Don't get how Germany can handle UK and Russia with the bombing…



  • Currently playing 1v1 with a friend.  And we’re both competent veteran players of the older AA games.  I’m Axis.  Now, first in the other theater of the world, Japan is doing ok.  A lot of my navy left over there and fighting with US navy while at same time I setup a factory in Manchuria and India to steadily pump infantry/tanks west trying to help either reenforce Africa or help take out Russia.  I tell you this because if I wasn’t pressuring Russia like this, then Germany would be even harder to play.

    So now to my question.  Any half competent player, playing as the UK/US is going to have bombers parked on UK and every turn will be Industry bombing Germany.  This is really a necessity to do if you play Allies.  So of course he’s doing that to me.  Per turn he brings 3 British bombers, and he’s got 2 American bombers there.  So per turn I lose 17-20 IPC’s from this as I’ve also been a little unlucky on the AA rolls.  I’ve only shot down 1 bomber after 4-5 turns.  So he hammers my factory so bad that, as Germany, I only have about 7-10 IPC left each turn.  This is even INCLUDING the bonus money that I get per turn.  Because of this aspect of the game that Germany has no defense for, I don’t have the money to take Russia, where as Russica continues to have 25-30 IPC per turn to push me back.

    So of course, I’ve lost ground and been reduced to making lots of Infantry and just defending.  I simply cannot afford anything and it’s only a matter of time when Germany will fall.

    My question is I simply don’t understand how Germany is playable with this going on.  It’s too much power.  Germany only has 1 factory so each turn I’m REQUIRED to repair the damage or I can’t bring in any new units.  Russia isn’t hindered by this, so even if I tried to bomb Russia with my own bombers to try and do to them what UK is doing to me……I can’t.

    My bombers, I think, can only reach the north Russian factory and that’s only an IPC value of 2…meaning I can only do a max of 4 damage to that territory.  That’s nothing compared to what UK/US are doing to me.

    Trying to take Africa takes time and Britian has already killed off my navy in the med.  Italy is actually doing ok and is helping defend Germany with infantry while at same time managed to take Egypt at the moment.  I couldn’t take my Italians further down south and take Africa because the British/US fleet controls the Med and western Africa seazones not to mention they have a big presense now on Algeria.  So I’m forced to keep my Italians (they even have a factory) in Eygpt to help defend that from the forces soon to come from Algeria.

    ==== HERE’S MY POINT ====

    This bombing from UK, any half competent player should be doing this to Germany, but with AA only being a 1/6 chance to shoot down, I complained and complained that he was destroying 90% of my income and he wasn’t having to pay for that power.  He isn’t losing enough bombers.  I’m not complaining about the damage…(as this happened in real life)…as much as I’m complaining that I don’t think 1/6 is enough of a chance.  I told him that in the war, we lost a ton of bombers prior to mustang escorts.  He hasn’t lost hardly any and that doesn’t seem balanced.  I figured if he’s going to keep doing this to me, he should have to put more IPC’s towards that power.

    So I convinced him that, JUST for the purposes of industrial bombing, we need to give the AA a 20% chance instead of 16.5%.  So we use 10 sided dice for this purpose and a 1 or 2 kills the bomber.  So since doing that, it’s been a little more balanced and thusly I take a little less damage, he is paying for another bomber or two.  I think that’s balanced.

    I just simply don’t understand how Germany can even function with this heavy bombing on a 1/6 AA dice roll.  Imagine if UK/US had heavy bombers?  What am I doing wrong as Germany to be in this situation?

    We’re using bonus income (which I’ve noticed gives the Allies the advantage as he’s getting lots of IPC’s from this), and we started with 1941 scenario, which again is Allies advantage.  I even took off right away with Germany and raced ahead into Russia as best I could.  I took 3-4 territories at first and Russia looked as if it would fall, but then the heavy bombing was so bad that I’ve since been fought back and lost ground cuz I simply can’t replace what I’ve lost.  Russia still can be because they don’t have a factory as vulnerable as Germany’s.


  • 2020 2019 2018 2017 '16 '15 '14 '13 Official Q&A TripleA Moderator

    Just some ideas:

    You could

    • Include the optional Fighter escorts and Interceptors rule
    • Play with Tech and hope for Radar
    • Build at least another IC for example in France

    and consider that Bombers that are SBRing cannot be used for any other attacks.

