AARHE 1939 map and rule files

[Imperious Leader]

Map file:
2008-3-4 http://www.mediafire.com/?yc0yxc4bntp

Note: this is the latest map file.

Map file with unit icons:
2008-2-14 http://www.mediafire.com/?7ktjhmlpojm

Rules file:
2008-02-14 http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20080214_AARHE_1939.doc

Set up:
2008-2-13 http://www.mediafire.com/?1hzno3tj1oo

[Flashman]

OK, just to summarise my objections to the map.  I've said all of this befiore and I know you won't change any of it now; just so it's on record.

Still not sure of the date: if it's September 1939 what is the BEF doing in France and why is the east of "Poland" called "Soviet occupied"?  If it's after the Polish war why is Poland coloured neutral?

My objection to the use of "Vichy France" and "Free France" before 1940 is known to you.

Berlin is where Poland should be Poland is where White Russia should be White Russia is where Western Territory should be Western Territory is where Moscow should be.

Bavarian Alps is a bit local, Central Europe is better as this includes the Carpathians so is still mountainous.

Persia should be Iran.

R de o should border Algeria/Morocco OR not exist at all.

Levant States is just wrong.  They were not states but a French mandate, and Lebanon was just part of Syria at this time.

T-J should have Red sea border.

India should be at least 3 territories.

Ceylon should be included as it was an important naval base.

Hopei should be Japanese.  That's why the KMT are concentrated in Szechuan; they were driven there by the fall of Nanking.

WTF is that factory doing in Tibet?  Where are the other factories?  Australia is a much stronger candidate than South Africa or India for an IC.

Marianas REALLY doesn't look anything like that.

If Argentina is mountainous so then should be Peru.

Where are the Spanish and Turkish and Swedish (etc) armies?

[Imperious Leader]

Still not sure of the date: if it's September 1939 what is the BEF doing in France and why is the east of "Poland" called "Soviet occupied"?  If it's after the Polish war why is Poland coloured neutral?

++++Thats old. DL the most current information. I already made the point that old setup was just for ideas. I don't have the BEF in france. Why are you asking such things before you even view the latest files>?

My objection to the use of "Vichy France" and "Free France" before 1940 is known to you.

+++each has its own place and its accurate

Berlin is where Poland should be Poland is where White Russia should be White Russia is where Western Territory should be Western Territory is where Moscow should be.

++++ this is so the territory will allow lots of pieces. The map is only a representation of the general situation. Look at your own maps and how they are drawn. They are more in need of help.

Bavarian Alps is a bit local, Central Europe is better as this includes the Carpathians so is still mountainous.

+++++ GERMANY IS central Europe. Hungary is too small for this map and Bulgaria was needed to plug the missing area ( i could not call it Greece or you would complain about that instead--- i know how you think)

Persia should be Iran.

++++ both are accurate and i hate Iran. when you co-op my map for your self you can call it Vichy france.

R de o should border Algeria/Morocco OR not exist at all.

++++ It cannot be left out because Spain may be a player. The border is not relevant to this games purpose.

Levant States is just wrong.  They were not states but a French mandate, and Lebanon was just part of Syria at this time.

+++++ its what it was called at this time . Buy no fewer than 6 maps printed from this period then have your own look and see. Levant states is what it was called with Syria is small case in ()

T-J should have Red sea border.

+++++ that is not a major port and you know it. It cannot be represented in a map of this scale. TJ is a useless territory anyway its only purpose is to make it harder to get to Caucasus from Africa. Look at the ideas behind the decision. You already complained half a million times about how in some cases people put too many islands on their maps and now you complain about the opposite... their is no objective truth to this. Its more about the maps purpose that decides it.

India should be at least 3 territories.

++++ it will fall too quickly, The idea of Burma et al is to also make buffer states to help protect it.

Ceylon should be included as it was an important naval base.

++++ naval bases are not part of this game>> where have you been?

Hopei should be Japanese.  That's why the KMT are concentrated in Szechuan; they were driven there by the fall of Nanking.

++++++Hopei is not only hopei Hopei represents 1 million other territory's labeled Hopei... can you understand this?
Should every infantry represent individual people? NO they represent a corps sized formation. The territories are the same thing ( more than one territory bound by a single name)


WTF is that factory doing in Tibet?  Where are the other factories?  Australia is a much stronger candidate than South Africa or India for an IC.

++++ after play testing it is a must to help protect China from falling.Read the rules and come back to this. again you are commenting w/o looking at every thing as a whole.

Marianas REALLY doesn't look anything like that.
+++++ and none of your maps look like the globe either. But i use your same excuse for the aesthetics as you do: "its only a representation"

If Argentina is mountainous so then should be Peru.

+++++ considered. Argentina is too large and the mountains are mostly in the south.. so not enough to make the entire place " a mountain"

Where are the Spanish and Turkish and Swedish (etc) armies?

++++ look at the file. good lord!

[Imperious Leader]

OK again in the pursuit of perfection i have this:

http://www.mediafire.com/?bqjw3l3tmyk

http://www.mediafire.com/upload_complete.php?id=5floyjbsysv

this includes the new set up sheets.

[Flashman]

OK, I'll find time to read through this properly before further comment.

But sorry, I still don't understand which Chinese controlled territories are included in Hopei.  As far as I can see ALL of this area (as defined on the map) was firmly under Japanese occupation.

