Heavy Bombers - House Rule


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    thinking of limiting Heavy Bombers so that they only do the better of two dice for strategic bombing runs and changing their attack so that a heavy bomber does not roll two attacks a round in normal battle, instead, they automatically “hit” each round they survive when attacking (applies to both naval and ground combat.)

    It just seems that in 1941, the allies have way too much ability to destroy Europe with Heavy Bombers doing nothing but SBR runs, doubly so when they ignore Japan.  Who cares if Japan is in Novosibirsk with a 500 IPC army, if Germany/Italy have a combined income of negative 10 IPC a round?



  • ah, best ball (golf is sometimes played as you suggested with the SBR dice).

    I do not like Technology much. I believe it to be game breaking. Broken if you never roll technology, broken if you roll a poor technology, and broken if you get a superior technology (like heavy bombers)

    Why not roll dice at the beginning of the game to see who wins(highest roll wins)? After that, play the game without technology.

    I don’t mean to be sarcastic but it seems that is what technology is, a gamble hoping to turn the coarse of the game with zero strategy.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    I’ve long had house rules for classic/revised where each nation has a nation specific ability.  (not necessarily a technology.)

    Like Russia could buy infantry at 2 IPC each but could not leave Red territories.
    America could rebuild any sunk ship or shot down plane at 67% cost.

    Etc. (German tanks attacked at 4; Japanese Infantry attacked at 2 during an Amphibious Assault.)

    But in this case, H. Bombs are not really broken, they just seem disproportionately powerful for the cost of a bomber.  (They are not broken because both sides can get them and thus be equal.)  Perhaps if a bomber cost 20 IPC like a battleship it would be more appropriate for them to get a major upgrade like this.  After all, bombers cost 12 IPC, attack at a 4 (or 2@4), can move 6 (or 😎 can potentially carry infantry to attack long distance, can attack land, sea and industrial complex.

    If they cost 20, then that would be stellar, that would be akin to the battleship taking two hits to sink.

    I guess either I should go with above, or increase the price of a bomber to 20 IPC (which is WAY doable in 1941.  When America and Japan are potentially earning 60-90 IPC, they can both afford to drop coin on a 20 IPC bomber!  Likewise Geramny can too, with their 50-60 IPC, considering I routinely buy two bombers with Germany and not have a problem/that’s in a single round btw, not two different rounds.)


  • Customizer

    So basically you want:

    SBR = LHTR, roll 2 dice, pick better, add one
    Normal Attacks = Attack at a 6 (ie: always hit)

    I would totally support this, and I think it is a superior modification of LHTR



  • what about up the prices to 20 for Heavy bombers, the price increase when you get it. Also existing bombers needs to be outfittet with the new tech for lets say 5ipc a piece.



  • ok, I got it.

    I didn’t realize you were modifying all nations abilities.

    Another possibility is to keep bombers at the price of 12 but you could pay each time a bomber wanted to use their extra hit (say 3 IPC’s).  You won’t have to worry about an extra marker for super bombers.

    Just pay 3 IPC’s for each usage of the extra die roll you wish to inflict (combat or SBR) purchase during the purchase units phase.



  • Using the optional escort rule puts a damper on the SBRs in this game.
    I highly recommend playing with it.

    However that does not solve the “bombers rule the sea” issue.



  • @Pin:

    what about up the prices to 20 for Heavy bombers, the price increase when you get it. Also existing bombers needs to be outfittet with the new tech for lets say 5ipc a piece.

    I agree.  If one insists on using a house rule due to percieving something as a bit too strong/weak, I think “paying for how much it is worth” is the smartest, most logical, and easiest option. It may take a few experiments to figure out a “just price”, but I certainly think altering price should be seen as the ideal.



  • I too agree that HB can totally win a game.  However, I have also played games where my opponent spend a fortune trying to get HB but ended up with all the others first.  That is a lot of lost money on tech when you were really trying for one only.

    I like tech because it changes the game every time.  It brings a freshness to every battle.  My buddy got paratroopers for Russia and utilized it to the fullest.  Really changed the way the Axis played their game.

    If anyone has actually found a really good way (game played already) to limit the impact of HB I would still like to hear it.  I may just impose the same rules.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @axis_roll:

    Using the optional escort rule puts a damper on the SBRs in this game.
    I highly recommend playing with it.

    However that does not solve the “bombers rule the sea” issue.

    That’s not so much an issue but a historical fact though.  It does put a crimp in many player’s naval games, but many players don’t know how to build a fleet anyway.

    20 IPC for a bomber, period, would be fine for me.  Maybe even require an AA Gun hit twice to kill it like a battleship. (First hit turns it back so it does no damage at all, second one shoots it down.)



