1st turn Japanese attack on Hawaii

[Zero]

I don’t like to attack Hawaii on turn 1 for 2 reasons.

1. It think its best to use the battleships for the intial turns to assist in amphibious assaults on more valuable territories.

2. There is a considerable risk in attacking Hawaii. If the Japanese only get 2 hits in round one. The U.S. can retreat its sub towards the Japanese mainland. If both Japanese Battleships are at Hawaii, then any transports at Japan will be poorly defended and at a severe risk for being sunk by the US sub. If Japan loses 2 or more transports on turn 1 to the US sub, it would stall the Asia invasion for 1-2 turns.

[Guest]

Germany and Japan have to take British and Russian territory. Britain and Russia have to stop them from doing this. G and J are richer than B and R, and they start with much stronger armies. Thus, B and R require help from the USA. So, the secondary objective of G and J is stop USA from helping its allies.

Most naval units have better defense than offense and so do fighters. Japan gains nothing from destroying USA’s navy. USA must destroy Japan’s navy if it is going to get strong help to Asia. Thus, Japan should pull back its navy and defend - USA will have to attack it eventually. Because naval units and fighters have better defense, Japan always has the odds in its favour when USA attacks its navy. Thus, Japan should concentrate on the invasion of Asia and just build a navy that is as big or almost as big as USA’s to defend.

[greensleeves]

i dont agree with that, a battleship and a carrier in the atlantic on turn 3 is lethal for germany. Battleships wont help much if the allies retreat their forces inland (sinkiang, china, yakut). Only Africa is then at risk of being captured thanks to the ships.

edit: same goes for fighters, they will help you capture terrain more easily but you will most likely run out of infantry sooner or later.

[ This Message was edited by: greensleeves on 2002-01-09 03:57 ]

[Guest]

Field Marshall:

I totally agree with you…I was just setting an example for you. Japan can hold off the US, but not without drawing funds from the mainland. If US goes after Japan then Germany is given a chance at taking Russia. I agree.

Barbaric Overlord:

your quote: “Japan gains nothing from destroying USA’s navy.”

my response: “WHAT?!?” are you kidding? Japan has everything to gain by destroying the US navy at Hawaii…and so does Germany. Japan has overwhelming fire power to send at the US. I’ve done it more than once where I was Japan, and came out victorious with no loses. Not even my sub was hit. Its all about odds…and the odds are with Japan for this attack. I see your point about naval units defences being stronger than their attack values, and your principal may be applied in other circumstances, but at the same time the Japanese can easily take out the US fleet. Sometimes aggressive play is called for to have a long term effect.

[greensleeves]

attacking is superior to defending in several ways:

1. planes, ships and tanks can move to the battlefield from other territories, you cant move when defending a territory so you cant call in reinforcements from other territories.

2. The attacker chooses territory to attack, attacking troops and defending troops. Thats why a battle is most likely gonna end up in favour of the attacker and gonna hurt the defender more.

[Guest]

and also…

not attacking may hurt you in the long run. It may just give the enemy that extra bit of time they need to over power you.

CARPE DIEM!!!

[Yanny]

100% of the time the US attack must be performed. If you let that stuff live, Germany will fall VERY fast.

[Guest]

I think that Japan has to find away to stop the americans in the pacific and go for russia not using too many risky attacks in order for the Axis to win.

[Zero]

ONe topic not dicussed yet is what order the Japanese player should lose pieces if the U.S. gets more casualty than would be expected.

Assuming the transport has 2 inf to invade Hawaii, I think the best order of removal for the attacker would be:

-submarine
-Battleship
-fighter
-Battleship (Things are going badly, at this point)

I think the Battleship is less valuable in the long run than a fighter even if it costs half as much to replace. If the US counter attacks the fighter will defend as well as a battleship.

[KING TIGER]

I agree with Field Marshall and Major Damage

on this one. Everyone seemed to point out the

effects on Germany with the Fleet comming

over to the Atlantic but also having it in

the pacific isn’t good for Japan. That fleet

has to be taken care of regardless of the

round. So your best chance for the Axis is

Japan’s first turn.

[greensleeves]

i recently though of using the sub to block the retreat of the us fleet into the pacific. Any thoughts on this?

[KING TIGER]

Well,

On that note I have actually used the sub to

kill the British transport and used other

Jap stuff to go after the US fleet. Therefor

I find better use of the Sub than as a

suicide. It is a logical move though.

[bossk]

Indeed, I also like to kill the british transport if he is foolish enough to come within range of my sub. This is why as Britian I consider trying to move the Austrailians in the first round or two pure folly.

[Guest]

yea i don’t think it really matters if japan attacks US in hawaii….the pacific is pretty useless anyway…might as well destroy what they do have though…

[Field Marshal]

Lately I’ve been trying to have Germany hold the Suez canal long enough to allow the Japanese fleet to enter the Med (earliest by turn 4, if Japan doesn’t attack Hawaii in turn 1 and the US withdrawals it’s fleet immediately to the Atlantic). This gives the Allies quite a jolt if it works. The down side is your unprotected transports in the Japanese SZ. This can protect Southern Europe from invasion (with German fighter support) and may allow attacks on the Allied fleets. What else do you do with the Japanese fleet after the Asian coast is in Japanese hands?

[Guest]

yeah,i normally play with my uncle i am germany and my cousin is normally japan he,always attacks the america fleet but with severe casualtys i dont think it is worth it myself,try doing it when the 2 british fighters do, a suicide bombing on your transport and battleship in japan your other transport is sunk by the plane in india, and i dont know if am right in this but,my uncle has had the game for about 30 years he has no instructions but he gets his bomber from uk and sends it to kill the sub in solomon waters and lands on australia can you do this , i let him do this move i trust he is playing correct he has had the game for 30 years,so anyway am left with a battleship and aircraft carrier,if i attack with them,i normally lose 2planes first attack, so i have to reinforce it with another 2 planes, (he has sent 1 russian plane to his carrier) so am left with about 2 planes left, and can only attack with 1 plane in asia,so i defeat the american men and plane with many casualties i then dont build an industrial complex becuase that russia will just take it and am unable to reinforce myself next tuern due to the fact that england took out all my transports the only option is not to attack hawaii.

[Guest]

and another thing i agree with the person who said that the japans waters are useless,becuase of the reasons:

america and england build mostly transports and less subs and japan if they get an industrial complex on kwangtang , build more subs so with japan buy a tank couple of men and atleast a sub every time now when you look powerfull enuogh, you have got to get to kerilian waters and put pressure on america and britain, and do a first attack thingy with your sub sure the americas with get first shots,and then england, but by this time i normally have about 17 to 20 subs and germany has conquered russia.thus releives the pressure of germany,while they get back 2gether,now dont attack the america fleet cuz they got like 12 to 15 transporters a piece, but secret sub them ,what eva you call it, they eventually have to attack you,but you shuold win take in to consideration that they cant shot with there transports,and also planes in some cases are more valuable then battleships,and that stratagie i gave correct me if am wrong, and tell me an alternative on defeating us and uk fleet,…at the same time

[Guest]

oh i said “becuase of the reasons” forget that i forgot to give reasons never mind, if you have the power to attack american hawii fleet then do it ,if not then sit tight and build,

[Mr Ghoul]

Guy, you gotta down load some A&A rules from the net yo.

[dezrtfish]

By my count that move from the UK to Aust. is 9 spaces! I guess thats better than the 8 spaces to the Solomon Sea Zone.