    HTH  🙂


  • '15 Official Q&A '11 '10 Moderator

    Actually, they neutered Strat bombing in this game.  You’re a veteran of earlier A&A games, so you should know this.  The max damage to Germany is 20.  There are two techs to protect you from Strat bombing.  Industrial production on chart one halves the cost of repair, so Strat bombing wouldn’t be worth it.  Also, radar on chart 2 gives you a 1/3 chance of shooting down all planes, much better than the 20% you were using.

    As P@nther pointed out, there is an opportunity cost with SBR.  He’s not using his bombers for conventional attacks.  So each bomber that doesn’t get shot down is doing an average of 3 1/2 damage to you.  Many times bombers can have more effect by attacking units.  In some battles they get to kill more than one unit (if there’s more than one round to the battle).

    I rarely see Strat bombing in this game.  Again, it’s weaker than ever before.  It doesn’t even directly bomb your money anymore!  You don’t have to fix all the damage.  Shoot, you don’t have to fix ANY damage.  If I was taking 20 damage a turn early in the game with Germany like you are, I’d probably be spending a lot on tech.  Also, if I had 20 damage on my Berlin factory, I’d probably build a new one in France for 15.  You have so many more options with SBR in AA50 than AAR or classic.

    To be honest, it sounds to me like your friend is a better player than you.  I say this partly because you think the Allies have the advantage in 1941, which they definitely do not.  Why don’t you take the Allies in 1941 and play your friend.  Then see how dominant the 1941 Allies are.  My guess is you’d be complaining about Japan having 9 fighters and 5 transports at game start, and that the Axis automatically get almost all NO’s.

    Just my opinions.



  • @P@nther:

    Include the optional Fighter escorts and Interceptors rule

    That’s what I recommend as well.

    http://harrisgamedesign.com/pdf/A&A_Anniversary_FAQ.pdf



  • It also sounds as though a key battles were lost or worse, never fought.

    Generally, Germany should take egypt first round.  So Italy shouldn’t have an factory there.  It’s rare indeed that Italy would have enough IPCs to purchase a factory when they should be building units to help Germany.  If you did fight the egypt first round battle, it sounds as though you lost some rather important units

    Karelia is also a priority target that it appears you didn’t catch in the first or second rounds.  It’s more than possible first turn, and further you can reinforce in noncombat with a couple tanks if you left them behind in Poland (very annoying for russia).  This may mean some British Navy is still floating, so it’s a judgement call.

    The first turn for Germany and Japan is critical, and if you leave the wrong territories open or weak, or national objectives of allies still open (the phillipines comes to mind) you’re setting yourself up for a long hard crawl.



  • @gamerman01:

    Actually, they neutered Strat bombing in this game.  You’re a veteran of earlier A&A games, so you should know this.  The max damage to Germany is 20.  There are two techs to protect you from Strat bombing.  Industrial production on chart one halves the cost of repair, so Strat bombing wouldn’t be worth it.  Also, radar on chart 2 gives you a 1/3 chance of shooting down all planes, much better than the 20% you were using.

    As P@nther pointed out, there is an opportunity cost with SBR.  He’s not using his bombers for conventional attacks.  So each bomber that doesn’t get shot down is doing an average of 3 1/2 damage to you.  Many times bombers can have more effect by attacking units.  In some battles they get to kill more than one unit (if there’s more than one round to the battle).

    I rarely see Strat bombing in this game.  Again, it’s weaker than ever before.  It doesn’t even directly bomb your money anymore!  You don’t have to fix all the damage.  Shoot, you don’t have to fix ANY damage.  If I was taking 20 damage a turn early in the game with Germany like you are, I’d probably be spending a lot on tech.  Also, if I had 20 damage on my Berlin factory, I’d probably build a new one in France for 15.  You have so many more options with SBR in AA50 than AAR or classic.

    To be honest, it sounds to me like your friend is a better player than you.  I say this partly because you think the Allies have the advantage in 1941, which they definitely do not.  Why don’t you take the Allies in 1941 and play your friend.  Then see how dominant the 1941 Allies are.  My guess is you’d be complaining about Japan having 9 fighters and 5 transports at game start, and that the Axis automatically get almost all NO’s.

    Just my opinions.

