Agressive and pretty unorthodox R1 Strategy: Saving Egypt.



  • I always love coming up with new strategies that, if nothing else, completely surprise/confuse my opponents and actually make them think. Sometimes they work, other times they fail miserably. From my experience so far, the latest one I’ve come up with might actually have some merit.

    In addition to any usual R1 moves you have (moving sub to SZ2, supporting Sinkiang, stacking the northeastern Russian territories however you like, etc), I do the following:

    1. Take West Russia with with 8 inf (2 from Karelia, 3 from Archangel, 3 from Russia), 1 tank (Archangel), 1 artillery (Russia).
    2. Take Ukraine with 3 inf, 1 art (Caucasus), and 3 tanks (2 from Russia, 1 from Caucasus).
    3. Leave the Moscow fighter where it’s at. On your non-combat move you’ll land it in Egypt.

    The Karelia fighter is the wildcard. Depending on how risky you’re feeling, you can use it in the Ukraine attack (probably the best choice), or take the high risk/high reward route and attack the DD/AK in SZ5.

    Unless you get absolutely shafted by the dice in West Russia and Ukraine, this R1 strategy puts instant pressure on Germany to choose between attacking Egpyt or attacking the SZ2 fleet on G1, as it’s impossible to take both. Every time I’ve tried this, the German player has opted for the safer SZ2 attack.

    Saving Egpyt means the UK can have an instant impact on the game. Not only can they retreat the Indian fleet into the Med, and reinforce Egypt with the infantry from India, but they could also opt to pull the tank and fighter off of Egypt, the fighter from the carrier, and the 2 inf from T-J/Persia into India and place an IC there on UK1. The latter is probably my personal favorite UK1 move given the opportunity.

    There’s no possibility that Japan could take India on J1 if the UK chose to do this (India would have 5 inf, 1 tank, 2 fighters, and 1 AA gun defending it), and 3 new British tanks in Asia every UK turn (which could be used to aid Caucasus quite a bit, or to threaten Japan’s Asian territories), could pose a serious threat to the Axis.

    In the event that the Germans to choose to leave your SZ2 fleet alone and instead attack Africa, you have the opportunity for an UK1 Norway invasion and, if you so choose, an eventual British Norway IC, and allow you to pump 3 tanks straight into Europe every turn. Or alternatively, you could have a joining of the American/UK Atlantic fleets in SZ8 at the end of USA1.

    I dunno. Just figured I’d share.

    Your thoughts?



  • My friend, you are taking to high a risk, I would say. I think you were just lucky no German player have not come for the Russian fig, which is there to take in AE. 2Inf, 2TNK, fig and bomb will take out your inf, tnk and 2figs. As a German player I would be even happy to trade my fig for the Russian one, it things go badly during the combat.

    You will miss it when trading teritorries with Germans later on in the game. My sub will pick the lonely tranny at SZ1 and you are not landing anywhere UK R1 other then suicidal because you would have only two land units to do so. What you may count on though is that your India fleet in case I am not taking AE with any of my land units can assist in destroying the German med fleet on R1 thus effectively ending the contest in Africa more or less.

    Is this chance worthy the higher risk you might not get Ukr R1 safely with support of only 1 fig and you will lose the other Russian fig in AE? I doubt it.

    And you should never go with rus fig for the German trannie because you would stand a risk of not having a single russian plane after R1 which is simply not an option.



  • We used to use this strat in Revised. It worked for awhile until the German player (which was me) decided to attack. It’s not that hard of a fight to win considering 2 inf, 2 tanks, 2 figs and a bomber can fight it. It’s even riskier in 42 because the destroyer defense has been reduced to a 2.

    I don’t understand the Ukraine and Norway attacks either. I see a lot of people favor them on here but I don’t understand them. Doesn’t this just thin out Russia to the breaking point by round 3?



  • If the German player does choose to attack Egypt G1, he’d only be able to bring one fighter into the battle, not two.

    Even so, he’ll likely take Egypt every time, but he has a very good chance at losing that one fighter or worse if the dice don’t go his way. Sure, the thought of trading a Luftwaffe fighter for a Russian fighter sounds great, until you realize that you’d be leaving the Battleship/Sub/Transport in SZ2 untouched.

    If the UK then goes with the CV/DD/AK purchase on their first turn and moves SZ2 fleet to SZ8 (as well as one of their two fighters from England), and places all new units there – Then USA can move their entire fleet to SZ8 as well to join up and then land their fighter on the newly-purchased Brit CV.

    So by G2, assuming Germany used their SZ8 sub to take out the Canadian transport and used two fighters to take out the UK cruiser in SZ13 on G1, this gives the Allies an Atlantic fleet consisting of 1 BB, 1 CV (carrying 2 fighters), 1 CA, 1 DD, 1 SS (Russian), and 4 AK.

    And this is only the SZ8 fleet, not taking into account any new naval purchases which the USA chooses to place on the East Coast.


