I playtested the WEur IC against KGF last weekend. I don’t think it’s that powerful. Here’s how it went:

G1
Buy BALTIC ac and IC, MED fleet moves west.

UK1
Buy 3ftrs or 2 ftrs and 1 trn. Fleet stays in sz2. Egypt counter depends on German survivors. Kill Jap trn with des. The UK Indian ftr can land in Africa, in position to strike sz7 on UK2.

US1
Buy ac, ftr, 2 subs. Starting Atlantic fleet goes to sz9.

R2.
Russia smells blood after G1 so they switch to aggressive mode against Germany. They’ll have to do the ground fighting for a few turns. Ftr(s) land in London (if needed & applicable). Sub blocks German fleet in sz12 – if the Russian ftrs can reach London the sub can be spared.

G2
London has 2inf, 2arm, 1rtl, 5-8 ftrs (4-5 UK, 1 US, 0-2 USSR) 1-2 bmrs (the UK could be missing). It can’t be taken.
The fleet is merged. It has 1ac, 2 ftrs, 1bb, 1dd, 2trns, 3subs = DPunch 26 Count 11. UK can hit it with 4-5 ftrs (Indian ftr not included, so it may be 5-6) 1bmr 1bb 2-3 trns = Opunch 20 – 23 (23-26) Count 10 (11). US can follow with 4ftrs 1bmr 1dd 2trns = Opunch 19 Count 8. Normally the fleet will not last against the double attack.
I don’t know whether Germany should choose not to reinforce it but I bought more navy in sz7, specifically a second ac – better than 2 subs – increasing Dpunch to 37 and Count to 14. That’s 47$ spent in the Atlantic.

Germany could avoid the double attack by blocking sz8 with a sub. This means that they’ll lose the sub but they can avoid buying navy in G2. I only did one game so I couldn’t explore all possible paths.

UK2
Buy fleet (3-4 trns). Move fleet in sz8. You can buy the UK carrier instead to play safe. Germany won’t attack a double carrier fleet.

US2
Buy 2bmrs, 1ftr. Move fleet in sz8. Land units stay in Canada to discourage Japan. The Allied fleets consist of 1ac, 2ftrs, 2dd, (USA) 1bb (UK), 2-3 subs (2 US, 0-1 USSR), 7-9 trns (2 US, 5-7 UK) = Dpunch 32 - 36 Count 16-19. If UK bought the carrier the Dpunch is increased by 9.

R3
Press Germany.

G3
The Allied fleet can be attacked with fleet and Luftwaffe adding up to a total of 2ac, 5-6 ftrs, 1bmr, 1bb, 1dd, 2trns, 3subs = Opunch 34 – 37 Count 16-17. It’s only worth against a single carrier fleet.
Assume you don’t do it. Should you buy even more navy?
USA can attack sz7 on US3 with 1ac, 2dd, 2subs, 2trns, 3bmrs, 5ftrs. = Opunch 38 Count 15. You have D 37 C 14. It’s a close one but the US will attack anyway and withdraw if they have to. Also, on US4 the attack against sz7 will have an increase of Opunch 14 and Count 6 (for a total of 52 and 21 respectively). That’s because the Pacific bb and trn and the US3 buys (2ftrs 1bmr) are added.

If you want your fleet to survive, you need more navy or you must withdraw to the Baltic or Med. In any case I think that the Allies are ahead and will win the game.

Ncscswitch, your strategy proposal is very innovative. I gave it some thought and discussed about possible Allied counters with a friend. We did not have a board to try anything out, so we kept it theoretical.
We both thought KJF, instinctively.
We also thought SA complex to secure African $ if you decide not to challenge the German fleet with UK.
The KGF path is very interesting, too. We will get to it ASAP.
I suggest that you start a topic about the WEur factory.

@ncscswitch:

LOL!

Fleet link in SZ7 on G2.  Full scale interdiction of Allied shipping.

You drop the IC in Western on G1 and stage your fleets to link.  G2 you link the fleets, and reinforce with new naval units placed at the Western IC.

Germany plays the same game as Japan in a KJF, only off France instead of off Japan.  And they rely on bulk INF and existing ARM to keep the Soviets in check.

Do you buy the Baltic carrier too?

Good one ncscswitch. I like the way you handle Japan. The key for a KJF defense is to be confident.

However, how would you respond to the same + the UK bomber in Novo or Sinkiang?

I know Jen used it for SBR but let’s assume she hadn’t…

Would you do the same battles and buy that destroyer on J1?

Jen,

I use both ftrs to be as certain as possible. If you are gonna do the Norway attack you must use maximum force. It would be a pitty to go to all this trouble with Russia and not kill the ftr = loose the UK fleet in sz2

So if Russia takes Norway even the bmr can’t attack.
The battle is 3inf 2ftr 1arm vs 3inf 1ftr so the Russian can drop the Moscow ftr before killing the tank. It will die in Karelia on G1 anyway.
Even if Norway doesn’t change hands (but you do kill the German ftr) the UK bb will probably survive.

Now the dilemma is attack Norway, sacrifising 1ftr and 1arm, and abandon any ‘usual’ Russian opening to save the UK fleet or do nothing and let it die…

Some thoughts and numbers on the naval KJF game.

As Japan you have to buy the 3rd carrier only after a US ‘offensive’ fleet moves within striking distance of your fleet (most probably in the Alaskan sz).
Your basic fleet of 2bb 2ac 4ftr 1dd 4trn has Dpunch 37 Count 15. The third carrier group will bring that to Dpunch 48 (8 hits in the first round of combat) Count 18. Pretty decent defense for the US to overcome. Normally a US attack against your fleet can’t happen before US5 so you’ll have 4 rounds (J2 to J5) to unload (a max of 32) land units in Asia.

If the US will go hopping they’ll build a defensive fleet and you’ll have to attack it to kill the transports. Probably you’ll have to attack after they go to the Solomons.
Again your basic attacking force is 2bb 6ftr 1dd 1bmr 4trn (2ac) has Opunch 35 (almost 6 hits) Count 18. Also, it can sustain 6 hits without loosing Opunch meaning it will probably hit another 5-6 times in the second round of combat killing a 10-12 boat/ftr fleet in 2 rounds.
Also, against island hopping you should probably build the airforce up to 8 ftrs because each carrier can bring 4 ftrs to battle.
Finally I think that you have the option of not attacking the US fleet in the Solomons but after it conquers one of it’s target islands.

I know that some things such as an Indian factory, the UK fleet, a Russian stack in Bury, the UK bmr threatening Japanese sea zones, UK ftr reinforcing PH and a Sinkiang factory (although it weakens US naval builds) can give Japan additional problems but the Japanese player should have the basic numbers in mind when organizing his naval defense against KJF.

I don’t know whether the German will try it anyway - probably he will and see how the first round of combat goes.

The Norway attack messes Russian plans but would you risk loosing almost all UK Atlantic navy on G1? I need to playtest this more.

Shadow & Jen,

Do you always stack 6inf in Bury on R1, regardless of KJF or KGF?

The battle is 2subs 1bmr vs 1bb 1trn 1sub (Russian), isn’t it?

What dice simulator are you using?