    Ok, few things, yes, of course there are techs, but that’s not guaranteed, you have to spend money I don’t have on that, and it’s random on what tech you get.  Like I said, each turn I have 7-10 money per turn and that’s it cuz of both UK/US bombing me.   MEANING, I also can’t even afford a factory to put somewhere else.  Of course I don’t have to pay for all the damage, but I also can’t put any units down if I don’t repay the damage.  What’s the point of just paying it partially down just to make 2-3 units.  I need to create far more units than 2-3 units to counter the Russians.   Of course ‘Radar’ is better, but as I said that’s random and requires spending precious money that should be going towards units on a CHANCE to get a random tech.   That’s not reliable enough of a solution unless that was done at the beginning of the game.

    I actually did that though, I spent just 5 IPC at the start in the hopes of getting Radar as I KNEW bombers were going to be a problem for me.  I actually got lucky and got a 6, but then it ended up giving me heavy bombers.  Since you can’t get multiple techs in one turn, you’d have to be very very lucky to get the 6 and then happen to get Radar with that.  Yeah, I can see purchasing another factory at the start and putting it somewhere east of Germany being a good tactic.  Would give me another factory eastward to help with Russia and I wouldn’t have to pay for the constant damage on my one factory.   Putting it in France is not a good idea as that makes it that much longer that reenforcements will reach Russia.

    He’s not a better player than me 🙂  That’s just rediculous, it’s just a mechanic in the game that gives too much power with only 1 German factory with only a 16.5% bomber loss rate.   This is my first time playing this AA50.  I’m a very good player and veteran of the older AA’s.  SBR back then was an even bigger issue.  Like I said, yea, I probably just need to make a 2nd factory and it wouldn’t be an issue.  I did the 20% thing because that’s something that we immediately adobted that wasn’t overpowering for either side.  Balance was the key.  Honestly the 33% AA chance that radar does is overpowering.  I needed something better than the 16.5% but not overpowering for anyone.  1-2 on a 10 sided is working well, but yea, the 2nd factory probably would work better.  I probably lynch-pinned myself because I did that.  And yes, of course if he’s SBR’ing with his bombers, he can’t attack normally with them, but he isn’t doing any normal attacks anyway yet.

    And I said the 1941 scenario gives Allies the advantage because, yes Japan has alot of navy, but they only have 17IPC’s, and Germany only has 31.  All of the Allies have more IPC’s, and then the bonus income is giving the Allies even more money than the Axis is receiving.  So from an IPC standpoint, 1941 is an Allied advantage.  It’s not like Germany has a massive amount of forces like the Japanese navy does in 1941.  If Germany had as much land presense as Japan has on the sea, then yes I wouldn’t talk about the Allies IPC’s advantage.  I mean, every single turn, his US has 57 IPC’s to build with……his regular amount, and he’s getting 15IPC’s every turn from the bonus income.  Again, this is my first AA50 game and I didn’t know how powerful the bonus income is.    So that’s another disadvantage I’m at.  I need to memorize every countries bonus income so that I can counter it and deny them of that.



  • @kcdzim:

    It also sounds as though a key battles were lost or worse, never fought.

    Generally, Germany should take egypt first round.  So Italy shouldn’t have an factory there.  It’s rare indeed that Italy would have enough IPCs to purchase a factory when they should be building units to help Germany.  If you did fight the egypt first round battle, it sounds as though you lost some rather important units

    Karelia is also a priority target that it appears you didn’t catch in the first or second rounds.  It’s more than possible first turn, and further you can reinforce in noncombat with a couple tanks if you left them behind in the baltic states (very annoying for russia).  This may mean some British Navy is still floating, so it’s a judgement call.

    The first turn for Germany and Japan is critical, and if you leave the wrong territories open or weak, or national objectives of allies still open (the phillipines comes to mind) you’re setting yourself up for a long hard crawl.

    Yea, I did try to take Egypt first turn and lost that fight ;( so yea, that was huge.  You’re probably right on on Karelia, although I think there’s another territory in front of me before I could get to Karelia.  Don’t recall, I’m not at home right now.  If it’s attackable on first turn then I think that’s another that I wasn’t able to take because I either put too much of my fighters towards killing Britian’s navy and thusly didn’t have enough firepower to take that territory and lost that battle, or there was another territory in the way in front of it.

    Cuz at one time I was moving along fine into Russia, I had taken 3 of their western territories (Ukraine, eastern poland, and the one above that)….but because of the heavy bombing then coming in I didn’t have enough money to reenforce these advances and started losing ground.



  • If all UK/US are doing is SBR, then where’s Japan and Italy?

