Lets Talk 2 Types of Tanks

most people say each turn is 4 to 6 months and looking at the map in the 1941 scenario the game start somewhere in June-July.

I guess we would have to figure out which tech we were going to want in the game, then figure out when it was developed by each country and then we could figure out which turn that they would automatically get it  when using 4 or 6 months as the turn duration and see what makes more sense.

However if they want it sooner they could spend money on research. If other countries wanted rockets they would only get it by spending money on research. If Germany wanted the A-Bomb they would also have to spend money on research whereas the United States would automatically get it in 1945.

Ya Good example. Seriously, I like that.

We should start a new topic about that.

On my world at war 1939 game. 1 turn = 3 months (1 season)
A timeline chart….not bad.
1943 = heavy tank and heavy artillery (Katioucha) for USSR and Germany player.
1944 =  Jet for Germany,super destroyer for USA and UK + heavy carrrier for USA.

Just another spin on this idea, we could still require a country to invest a certain amount each turn, roll to see if they get lucky and develop it early, but if they do not theywould still get it at the normal time. If they choose not to invest the money then they will not get the techs that they would have been automatically alloted.

what if players straight up paid for Techs?

like each tech could be worth so many research points and 1 research point costs 5 IPCS or something.

you could still roll a die to see if you get it early, ie a breakthrough in technology occured.

Jet power could be worth 3 research Points
Super Subs could be worth4 research points and Etc….

this is just an example and not the Actual costs of things, but hows that for an Idea?

If they choose not to invest the money then they will not get the techs that they would have been automatically alloted.

• I prefer ‘’ Player discretion’'.

like each tech could be worth so many research points and 1 research point costs 5 IPCS or something.

• 5 IPC for each dice, it’s fine.

I’m going to suggest this idea to our club members and gets their feelings.

I would certainly like to hear some more opinions.

Ok, every unit needs a unique position to warrent its inclusion into the game and we would like to try and make it semi accurate.

Inf are the best defensive bang for your buck and all around cheapest unit.
Art are the best offensive bang for your buck, although I honestly think they need modified (maybe not with 6 IPC tanks though).
Arms have the 2 movement, that is there thing.  Although I feel with mec inf as a 1-2-2-4, and arm as a 3-3-2-6, your going to see alot more mec inf than you will Arm.  The new G1 buy (if art effect mec inf) will be all art, followed with waves of mec inf.  For this reason I believe arm should be 3-2-2-5.  Weak in the defense, but still offensive powerhouses.

Now for a heavy tank.  Historically they were extremely expensive, extremely durable, a bit slow, and strong on the defense.

3-4-2 or 4-4-2 would be my pick, without the blitz ability (2 movement yes, but no blitz, not a big detail, but still) but can take 2 hits.  Since this is modeled after a battleship so to speak, which is almost double the cost of a cruiser, they should be almost double the cost of a normal tank, 10ish IPCs.  But with the 2 hit, would be really good in a strafe, or against multiple invaders.  Would a ton of them be purchased? No, but some would be and they would have a nitch.

Bugoo: great points, but wouldn’t we be back to the Milton Bradley Axis and Allies if we go back to arms being 3-2-2-5, where infantry with artillery would be the best buy?  I like the heavy tank at 10, consider it as land fighters.

Does anyone know if artillery would also support mechanized infantry or only infantry?  That would make artillery that much more powerful.

Honestly I feel the 3/3/2 tank at 5 ipcs is a fair value, esp with mech inf being added in.  If you think about it even on attack the mech inf would be a better buy as for 24 IPCs you could have 6 mech inf or 4 armor.  At face value armor is a better attacker, but lets add in 2 bombers with the attack.  In that situation I think the mech inf come out on top.  We will see a return to insane inf stacks in europe anyway with the mech inf unit, they’ll just be a mix of inf and mech inf.

True, but when we have stacks, the tanks would be better value.  With smaller battles it might not matter as much but with the new boards being gigantic, we might not have stacks anymore, too many places to defend, you might be able to make it to Russia and avoid counterattacks, if you move fast enough.  I am still curious if artillery will support mechanized infantry or even if there will be a technology that allows mechanized infantry to be matched to tanks.  That would be awesome blitzkrieg!!!  Still would like a land transport but this discussion is about tanks.

@bugoo:

Honestly I feel the 3/3/2 tank at 5 ipcs is a fair value, esp with mech inf being added in.  If you think about it even on attack the mech inf would be a better buy as for 24 IPCs you could have 6 mech inf or 4 armor.  At face value armor is a better attacker, but lets add in 2 bombers with the attack.  In that situation I think the mech inf come out on top.  We will see a return to insane inf stacks in europe anyway with the mech inf unit, they’ll just be a mix of inf and mech inf.

No, i still think tanks at 6 will not be used all that much.  The only reason tanks are purchased in AA50 are
A) Speed
B) Build Caps

Germany builds tanks because they can build 10 units, why not tanks.  Japan builds tanks because of, once again alot of income and small number of units that can be built.  With 6 IPC tanks you would be nuts to buy them over mech inf, imho, esp if art matches up with them.  The only redeeming quality of tanks would be the strat bombers attacking at a 4, but once again, strat bombers at 11 are junk, for 1 more you get a bomber with 2 more range.  Sure it cannot defend well, but that is what a fighter, costing 10, is for.

I just ran the numbers in TripleA battle calc (I know not the best).

6 inf + 1 bomber can kill 6 inf 62% of the time
4 arm + 1 bomber can kill 6 inf …62% of the time

Same cost, same offensive effect, but mech inf are so much better on D its not even funny.  And you will almost always have air attacking with you, unless AA guns go down to 4 or something.

Mech inf: 1/2/2 @ 4 ipc
Arm: 3/3/2 @ 5 ipc
H Arm: 3/4/2 @9 ipc (is 2 hit)

That is the only way I can see using each of those units.

Good job Bugoo, a +1 to you

Good point bugoo, I keep forgetting that tanks will cost 6 not 5, I was thinking for 1 more you can get a 3/3/2 instead of 1/2/2.  More changes to get used to again.

What about returning to the old MB values for “regular” tanks, AND for transport capacity, which opens up possibilities for by elite infantry (“Marines”), especially if transports can only carry one mech infantry or art., but 2 marines…  With that in mind, here’s my new land combat unit chart for FMG’s New Pieces Project (NPP):

Piece              Name                   Attack         Defense        Move        Cost             Special
Soldier 1        Para. Infantry           1                 2                 1             4            Can be air dropped w/ +1 attack

Soldier 2        Elite/ Marine             2                 2                 1             4             + 1 Attack during Amphibious Assult

Truck            Motor Unit                0                 0                 2             1             Can Blitz: “Motorizer” for Infantry/Art.

Gun(1)           Artillery                   2                 3                 1             5             + 1 to infantry attack on 1-1 basis

Half-Track     Mech. Infantry           2                 2                 2             4             Can Blitz

Tank 1          Armor                       3                 2                 2             5             Can Blitz

Tank 2          Heavy Armor              3                 3                 2             6             Can Blitz

Note also, that the above is what I already do, using TT halftracks for mech, TT jeeps for motor, TWG Tigers for heavy tanks, alternate color AH Infantry for elites and off-the-shelf HO’s for airborne… I’m just hoping for a gear upgrade from FMG to spruce up my line-up!