Options for Russia when Germany plays defensively



  • I was wondering what some of you who have been playing a lot as the Allies like to do with Russia in response to a mostly German infantry build on G1.  It seems to me that this would allow Russia to help out more in Asia or Africa and limit the Axis income greatly.  I pondered a 5 submarine build in Caucasus to help destroy the Italian navy on turn 2 but then remembered that they are limited to 4 units in Caucasus, which reduces the odds of success.  Any ideas or things that you have actually tried that ended with success?



  • I like a Russian bomber in that case.

    Power and range.  If you put the bomber in the caucasus, you can threaten a jap transport that might have taken east indies without worry.

    The bomber can kill the transport and land in india or australia

    Also a bomber CAN reach manchuria R2.  Might not have the best landing zone, however.


  • 2007 AAR League

    That’s awesome. I usually build my Russian bomber in Russia to hit Buryatia or Finland/Norway if given the chance, but I think I will change my placement to Caucasus from now on.

    But, to be honest, my build depends on how well Germany did on their turn. If Germany swept the Russian front without taking many casualties then I go with 5 inf, 1 arm, 1 fig for the defensive value. I only make the 6 inf, 1 bmb build if Germany does average or worse.

    In general, Russia can’t go wrong with building an aircraft unit on R1 because it allows you to at least begin trading territories without wasting offensive units. Although, I have seen people who never buy aircraft and just go with mass infantry and a few artillery for trading with a slow armor buildup. I can’t do that. It makes me cringe to use Russian units in that manner.


  • Moderator

    I think Russia can be aggressive, moving its stack/stacks out as far as they can go without being strafed or counter attacked by Ger.  If you can denying the trading of a ter then do it and it’s obviously great if you can hold Epl, but with Inf Heavy purchases by Ger in rds 1 and 2 you are likely going to be forced back in round 3 anyway.

    I like inf + arm or inf + rt for Russia in rd 1.

    @U-505:

    In general, Russia can’t go wrong with building an aircraft unit on R1 because it allows you to at least begin trading territories without wasting offensive units. Although, I have seen people who never buy aircraft and just go with mass infantry and a few artillery for trading with a slow armor buildup. I can’t do that. It makes me cringe to use Russian units in that manner.

    I’d be one that tends to avoid the early Russian air buy.  I think an initial buy of 6 inf, 3 rt can be pretty valuable.  I like trying to get maximum units on the board and I’m a little hesitent to put 10-12 ipc into a plane right away.

    I agree, I hate “throwing away” one of those rt but usually you can manipulate stacks to preserve them in at least one battle or worst case you attack 1 inf with 2 inf (or 3).  Most of the ter Russia trades early are only 1-2 ipc in value so I feel a lot better going 2 inf (or 3) vs. 1 inf.

    I like to add air once Russia is getting mid 30’s or loses some production ability either by trading Kar briefly or via SBRs.


  • 2018 2017 '16 '11 Moderator

    You know, I used to think the same about Russia and air, but I’ve recently been changing my mind and suggesting that Russia should wait until Round 2 before buying Aircraft and focusing on Armor in Round 1 (5 inf, 3 arm maybe, or even Inf, 3 Art, 3 Arm since you start with a lot of infantry already.)

    Reason is, if you wait a round, you can see how Germany and Japan act.  Yes, you get to see Germany 1 before Russia 1, but the problem there is that Germany might not be conservative at all, they might only seem conservative and defensive on the first round so they can be more of a threat in subsequent rounds.  Japan, of course, comes after Russia and it’s good to know if Japan’s going land grab crazy or slow and steady before committing to bombers and fighters.

    BTW, I agree that bombers are a better option for Russia than fighters.  The cost is virtually the same, the range is 33% longer and the attack 25% stronger than a fighter.  But I can also see the argument that fighters are, in reality, cheaper than bombers and those extra 2 IPC, while virtually not a lot of money, could be used to upgrade two infantry into Artillery instead of upgrading the fighter to a bomber.

    Guess it depends on what cash you have and what you need more.



