It’s the way he forced his opinion. I’m not really a radical fanatic religion-wise, but I still believe that we weren’t placed here by no one whatsoever… Sorry If i seemed p’d off, I have a tendency to get mad easily! :oops:
you tried to force ur opinion as well, by suggesting that atheism is bad. also, yanny is a self-described agnostic.
from what ive heard, ill love the movie, but not be moved in any spiritual sense.
also, more of an ideology question, but why would Jesus have been born solely to suffer and die for the sins of man?
also, more of an ideology question, but why would Jesus have been born solely to suffer and die for the sins of man?
The easy answer is So you don’t have to live with the consequences of Adam’s sin…also it does say in Isiah 53 that he died so that we don’t have to carry sickness in our bodies…
GG
1. if we are forgiven for adam’s sins, why are we not back in the garden of eden?
2. we DO carry sickness in our bodies
@F_alk:
…I guess Yanny is atheist! :evil:
But even an atheist should be moved by that movie! :evil:Wait a second….
Why an evil face just because someone seems to be an atheist? I have only one explanation for it: Only fundamentalists turn angry when someone is sharing their beliefs.
And then this “but even”-sentence… sigh
wasn’t forgiveness-no-matter-what the one most important and new part in JC’s philosophy?
come 'on F_alk - he’s 13. Give him some time. Then he’ll be able to burn down some houses too . . . .
1. if we are forgiven for adam’s sins, why are we not back in the garden of eden?
2. we DO carry sickness in our bodies
get deeper Janus
Janus1: Quote: why would Jesus have been born solely to suffer and die for the sins of man?
Answer: It is all part of his master plan.
He invented the system by which sins are washed away with blood; and then decided (in advance, of course) that He would sacrifice Himself to Himself for doing things He knew we would do already and that He made us capable of doing in the first place….
Get it?
Me neither.
Back to the movie:
I’m more interested in an Xians interpretation of why the crucifiction was a sacrifice on his part. I understand the consequences of the act; what I don’t understand is how people regard the crucifiction itself as such a great (if not the greatest) sacrifice. I think most of use could agree that thousands upon thousands of people have suffered in more painful ways, for longer amounts of time. I think any of us in his position, knowing what would await us afterwards, would not hesitate to be crucified. Comments?
~cheers
… Sorry If i seemed p’d off, I have a tendency to get mad easily! :oops:
@cystic:
come 'on F_alk - he’s 13. Give him some time. Then he’ll be able to burn down some houses too . . . .
Ok…
but being young is not an excuse for everything. If it was, there would be no need to learn while we are most capable opf learning.
@Guerrilla:
also, more of an ideology question, but why would Jesus have been born solely to suffer and die for the sins of man?
The easy answer is So you don’t have to live with the consequences of Adam’s sin…also it does say in Isiah 53 that he died so that we don’t have to carry sickness in our bodies…
GG
noticed I said on #2 that we don’t have to… you have the choice…
Hey Cystic Crypt, I am not 13! :evil: So don’t talk out of your backside! :evil:
Hey Cystic Crypt, I am not 13, I’m older! :evil: So don’t talk out of your backside! :evil: Also, where did you make that assumption?
By the way, i saw the movie… Very good! Besides the scourging not as bloody as youd think! But the WHOLE movie is depressing! :cry:
come 'on F_alk - he’s 13
coming from you, i just have to laugh at that
get deeper Janus
thank you for the answers, but i wasnt looking for them. i dont really care, being atheist and all, i only care about the (by my judgements) interesting parts of theology, and this isnt one of them. but thank you for the responses anyway.
Answer: It is all part of his master plan.
He invented the system by which sins are washed away with blood; and then decided (in advance, of course) that He would sacrifice Himself to Himself for doing things He knew we would do already and that He made us capable of doing in the first place….
ah, of course (STUPIDEST THING IVE EVER HEARD)
I think any of us in his position, knowing what would await us afterwards, would not hesitate to be crucified
hard to say, its like offering someone a million dollars to do something disgusting, that they say they would never do. you say no, but if you saw the money in front of u, u probably would, and probably for a lot less.
By the way, i saw the movie… Very good! Besides the scourging not as bloody as youd think! But the WHOLE movie is depressing!
if you want a depressing movie, try AI. JTDC! after you see it, you feel like hanging yourself or slitting your wrists or sumthin
Hey Cystic Crypt, I am not 13, I’m older! :evil: So don’t talk out of your backside! :evil: Also, where did you make that assumption?
from your previous posts. Sorry.
Bad Backside!!
Thats ok… Just sick of all these false acxcusations… :-?
So with regards to the whole “sacrifice” thing . . . .
The reason that this considered the greatest sacrifice in history is not because of the pain, or because of the nature of the death.
The thing of it is that Jesus was “perfect” - he was without sin - even original sin. Yet he “took on our sins” when he died on the cross. at that time God “turned his back” on Christ (as sin is intolerable by God). This is perhaps the most anguishing feature of The Crucifiction, and something that could not be adequately portrayed on screen.
With regards to K Ration’s consideration that this “was not such a big sacrifice on his part” . . . well, even if it just were a simple crucifiction of an innocent man, i still would consider this a pretty nasty sacrifice.
granted, even though it is just a simple crucifiction of an innocent man, it is pretty gruesome, but like K-ration said, i can think of much worse things.
We are forgetting Christ’s words to the Father- “Forgive them for they know not what they do”.
Anyone can be executed back in the Roman times- but to ask forgiveness for those who did it…. That’s the message.
@cystic:
…(as sin is intolerable by God).
Can you forgive things that are intolerable ?
I can’t, not as long as the intolerable fact is still “in place”. I can forgive former intolerables though, with a bit of effort.
Now we have the situation that all intolerables of the future are somehow transfered back, so that they become past and are forgivable?
Hmmm… i do have problems with that.
Well, like I said. I understand the ramifications, and why his sacrifice is important to Christians. It was a swell thing to do. And yes, crucifiction is not a fun way to go. But the point I’d like to touch on, (which some of you have) is what makes it a true sacrifice on the part of Jesus.
When I think of sacrifice, I think of giving up more than you get. I think of major loss, on a permanent basis.
So let’s say Jesus did take on the sins of mankind while on the cross. And let’s say God did turn his back on him. Horrible. Painful. Agonizing. Lasted three days. Thats the sacrifice.
Eternity in Heaven, Eternity of bliss, seated at the right hand of the Father. Millions praising your name daily. That’s the reward.
Can you even compare those two?
The only way Christ’s sacrifice could have been significant would be if he were to cease existence upon death. Otherwise, it’s a fake sacrifice basically done by God for personal amusement. Consistent with the being who told Abraham to sacrifice Isaac and say “just kidding” at the last minute, or allowed a good man to suffer inordinately just to win a bet.
IMHO. =)
~cheers
if God had truly turned his back on Jesus, and if he had taken on mankinds sins, shouldnt he have gone to hell?