    As for Japan, it starts off with 17 IPC but ends up as a Juggernaut.  It might be you are too used to AA classic.  Try a game of revised and then transition to AA50.  AA50 is a totally different game compared to Classic.  Your traditional buys and tactics that worked in Classic doesn’t really work.

    In terms of IPC, Germany should be able to get at least 2 NOs (+10) after the first turn.  That’s at least 41 IPC.

    I would suggest reading the tournament or at least the league games in this forum to see what great players do on G1.

    As for Allies being overpowered, we have to agree to disagree.

    Good luck on your games.



  • Deathtwinkie

    This is the championship game that’s going on right now:

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=14929.0

    The games can be found in

    Axis and Allies.org Boards > Play by Forum > Play Boardgames

    The play boardgames are for open to anyone, there’s tournaments and also league play.

    It’s very helpful to browse there games, you need to download AA Battlemap so you can download their maps at the end of their turns to see how the board is setup.  The great thing is that all the moves are posted.

    There are so many games and everyone plays a little different but I find that usually there’s a consensus on certain moves that are made on G1/I1/J1 for Axis.

    Good luck and good gaming.



  • I actually did that though, I spent just 5 IPC at the start in the hopes of getting Radar as I KNEW bombers were going to be a problem for me.  I actually got lucky and got a 6, but then it ended up giving me heavy bombers.

    Dude, you got heavy bombers for $5 and you are struggling?!?



  • Never mind strat bombing. Germany with HBs means the Allies are not going near Europe without a very major navy.

    As somebody said this game is vastly different from classic. Bombers are THE go to air unit for Germany. And with what Germany should make on G1 and G2 purchasing several early is not a problem.



  • This game is a new puzzle to figure out!

    Since it’s release, many claims have been made that the game is flawed.

    With more play, people are trying new strategies and leaving behind the old thinking (i.e. Industrial Complex in India on UK 1) and learning new ways to use the new layout of pieces/techs/National Objectives.

    Now, many have found the depth this game has to offer, without the same old play out every time.

    Play more and enjoy solving the puzzle.  🙂



  • @gamerman01:

    @Deathtwinkie:

    I actually did that though, I spent just 5 IPC at the start in the hopes of getting Radar as I KNEW bombers were going to be a problem for me.  I actually got lucky and got a 6, but then it ended up giving me heavy bombers.

    @critmonster:

    Dude, you got heavy bombers for $5 and you are struggling?!?

    Exactly.  Dude, I’m afraid we can’t take you very seriously.  Play more AA50 with more opponents and then check back again.  Why in the world weren’t you Strat. Bombing HIM from round 1?  As your opponent seems to understand, sometimes the best defense is a strong offense.  Quit obsessing about AA odds and adapt your game.  It’s finding solutions to problems that’s half the fun in this game.

    Because at the time I had to use my 1 bomber and it’s new firepower to help my eastern front move farther into Russia, and again, I already said it’s not just UK bombing me, but US bombers too.  And after that and definitely didn’t have the money to buy more bombers.  Sorry, but nobody can play Germany earning 7-10IPC a turn.  If you can’t take me seriously then that’s your problem not mine.  You act like strat bombing UK the first round and the glorious 2-12 damage that would have done is going to stop the bombing that’s still going to come from BOTH UK and US?  No, it’s going to happen no matter what.  Any competent player is going to do this, and Germany simply doesn’t have the resources to be bombed, take on the British navy, reenforce Africa, and still have enough power to push into Russia.  It can’t be done……NOT with losing so much money (7-10left a turn) and only having 1 factory.  Yes, I was wrong not to buy a 2nd factory but that’s it.  Everything else was played properly based on what was going on in front of me.  You make armchair immature comments without knowing all the facts.

    and this, “Why in the world weren’t you Strat. Bombing HIM from round 1?  As your opponent seems to understand, sometimes the best defense is a strong offense”  is just absurd.  I already explained why I didn’t bomb him round 1, the eastern push was more important at that time because time is money for Germany.  Maximum push was needed and I needed that firepower at the front more AT THAT TIME.  And this “As your opponent seems to understand” carries no weight.  He’s playing Allies, even a moron would know that you strat bomb as the Allies so it’s an easy no brainer move.  If I was Allies I’d be doing the same, and he’d be Germany with little money.  Would you then say that I’m a better player?  No.  It’s not about the players, it’s about the Allies have a power that’s too easy to do and it’s too tough for Germany to mitigate with only a 1/6 chance of shotdown.