  • @Cmdr:

    .
    BTW, I agree that bombers are a better option for Russia than fighters.  The cost is virtually the same, the range is 33% longer and the attack 25% stronger than a fighter.  But I can also see the argument that fighters are, in reality, cheaper than bombers and those extra 2 IPC, while virtually not a lot of money, could be used to upgrade two infantry into Artillery instead of upgrading the fighter to a bomber.

    Another factor is if you are playing with the official optional rule of SBR escorts/interceptors.  +1 for the ftrs if you are….



  • This happened to me the last game. A defensive German opening gave me as Allied time to build up a strong India. As Russian, I first moved 5 infantry Persia (then India). As UK I built one IC in India, moving infantry and all the RAF and USAF fighters there. Japan tried to push towards India, but never dared to assault due to the strong defence. In Europe, USA and UK was bombing Germany to the stone age, then invading France and NW Europe.

    Even if Japan pushed hard with tanks towards Moscow via Siberia and China in the end, they never really threaten Russia, resulting in a quite easy victory.

    I think that you should push quite hard towards Caucasus as German, to prevent Russia helping UK in India.



  • @Cmdr:

    You know, I used to think the same about Russia and air, but I’ve recently been changing my mind and suggesting that Russia should wait until Round 2 before buying Aircraft and focusing on Armor in Round 1 (5 inf, 3 arm maybe, or even Inf, 3 Art, 3 Arm since you start with a lot of infantry already.)

    Reason is, if you wait a round, you can see how Germany and Japan act.  Yes, you get to see Germany 1 before Russia 1, but the problem there is that Germany might not be conservative at all, they might only seem conservative and defensive on the first round so they can be more of a threat in subsequent rounds.  Japan, of course, comes after Russia and it’s good to know if Japan’s going land grab crazy or slow and steady before committing to bombers and fighters.

    BTW, I agree that bombers are a better option for Russia than fighters.  The cost is virtually the same, the range is 33% longer and the attack 25% stronger than a fighter.  But I can also see the argument that fighters are, in reality, cheaper than bombers and those extra 2 IPC, while virtually not a lot of money, could be used to upgrade two infantry into Artillery instead of upgrading the fighter to a bomber.

    Guess it depends on what cash you have and what you need more.

    and don’t forget, bomber only defends on 1
    but how many air units should russia get?
    first or second turn?
    cause i think, weakest link in german plans is their lack of inf, while russians have a damn lot of them


  • 2018 2017 '16 '11 Moderator

    Front:

    I think by the middle of a typical game, Russia should have 3 fighters going because they’ll need to trade three territories pretty routinely.


    I am always amazed when I see people say they built an Industrial Complex in India and don’t follow up with saying worst idea ever.  Who are these Japanese players NOT taking the complex on round 2, again on round 3, again on round 4, etc until the Allies give up or are unable to liberate it again?

    You have the firepower!  Round 2 you should have no less than 5 ground units and 5 fighters in range of India (compare to 4 or 5 ground units and an AA Gun and you can see how you have a significant advantage!).  Round 3, KNOWING that England HAS a complex there, and forcing Russia to send tanks to India instead of against Germany, you should definitely have half a dozen ground units and the cruiser/battleship for a follow up (plus any fighters you have remaining.)  From there it’s a matter of shuttling 4 to 6 ground units a round into FIC and then over to India to keep it from building units.

    This shuttling should be a simple matter.  You only need enough units in SZ 37 and SZ 62 to prevent America from killing your transports (assuming you don’t just put ICs in Burma and FIC like I do) so you can bring troops down.  So what if America goes Pacific?  Russia’s throwing away tanks keeping you from building in India!  By the time America builds up, with Russia diverting 33-67% or more of it’s new builds to India, Germany should be just about into Moscow and looking to start a Sea Lion invasion fleet!

    Yea, ok, I have a tendency to summarize the next 10-20 rounds, but I hope you guys can see where I am going.  Normally, Japan has to worry about an American flotilla in the Pacific for financial sake.  Normally Japan can’t even get into Moscow before round 5 and that’s assuming there’s nothing in the way!  But in this case, Russia’s sending so much down into India to keep it from building Japanese units that Germany is virtually unopposed.  (I’d also advocate, for the first time in my life, that Germany go for a tank dash if Russia’s sending so much down to India.  May as well!)


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