  • I don’t like the idea of increasing prices for earning a tech. Rolling two (or even three) and then picking the best sigle result pretty much guarantees the same results as your original idea without the “auto hit” statement that can appear somewhat cheesy to your opponent (not nearly as cheesy as the way it is now or especially in classic though).
    That being saind, I think HB is in there to be the playable equivalent of nukes and a way to move the game to conclusion quicker.



  • @Cmdr:

    thinking of limiting Heavy Bombers so that they only do the better of two dice for strategic bombing runs and changing their attack so that a heavy bomber does not roll two attacks a round in normal battle, instead, they automatically “hit” each round they survive when attacking (applies to both naval and ground combat.)

    hmmm personally I’d lean toward pushing the Heavies into a strategic role. So keep the 2d6 for SBR but no ground combat advantage over normal / medium bombers.

    No Arc Light missions.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    I wasn’t talking about raising the price if you get heavy bombers, I was talking about raising the price period.

    Here we go:

    Bomber:
    Cost: 20 IPC
    Attack: 4
    Defend: 1
    Move: 6

    Heavy Bomber:
    Cost: 20 IPC
    Attack: 1 Automatic Hit
    Defend: 1
    SBR: 2@6 take best 1
    Move: 6

    In either case a single AA Gun hit turns your bomber back, a second hit shoots down your bomber. (Justifies the increased cost of the bomber, and the increased cost should limit the amount of bombers put on the board.)



  • @Cmdr:

    Cost: 20 IPC

    a single AA Gun hit turns your bomber back, a second hit shoots down your bomber. (Justifies the increased cost of the bomber, and the increased cost should limit the amount of bombers put on the board.)

    That is a very interesting idea with the AA gun, and could really push for radar research



  • @Cmdr:

    In either case a single AA Gun hit turns your bomber back, a second hit shoots down your bomber. (Justifies the increased cost of the bomber, and the increased cost should limit the amount of bombers put on the board.)

    So in essence they’re like the Battleships of the skies; possessing a two-hit capacity.

    That should really promote SBR as a low-risk role.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @allboxcars:

    @Cmdr:

    In either case a single AA Gun hit turns your bomber back, a second hit shoots down your bomber. (Justifies the increased cost of the bomber, and the increased cost should limit the amount of bombers put on the board.)

    So in essence they’re like the Battleships of the skies; possessing a two-hit capacity.

    That should really promote SBR as a low-risk role.

    Yes it would, but to counter that, you’re spending 20 IPC for a bomber now.  Max you can do in damage is 6 with each bomber.  So you’re looking at a 4 round minimum to recoup the loss of the bomber through SBR damage.  However, at the average dmg of 3.5 per bomber, and the 33.3% chance of a Radar Equipped AA Gun of at least making you retreat, it’s probably going to take MUCH longer!

    @critmonster:

    @Cmdr:

    Cost: 20 IPC

    a single AA Gun hit turns your bomber back, a second hit shoots down your bomber. (Justifies the increased cost of the bomber, and the increased cost should limit the amount of bombers put on the board.)

    That is a very interesting idea with the AA gun, and could really push for radar research

    Yea, that’s the idea.  They cost an arm and a leg, but it’s hard to lose them too.


  • '10

    @scampb:

    If anyone has actually found a really good way (game played already) to limit the impact of HB I would still like to hear it.  I may just impose the same rules.

    How about taking the average of the two rounding up for SBR???



  • I like the LHTR for HB, best of 2 dice for attack and best +1 for SBR. Sometimes we also do best of 2 for def. We have also allowed 2 dice for attack, but the 2nd dice hits on a 3 or less(50%). Should roll dice separately. You could also limit all bmrs to 2 rounds of battle. After they drop their bombs/torpedo’s they wouldn’t be hanging out anyway, they would be getting the hell out of dodge. As for cost maybe go back to $15, but $20 seems to high to me.

    Personally I love to shoot down bmrs with AA guns, so if I rolled a 1 and it just turned the SBR back instead of destroying it that would suck. I would however go for roll a 1 bmr destroyed, roll a 2 SBR canceled. Then you wouldn’t have to give them 2 hits in SBR. This would also be a good rule if you were not playing w/tech (radar).



  • Our 1939 World at war heavy bombers rules.

    HB = special units.
    Only UK and USA may produce HB. (Avro Lancaster & B29)

    Germany may produce HB as tech. dev.

    Cost = 18
    Att = 4 (two dice for each industrial bombing attack).
    Def = 2
    Move = 8


Log in to reply
 

Suggested Topics

  • 2
  • 15
  • 20
  • 7
  • 42
  • 11
  • 10
  • 11
I Will Never Grow Up Games
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures
Dean's Army Guys

38
Online

13.7k
Users

34.1k
Topics

1.3m
Posts