    It’s just an unrealistic flaw in the game.  Back in WW2, we lost a LOT of men and bombers before the P51 came along, but this game (as the Allies) flaunts this bombing power with only a 1/6 chance standing in it’s way.  It’s overpowering.

    The person that said that I should buy a 2nd factory, that is a valid comment, that’s true.  That would make sense with under these new game rules, but these other comments have no merit and are just uninformed snide remarks.

    Thanks to gnasape for that link though, I’ll check into that.  I appreciate your mature reply.



  • I mean, hahaha,  it’s amazing how you pick and choose to suit your view

    You said “As your opponent seems to understand, sometimes the best defense is a strong offense”

    You seem to completely ignore how I used the bomber to give a better OFFENSE to my eastern front into Russia to allow for a better OFFENSE towards them.  That’s so that I could OFFENSIVELY kill more of their guys and OFFENSIVELY drive further into Russia quicker of with less casaulties.  Um…hi…yes, that’s maximizing my eastern OFFENSE.

    Just because I didn’t use it for the strat offense, you throw some cliche at me without thinking 😉    Just,  haha



  • Germany doesn’t really need to take a lot of Russian territory in 1941 if the Allies seem to be playing a KGF. Japan can handle that well enough. All Germany has to do is trade 3 Russian territories for a NO, and prevent the capture of valuable territories by the Western Allies.



  • If SBR’s are out of control in your playgroup I strongly suggest the fighter intercept optional rule to “get the monkey off your back” so to speak.



  • Hey Deathwinkie, welcome to the boards and to AA50, it truly is an amazing AA game.  A few points.

    *  a second IC will not help you if they are throwing 5 bombers per turn at you.  They will simply have both IC’s needing repair every turn and you just wasted 15 IPC’s.  The second IC strat has been argued on this board at great lengths.  Building the second IC is all dependant on what the Allies are doing.  But I GUARANTEE you if they are focussing on strat bombing it is a bad idea, waste of IPC’s.

    *  if you are in that bad of shape with Germany where you cannot build but one or two men per turn, then skip the purshase new units phase on one turn and then pay off the damage and put out as many units as possible on the second turn.  No sense in paying 15-20 IPC’s per turn to put out 1-2 units.  Pay off 15-20 IPC’s every second turn and put out 10 units.

    *  Japan in 1941 can be up to 27 IPC’s on J1, depending on how you play it (this is without NO’s though).  And they grow from there, quickly.

    *  the comment that one made about not taking you seriously was out of line but I don’t think they meant it in a bad way, really.  There are some very serious players on the forum and if your comments don’t meld with their own beliefs they think it is strange.  What they have to remember is that you said this was your first time playing.  I think it is great that you found your way to the boards to get some advice and put yourself out there asking for it.  Every game will change for you until you have played 20 or so games, 10 as each power before you start to figure out YOUR own best opening moves and what works for YOU.

    *  after a few more games please post again about your feelings on the strat bombing because I think they will change.  You just have to figure out your strat to combat that in advance, if required.

    *  the interceptor rule works well except you also have to keep your fighters at home to defend which means they cannot stray to far in combat (unless you get long range tech  😄 )

    *  read the child boards for the anniversary threads and you can pick up some good info.  And do read through the game logs on the forums, it really helps.



  • @Deathtwinkie:

    I already explained why I didn’t bomb him round 1, the eastern push was more important at that time because time is money for Germany

    That’s your flaw: using NOs, with proper movements, axis should get a economic advantage from round 3, and by round 5 should be of 15-20 IPCs. Axis has not to run in this game, are the allies who must run. With a HBs tech, G1, your basic purchase should be 1 bomber each round for SBRs/sinking fleets duty and the rest on land units. Your SBR target should be UK: typically they will collect 22-27 IPCs and England IC is bigger than soviet ICs, so there is a great chance of you making more than 10 IPCs of damage against UK each round. UK cannot make a SBR campaign while repairing such amount of damage

    Probably we need a image of the game or such to make a deeper analisys, but I guess you also are ignoring USA with Japan. Bad idea, specially if they are buying bombers instead a Pacific fleet: you can attack Alaska with a big landing force and forcing USA switch to defense (Polar Express strat) or simply annoy them with token raids. You should also aim for Africa and for Pacific islands NOs and such, and if USA is ignoring Japan, there is no way allies can retake Africa with the proper jap setup