  • '16 '15 '10

    Here is the frood probabilities on Egypt with the fighter.

    Dice:

    1.3% 6:  2 Inf, 2 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom.  no units. :  0 IPCs
      6.7% 5: 1 Inf, 2 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 1 Inf. : 3 IPCs
      19.4% 4: 2 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 2 Inf. : 6 IPCs
      24.2% 3: 1 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 2 Inf, 1 Arm. : 11 IPCs
      24.8% 2: 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 2 Inf, 2 Arm. : 16 IPCs
      11.1% 1: 1 Bom. 2 Inf, 2 Arm, 1 Fig. : 26 IPCs
      12.5% 0: no units. 2 Inf, 2 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom. : 41 IPCs

    Low luck:

    14.2% 4: 2 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 2 Inf. : 6 IPCs
    57.2% 3: 1 Arm, 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 2 Inf, 1 Arm. : 11 IPCs
    24.5% 2: 1 Fig, 1 Bom. 2 Inf, 2 Arm. : 16 IPCs
    3.2% 1: 1 Bom. 2 Inf, 2 Arm, 1 Fig. : 26 IPCs

    I think it’s an interesting gambit and worth serious consideration in a game with no bid to Axis.  Sacrificing the Russian fig could be worth it if it makes SZ2 impossible…that gives UK a BB for the duration of the game.  Additionally, in many outcomes (30-45%) Germany will have to sacrifice another fighter to actually take Egypt, since it needs to control Egy to prevent the Indian fleet from moving into the Med sea.

    The drawbacks are that skipping 2 doesn’t hurt Germany so much in that it can attack other targets, including the undefended Canada transport.  And that losing a fig in Egy would complicate things if Russia wanted to use the Black Sea sub tactic.

    Nice idea Incline, haven’t seen this one in action yet.



  • My  response as Germany would be to go for Egypt. Taking out the z2 ships I think should take a backseat to beginning the elimination of the Allied strength in the MidEast. The Allies will have a few more boats to play with but Germany would have also saved 1-2 fighters. By taking Egypt, Germany forces the UK to temporarily cede Africa or counter from India. In fact, I view getting the Russian fighter as a bonus.

    Because z2 was not attacked, Norway didn’t need to be defended. This means that Germany will often be able to stack Karelia. Russia can expect to have two tanks in Ukraine(if they commit the Karelia fighter and the attack doesn’t totally backfire like in the game I just tested this in) and they should expect to take West Russia with 5 inf, 1 art, 1 tank. Even if the Karelia defender hits, Germany has 8 inf, 5 tanks. The strongest build against the Karelia stack that the Russians could have made is 4 tanks, 1 art. Even in this case, given average R1 rolls the best odds at knocking Germany out of Karelia is ~27%.

    Unless Germany holds Ukraine R1, yes that would prevent the attack on z2 but you lose a Russian fighter and give Germany a forward position so in my opinion it’s not worth it even in the cases where it costs Germany another fighter.

    As a side note, not attacking z2 doesn’t mean the Allies get a totally free pass in the Atlantic. Say Germany commits a sub and 2-3 fighters to the Med cruiser. 2/3 of the time the sub lives. If Germany builds a bomber G1 and the med sub lives and the Baltic subs escape, they will still be able to kill a round one Allied move to z8 2/3 of the time. That’s 3 subs, 4 fighters, 2 bombers vs 2 destroyers, 1 sub, 1 carrier, 2 fighters, 1 cruiser, and 4 transports using this calculator. http://www.dskelly.com/misc/aa/aasim.html



  • @Incline:

    If the German player does choose to attack Egypt G1, he’d only be able to bring one fighter into the battle, not two.

    Assuming you take out Ukraine. You’re strat is already too dependant on risky roles. Winning the Ukraine fight is far from a given. I guess if you don’t win it you could obviously opt not to land the fighter in Egypt.

    Don’t get me wrong, you should try it. It will throw a player off if he hasn’t seen it before. It could win you a couple games, just don’t expect it to become a standard move.



  • @Fleetwood:

    As a side note, not attacking z2 doesn’t mean the Allies get a totally free pass in the Atlantic. Say Germany commits a sub and 2-3 fighters to the Med cruiser. 2/3 of the time the sub lives. If Germany builds a bomber G1 and the med sub lives and the Baltic subs escape, they will still be able to kill a round one Allied move to z8 2/3 of the time. That’s 3 subs, 4 fighters, 2 bombers vs 2 destroyers, 1 sub, 1 carrier, 2 fighters, 1 cruiser, and 4 transports using this calculator. http://www.dskelly.com/misc/aa/aasim.html

    Are you saying that Germany should buy a cruiser and a destroyer for the Med on G1, and not use the Z8 sub to splash the Canadian transport, but retreat it into the Med (Z13 is as far as it can reach)? This takes away half of Germany’s income, which means it can only commit 20 IPCs to the land battle with Russia, and allows UK to retain both of its Atlantic transports. I don’t know if that is a good move…


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