Tibet IC is hard to buy; this must be about the least industrialised place on earth bar the polar ice caps.

Unless you have the famous book Heavy weapons production in Lhasa 1936-1945.

[tekkyy]

The latest player aids should be what we posted at house rules forum.
My harddisk has problems at the moment. If you wait a bit I can dig out stuff.

Its probably a bit rushed to post the whole works of AARHE 1939 at BGG right now anyway.

Standard map with setup icons neutral army and the works
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_standard_with_setup.png

Battleboards
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_battleboard_dogfight.png
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_battleboard_landcombat.png
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_battleboard_navalcombat.png

Hit Allocation
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070420_AARHE_hit_allocation_aid.png

Player aids
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_player_Germany_Italy.jpg
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_player_Japan_UnitedKingdom.jpg
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_player_UnitedStates_USSR.jpg

Develop Weapons
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_technology.png

Diplomacy
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070811_AARHE_neutrals.png

Victory City
http://home.exetel.com.au/cometo/20070425_AARHE_victory_city_aid.png

[tekkyy]

But sorry, I still don't understand which Chinese controlled territories are included in Hopei. 

yeah I mentioned it before but if there is time touch up the Chinese territory borders
like move Tibet south and shrunk himalayas

[Adlertag]

I am still confused about sz 14 15 and the little sea in sz 16

can you attack Balkans from sz 14 ?

I think you should not

I think the little sea must disappear, and sz 15 cover all water east of Greece.

[Imperious Leader]

yeah I mentioned it before but if there is time touch up the Chinese territory borders
like move Tibet south and shrunk Himalayas

This was done. (I shrunk Himalayas).  Also, Japan is limited to capturing only one territory in China per turn. So that saves the Chinese Territory IC for at least 3 turns. Otherwise they will be only able to build infantry as per normal rules. If the Factory was in Chunking it would fall on J2. Id just like to see a little more flexibility for the Chinese player. A factory is only in this case a center for accumulating equipment away from the combat zone. You cant have everything in a highly abstracted game to spec because then you involve all sorts of exceptions and it bogs down things. This is the best compromise.

Playtest it. It can always be changed but my placement is based on playing it out.

I am still confused about sz 14 15 and the little sea in sz 16

can you attack Balkans from sz 14 ?

Its clearly delineated where each zone is adjacent from. AS you will read in the rules invasions in mountains are possible, but at a limited rate of 2 land units from each SZ.

for example: Norway can be technically invaded by 3 SZ for a total of 6 land units, but note the cost of invasions is 1 IPC for each unit involved... so it would cost 6 IPC to even get to attack and this would take 6 turns to get back the 'investment' ... thus the model is quite realistic and Norway will not be bothered.
Plus defending units get a +1 defense modifier, and defending artillery fire first.

Its hidden brilliance IMO.

In France the invasion will be much more important ( being a huge battle rather then a million tiny invasions  throughout the game)

[Flashman]

My take on China is to scrap their factory and let them place infantry in any Chinese held Chinese territory (this can include the likes of Manchuria if liberated). As long as all the inland territories are mountainous this gives Japan a real headache as Chinese infantry can spring up anywhere, whereas if China can only produce at a factory it becomes a pretty obvious Japanese strategy to take it out.
This reflects reality in so far as occupying the whole of China just wasn't economically worthwhile for Japan, as the natives would just retreat further into the interior and still be able to fight back, albeit only with infantry and Allied supplied equipment.

[Nuclear]

Shouldn't Eire be more towards the Axis side.  To my knowledge Ireland hated the UK.  To my knowledge they would have helped Germany in an operation sea lion battle.

Other than that, from what I have seen it looks pretty good to me.

[Imperious Leader]

My take on China is to scrap their factory and let them place infantry in any Chinese held Chinese territory (this can include the likes of Manchuria if liberated).

+++Please read the rules. This is already the case under AARHE. The factory allows building non- infantry units

As long as all the inland territories are mountainous this gives Japan a real headache as Chinese infantry can spring up anywhere, whereas if China can only produce at a factory it becomes a pretty obvious Japanese strategy to take it out.

+++Both sides are limited to taking one territory per turn ( population control issues)

This reflects reality in so far as occupying the whole of China just wasn't economically worthwhile for Japan, as the natives would just retreat further into the interior and still be able to fight back, albeit only with infantry and Allied supplied equipment.

+++ uk can send 3 IPC of aid as long as certain territories are under Chinese /uk control.. via burma road.

[Imperious Leader]

forgot to mention: added Crete island  and Peru mountains.

[tekkyy]

Its hidden brilliance IMO.

IMO now that there is a cost associated with amphibious mountainous invasion we should scrap the 2 land units per SZ.
Because the first models the situation whereas the latter is an arbitrary limit.

+++Both sides are limited to taking one territory per turn ( population control issues)

Not sure about a limit to how many Chinese territories can be liberated per turn.
I feel the limit can be applied to Axis, USSR and UK but not US (unless Chinese forces separately represented from US).

If possible I would prefer we not use the W@W style (a long string of situational rules).

[tekkyy]

2007-10-02 PNG version
http://www.mediafire.com/?d32ci3ckcik

still have to sort out the desert terrain
*if Sahara is impassible then word it and colour it like Himalayas
*are we doing anything to the desert upkeep rule? cos Inner Mongolia is desert