    Finally, if you collect 40-45 IPCs with Germany, there is no way you are reduced to 7-10 IPCs. At worst, you would be at 20-30 IPCs, enough to buy 7-10 units. Think about tech as someone said. With HBs developed, you should roll land tech tree: it has Improved Industry, war bonds (solutions for SBRs), paras (great weapon to make a combo with your HBs), rockets (it will make UK and USSR live more difficult) and even art and mech inf techs can be good

    As someone said, forget Classic strats, this is a whole new world with tons of new strats. If you ask me, I think axis has a big advantage in 1941 scenario

    You can use interceptor rule as last ressource, but I think it makes SBRs too bad


  • '15 Official Q&A '11 '10 Moderator

    @Captain:

    *  a second IC will not help you if they are throwing 5 bombers per turn at you.  They will simply have both IC’s needing repair every turn and you just wasted 15 IPC’s.  The second IC strat has been argued on this board at great lengths.  Building the second IC is all dependant on what the Allies are doing.  But I GUARANTEE you if they are focussing on strat bombing it is a bad idea, waste of IPC’s.

    *  if you are in that bad of shape with Germany where you cannot build but one or two men per turn, then skip the purshase new units phase on one turn and then pay off the damage and put out as many units as possible on the second turn.  No sense in paying 15-20 IPC’s per turn to put out 1-2 units.  Pay off 15-20 IPC’s every second turn and put out 10 units.

    *  the comment that one made about not taking you seriously was out of line but I don’t think they meant it in a bad way, really.  There are some very serious players on the forum and if your comments don’t meld with their own beliefs they think it is strange.  What they have to remember is that you said this was your first time playing.  I think it is great that you found your way to the boards to get some advice and put yourself out there asking for it.  Every game will change for you until you have played 20 or so games, 10 as each power before you start to figure out YOUR own best opening moves and what works for YOU.

    *  after a few more games please post again about your feelings on the strat bombing because I think they will change.  You just have to figure out your strat to combat that in advance, if required.

    Yeah, this is good advice.
    I’m sorry about my comment(s), and Crunch is right, I didn’t mean it in a bad way.  I was just kind of in disbelief from what I was reading, but forgot what it’s like to be new to AA50.  Please accept my apology.
    +1 to the Captain for his diplomatic mediation.



  • Try to forget those yelling at you. 😄

    Without NO and without tech, the basic game is in favor of the allies. You need the escort rule to balance out the game.


  • '16 '15 '10

    Re. the OP…

    1. If Allies are receiving more money from NOs early on, then Axis isn’t playing right.  As Axis, make sure you are aggressively denying the Allies NOs, and are getting as many Axis ones as possible.  Ultimately, even in a KGF it should take a while for the Allies to deny the NOs.

    2. If the Allies are spending all their cash on bombers (and teching for heavies) then Germany should counter appropriately.  Either buy mainly infantry and wait for Japan or go aggressive and take out Russia while the Allies are buying techs and planes.



  • Zhukov44 is right on point 2, if Allies neglect building transports and invasion troops you should build 5-6 tanks per turn as Germany and send them East together with some infantry. Together with Italian invasions of two full transports per turn into the south of Russia this should take Russia out of the game before too long. Once you reach around 15 tanks put together you’ll be surprised how quickly Russian infantry stacks vanish.

    An IC in France is there to protect against a heavy invasion strategy by Allies, because then you need tons, tons of infantry. If they do heavy SBR, better capture Russian ICs!



  • hey at least the allies are not doing max damage on italy and half on germany



  • @Deathtwinkie:

    I mean, every single turn, his US has 57 IPC’s to build with……his regular amount, and he’s getting 15IPC’s every turn from the bonus income.

    Where on earth is the US getting that income from?  3 NOs would require Japan to completely ignore the pacific, and/or for them to be taking France.  Sorry mate but you need to get a better axis game plan.

    And yes, SBRs are good and strong, but only as an element in the KGF strat, not as the entire plan.



  • my suggestion to you is to either play a pbf game, or check some of them out.  this will give you ideas,  what to do if allies are SBRing you to pieces, and what to do offensively & defensively.  i have played as the allies, bombing the crap out of germany, and still lost.  i have played as the axis, being on the recieving end of the bombings, and still won.  check out the other games bud, it will help.  if you like, we can start a game just to have a little walk through.  imo, japan is the key to an axis victory,  germany and italy just help out, sometimes alot.  good luck.  and go for radar or improved factories.  SBRs wont bother you any more if you can get both of those.  just $5 each turn till you hit something.


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