AARHE: A note on Cruisers making Battleships obsolete



  • After reading the AARHE rules (btw.: you really should update the files in the House Rules section and on Boardgame Geeks) I got the impression that BBs are dominated by CAs.

    The unit stats:

    Battleship
    Combat: 4/4
    Cost: 20 IPC
    Move: 2
    Anti-Air: 2
    ASW: no
    Special: Fire in opening phase, shore bombardment, 2 hits, build in 2 turns

    Cruiser
    Combat: 3/3
    Cost: 15 IPC
    Move: 3
    Anti-Air: 3
    ASW: yes
    Special: shore bombardment, 2 hits

    To better compare the two ship classes we must see what we get for the same amount of IPC. For 60 IPC we get 4 CA or 3 BB.

    4 Cruiser vs 3 Battleships
    Combat: 12/12 vs 12/12
    Hits: 8 vs 6
    Move: 3 vs 2
    Anti-Air: 12 vs 6
    ASW: yes vs no
    BB fire in opening but need 2 turns to be built.

    Even with their opening fire ability the BBs lose against the CAs in combat. The CAs are faster, can attack subs, have better AA and can be built in the same turn.
    This way CA dominate BB - it is always the better strategy to buy CA instead of BB and that is not good in game design.

    Please tell me if I missed anything of importance.


  • 2017 2016 2015 Organizer '14 Customizer '13 '12 '11 '10

    Well then you are a very smart chap!

    This is the intention to demonstrate the greater utility in the CA or the CV, than the BB.

    The only thing in your calculation thats of crucial importance is the fact that they fire preemptively every round unless another BB is present. At a 4 its clear that one cruiser will die before shooting and the other 2 will have to stop the bb.

    The balance according to our playtest shows with that benefit, the margins are still in favor of cruisers, but its paper thin.

    Typically, in AARHE people wont be buying BB’s because of these other choices and this models the historical result. If you think the balance should be equal, then i would look into damage effects, giving the damaged cruisers more serious effects than the BB. I may even make the cruiser 16 IPC.

    IN WW2 the BB was overshadowed in its superior firepower but the increased specialization of faster ships with niche capabilities.

    I will ask Tekkyy to update the files and actually i will submit the AARHE project to BGG as its own game. But right now we are working on 4.1 rules, then followed by a AA50HE version.



  • yeah it does seem Cruisers dominate Battleships
    in the 4 CA vs 3 BB combat
    and of course Cruiser is much better unit overall
    (note Cruiser can bombard too)

    maybe Cruiser and Aircraft Carrier shouldn’t take 2-hits after all
    I haven’t played games with all optional units select for play (usually only select naval fighter)
    but yeah its funny how:
    BB 2-hit, 2-turn
    CA 2-hit, 1-turn
    CV 2-hit, 2-turn

    sorry we only post major updates to Board Game Geek and minor updates here
    the latest version is 20081102 (version 4.0 draft)
    since then, there is a discussion in trimming down AARHE and the result would probably be called version 4.1

    no updates on this however as its not practical to do so
    we are cleaning up phase 1, then phase 2, etc…
    naval unit movement in phase 3 Combat Move is on the agenda

    i will submit the AARHE project to BGG as its own game.

    don’t think thats a good idea
    its not a new game and will be even less so after we get rid of the tedious bits of AARHE


  • 2017 2016 2015 Organizer '14 Customizer '13 '12 '11 '10

    maybe Cruiser and Aircraft Carrier shouldn’t take 2-hits after all

    I haven’t played games with all optional units select for play (usually only select naval fighter)
    but yeah its funny how:
    BB 2-hit, 2-turn
    CA 2-hit, 1-turn
    CV 2-hit, 2-turn

    yes but we are working on that now with 4.1 no more 2 turn naval builds.

    carriers could go to 1 hit units and of course the latter file for AA50HE will have them just at 1 for both CA and CV.


Log in to reply
 

Suggested Topics

  • 24
  • 6
  • 22
  • 51
  • 121
  • 25
  • 17
  • 10
I Will Never Grow Up Games
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures
Dean's Army Guys

60
Online

13.7k
Users

34.1k
Topics

1.3m
Posts