would have had the same result, it was just a matter of what was left over and I was ready to burn my entire air force to save one tank and secure that territory.

[CrazyIvan]

I’m about to get nailed in my other game, I think. Took a risk, and may have to pay for it.

Ok, back to our latest game:

@AcesWild5049 said in Classic 2nd edition, CrazyIvan (Allies) vs AcesWild (Axis), RR no bid regular dice, Game 2:

yes, the dice were hot for the Germans when the actual capital attack occurred, not on the karelia attack. in fact, you brought down two fighters with the AA gun. That one came through almost exactly par for the course.

I noticed the extra fighter loss (two AA hits out of 6) in the Karelia battle, but have to disagree with the assessment that the dice were not ‘hot’ in that battle, as well. I’ll post an analysis via screen shots of the ingame dice rolls. I’m not great at that, so it may be some time before I can get them up and running, and if gribble hits me tonight, I’ll have to respond, so it may not be till tomorrow…heh heh, it’s already tomorrow, lol. That said, even had you suffered bad luck instead of good luck in the Karelia battle, it is almost always going to be a German win, the only question is what they have left, and if the UK can come in and retake.

And to go a step further, on the entirety of turn one, of the 10 dice where you needed a four or less to secure a hit, you did so 9 out of 10 times. All your other columns were more or less on par. I record all the hit stats and will publish them after I rack up more games but would be willing to share them with you if you give me an email to send them to.

I did? :)

Just to clarify, during the battle for Moscow, I agree I had very good luck with the 3 column, but 60% of the time, I would have had the same result, it was just a matter of what was left over and I was ready to burn my entire air force to save one tank and secure that territory.

Oh, I agree. Both the Karelia and Russia battles were likely German wins, but that is what happens when we break the game with the whole RR. If we play without RR, the Germans are not handed a choice of which (freebie) they want to pursue in a particular game, but have to make some hard choices.

I’ve seen Russia be able to be as badly over aggressive that the game ends early on, like ours just did, but I think that there are three areas I would address to try to balance out the game, and those would be a less restrictive RR, LL vs regular dice, and the house rule stuff I’m working on for the naval situation.

Basically, the way I see it is that with the current RR rule, Russia has to turtle up, and the most daring thing they be allowed to do is, (maybe) send some tanks to the middle east, instead of, you know, getting some licks in! :)

Otherwise, can you imagine a 5 player game, where one player is stuck with playing a RR Russia? No one is going to enjoy that experience, with the possible exception of experts, and that is likely as not going to kill the game. If no one wants to play Russia, and folks start to drop out for having to play that way, then the game dies (as it has). Make the RR less restrictive, and more folks will be willing to at least try their hand at Russia, what with only one hand tied behind their back. :)

Anyway, I don’t like to lose (especially in less than two turns), but I do want to work with you towards a fun and balanced version of classic! Hopefully, we can succeed in getting a variation that works for most folks, and brings this great game back into popularity.

I have some work to do from now till tuesday, and so will have to wait till next week to start our game three. What is your playing time calendar looking like next week? :)

[The_Good_Captain]

You are the first I’ve heard to offer that RR breaks the game in favor of the axis. Without it, the game very nearly is broken in favor of the allies due to the ahistorical R1 Ukraine attack. For the record, I’ve lost as many games as I’ve won as the axis using RR and Avin and DizzKneeLand, who were my regular opponents, both agree and, further, have started to convince me that the axis needs even more help than just RR.

I’m really opposed to the concept of low-luck dice and house rules. I don’t mind playing games of classic with you by any means but it doesn’t sound like a collaboration will bear any fruit.

I think RR pretty much balances the game as of this writing. If the axis need a boost, the adjustments I would make would be adding one German infantry to the Ukraine and removing one soviet infantry from Evenki National Okrug, that’s it. That’s as intense as it would need to get IMO.