• Does anyone else just abandon Karelia turn 1?

  • Depends what Germany did.

    Sometimes its a good idea though. If Germany went hard into Baltic States, then I’d probably pull out. Buy some tanks in Russia, then stack everything possible in Belorussia. This will not only dead-zone Karelia, but often the Germans will be forced to retreat from Baltic States and East Poland. Then you can take Karelia back on R2, plus the scandanavian territories on R3.

    If Germany goes light into Baltic States and didn’t stack Finland with 4 inf, then I’d probably just counter-attack to create a buffer zone around Karelia.

  • It also depends on what year you are playing.  If you’re playing 41, then you almost have to take the hits as they come, and generally this means losing Karelia on turn one.  However, if you’re playing in 42, you may be able to hold the territory.  Also when I’ve played, if I do not plan hold Karelia then I always make sure to move out the AA gun.

    Either way, Russia’s options are very limited. 😐

  • in 41’, abandon the Karelian units to Archangel on R1 or they will just be destroyed next turn.  None of Russias builds will go there so its strategically necessary to retreat. I dont think its worth losing these units to try and prevent the Germans from getting one of their NOs. The IPC value of Karelia is meaningless to Russia at this point in the game so they can just give it up.

  • if g1 sets up kar g2, id buy 6 tanks and deadzone it. if he takes it g1 id buy a ftr, arm 5 inf.

    if he semi sets up kar g2 ( not all tanks in range , bad dice, not 4 inf in finland, really depends…) id might try to hold it one more turn. so it would be 3 tanks ( 2 for kar) and 5 inf

    i dont like counterattacking baltic states (unless really bad german dice/move). you will be trading ukraine soon enough , so every saved unit is worth it

  • Sometimes you have to abandon Leningrad. But if you do so, don’t forget to pull out the AA-Gun too. If Germany conquers it, that factory will get SBR by your allies. UK has one Bomber and US player can send one in round 1. Both will be in UK waiting for the action.

    So that IC can be SBR’d 2 times, so that IC should have 4 damage markers when G3 starts.

    For the Russians the loss of that IC is not that hard, they can still produce 10 units, for Germany it is hard, especially with NOs, when Germany has 50 IPC/round. Germany needs a second factory. If you force them to repair (4 IPC) and build a AAR (6 IPC) that “leaving Karelia empty manouver” proved right !

    And make the Germans pay for massing in Baltic States - infantry and artillery are 2 spaces away from Kiev - capture Ukraine as Russia, Germans go north? Ok, Russia goes south.

  • Karelia sounds like a nice way to bait the Germans. Let them have it, but have your allies bomb the complex so that he cannot readily reinforce it. Then you can strike Karelia after you have gathered your forces together. It could work out like a Stalingrad of the north.

  • One thing I want to try is a 5 inf/3 armor build while leaving only 5 inf in karelia and caucaus, 2 inf + 4 armor in Moscow, then 7 inf + 1 art + AA in Belorussia and Eastern Ukraine.  Yes you leave your factories exposed but you also force the german tank stack to pull back or get destroyed.  Not sure if it would work but it would be nice to have a nice big stack on east poland R2 or atleast the ability to deadzone it.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    I always wanted to see if i could make a 3 Fighter buy work.

  • Woah Imperious Leader!

    I actually intended to ask the question with respect to 1942 scenario. I realize however how many of the responses were to the 1941.

    It’s cool, no worries.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    1942 is a different matter.  In 1942 you have a fighter and a bomber.

    With the 24 starting IPC, I would probably say 3 Infantry, Armor, Fighter which would give you 2 fighters, bomber, 5 armor for real combat units (as opposed to infantry/artillery which I view more as fodder.)

  • Three fighters is a bit much, you are going to need some infantry to soak up the hits from the Italians and Germans.  What do you expect to do with 3 fighters on R2? The Germans and Italians wipe out your front line on turn 1 which means on R2 you have to make some sort of counter attack which further bleeds your ground forces.  Is R2 builds just infantry and maybe an armor to make up for this lack of numbers.  Also, where do you deploy them? 2 in Karelia or all three in the Caucasus?

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    Italy’s too busy to bother Russia for the first couple of rounds anyway.  Germany has nothing it can bring to the fight on Round 2 that it did not already have on Round 1.  Therefore, it seems like an opportune time for Russia to get some fighters and save cash. (Saved cash comes from not using tanks and artillery to trade territories, instead, like Germany, using fighters to trade.)

  • Exactly Nickiow, I’ve seen this in both of the games I’m currently in.  I did build 2 ftr’s and place them on Karelia on R1 while moving as much equipment as I could there as well in one game.  Then made a counter attacker on the Ukraine and took that back. this left Germany facing a well defended Karelia and left Italy being forced to take the Ukraine back on their turn to help the Germans out.  I’m not sure how this will al work out yet, but I’m hopefull this may end the flee Karelia strategy or force the Germans to take it on G1 which can be costly as well.

  • Russia can simply take Finland, and either take Norway as well the following turn or let Britain have it.  Doing so means you can still counterattack next turn, but you’ve killed a couple Infantry, got some more IPCs, and are 2/3s of the way to Russia’s 10 IPC NO in no time.

  • From the few games I’ve played, I believe that the Germans simply must take Karelia on G1 or face a long and bitter struggle with Russia. Germany doesn’t start without alot of forces, so they need to knock out as many of Russia’s as possible. The Karellia attack on G1 is risky, but it must be done.

  • It depends on what the Germans do in Turn 1 and attack E. Poland, Ukraine and make a heavy play for Karelia via Baltic States. And don’t take Karelia in Turn 1, I like to move 2 Inf from Archangel into Karlia, 2 Inf from Russia into Karelia, along w/2 Inf builds in Karlia for 11 Inf in Karelia Turn 1. Then move 3 Inf from Russia into Belorussia, then 1 Art from Karlia to Archangel for counterattack and 1 Art from Russia to Archangel for counterattack. Makes it hard for the Germans to take Karlia Turn 2 w/out heavy losses. And you have a counterattack force for Turn 2, if the Germans attack Karelia from the Baltic States Turn 2. Plus, by then you might have English forces to land in Karelia(Turn 2) as well and take it back.


  • It works, except i like to setup for a push at ukraine instead of a counter-attack at Karelia, let the UK retake Kar, this will give you a huge unit advantage in the south as almost off of G’s units are destroyed in Kar on the UK counter-attack and you will have a stack of 10+ in ukraine waiting to take your 2nd NO.  This is also a fun time to take US/UK figs and land them in ukraine to backup your russians and if G put most of it’s tanks, as it usually will to kill 11 inf, in Kar you dont even have to worry about a can opener from italy and can place 4 more armor in Cauc for the turn 3 hit of Romania and even a fig in Moscow if you desire.  If they don’t take the bait simply move the Kar stack into Belorussia on turn 3 as you move into Ukraine while placing previously stated armor and let the UK drop its 4+ units into Kar.  Then G is really in a pickle.  😄

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