What to do with Italy

Germany helping Italy in the Med all depends on if you are looking to knock Russia out with a quick punch or throttle them slowly to death. If you’re taking the long game approach, a German fleet in the Med is worth every IPC. It creates an incredible headache for the Allied player who expects to dominate the Med early. Then it becomes an arms race, and guess who is closer to their supply lines?

And once the Med becomes an arms race, the Allied player often stops buying as much with the US in the Pacific… and Japan can wear down Russia from the back.

Just general thoughts - game by game will obviously be variable.

There are some extraordinary circumstances when Italy should own it such as when Russia is about to fall, and therefore Italy can make better use of the Ukraine factory (for the Middle East).  But in most games Germany should own it because they need to build infantry and artillery there to attack Russia.

@Young:

@UKMaverick:

By leaving the UK boats alone after the Taranto raid, isn’t this detrimental to Italy in regards to the convoy zone? Can they afford to lose the max amount of IPCs by not attacking the Brits? I realize the French boats can escape into the Atlantic or hit your remaining fleet off of Rome, but you can still scramble there. I tried YG’s Italian move after being decimated R1 in Taranto and off of Malta then was convoyed so I didn’t really make any money. Just looking for more opinions on this. Thanks as always.

The Axis must try to control the Med Sea, even if Taranto gets smashed, and even if the idea of controlling Egypt is lost… because if the Med Sea belongs to the Allies, Rome will soon follow.

Understandable, I guess I was just curious if the Italians should take it out even if for example a loaded carrier and a destroyer is remaining after Taranto? After you hit southern France’s boats you’re virtually left with A couple boats anyways, and you bank around 16/17 IPCs depending on what you attack, not 7ish. Let the French escape or come in to try and wipe the rest of the Italian fleet out? I don’t know honestly. This is my first game with the axis using the 2nd edition setup. It’s only round 2 and I feel Germany and Italy are both weak and not in position to do a successful push into Russia by say round 3. I could be wrong since I’m normally a Debbie downer ha.

In the games a played it seemed that Japan could help the European Axis more by getting in positon to have enough victory cities on their side of the map than really pushing towards Russia.  If Japan pushes to Russia then USA is free to keep spending in Europe.  Maybe I will give this a try though with the newer edition of rules.

Italy’s job is threefold:
1:  Keep the UK spending to crush Italy
2:  Assist in Russia
3:  Lure the US Fleet past Gib and into the Med

With that being said, the Italian Navy is important to protect, requiring a DD to be purchased in Round 1.  This will draw more UK attention to the Med, which gives Germany more breathing room to advance on Moscow.  Provided your fleet was not decimated in SZ97, ferry units into Yugo with the TT and at least 1 Armor, possibly 2.

Assisting with Russia being your second goal pretty much requires that Italy activates Bulgaria on Round 1 and Italy either reinforcing the German Flank in Romania on I2 or if there is no immediate threat, clearing out Greece before the Brits activate it.  If Italy purchases a Bomber on Round 2, it puts 2 Bombers and somewhere in the range of 6-8 Inf plus 2 Armor in range of Eastern Poland, or Bess.  You even have a shot to can open Western Ukraine at this point, or if Russia is really incompetent, Ukraine MAY be open via an Armor Blitz (provided 2 Armor went into Yugo on Round 1, and reinforced Romania on I2.)  In any case, Italy can stand to gain some IPC and really create problems on the German Southern Flank in Russia.

As for the last goal for Italy, you need to continue to engage the UK into the Med through the time the US enters the war.  Usually this requires naval investments, I prefer to try to get at least 1 DD in every round.  At some point you’ll need to redirect your Bombers back to Rome / Southern France.  You’re goal is to force the Allies to defend SZ91 and interrupt the US TT rotation.  You need to be very opportunistic here and wait for the Allies to expose TT as lightly defended.  This doesn’t always happen, but it is devastating when it does and you can fly 2-3 Bombers and a send a few SS to potentially sink the TT rotation and buy breathing room.  If this doesn’t look like it could happen, you just have to turtle up and encourage the US to land on Rome and not Normandy or S.France.  The whole goal being to keep the US fleet in the Med and out of reinforcement for multiple turns outside of the 3 units it can place on whatever complex it takes.

That was precisely my thought, McLovin.  I feel, at this point in time, Germany needs a method to produce warships in the Med.  If one allows Italy to take S. France, this - essentially - means that Germany has to build a complex in Yugoslavia.  This may be a good idea in the long run anyway, making it a little easier to reinforce the south against Russia. (OOB this could be a major complex, Alpha 2 I do not think it can.)

I feel an Airbase would be nice to accompany the complex in Yugoslavia, if you go this route, since then you can put 6 fighters in the air for cover air patrol.  But again, if you have S. France, I think you would not need this. (Little harder since you have to build Italy in one zone and Germany in another instead of combined, but much cheaper.)

One needs to be prepared for every outcome.  That’s all I am saying.

This makes sense for France - UK/USA liberates, then France Collects, then Germany recaptures.

England is a different manner.  If USA liberates, Germany goes before UK collects.  If they wait till the next turn, USA can land planes.  Of course Germany can land in Scotland (if they’re boats are safe there) and send a double wave in after America reinforces.  Me, I found it hard (post Sea Lion) for Germany to divert any more resources away from th Russian front - including enough to hold USA out of England.

What to do with those Germans?