• Last week I played my cousin in AA50, 1941. I was the axis. In the first couple of rounds he bought ALL bombers with UK. By the 3rd round he had 6 Bombers. By the 5th round he had 15 Bombers, UK and USA combined and they were all industrial bombing Germany. I would say a total of 25 Industrial bombing in the first 5 rounds. Maybe more…I shot down NO BOMBERS! my luck :o(…anyways how does Germany even survive this. I had Russia dead to rights by the second round, but because he had 15 Bombers he was getting max damage on my factories and I was only able to afford a few guys here and a few guys there. I wasnt able to reinforce the Western front…eventually Russia built up and pushed my guys back…I tried to industrial bomb Russia with two bombers, but they both got shot down…lol…A couple of days ago I played my brother. HE SUCKS AT THIS GAME. He never even plays AA anymore. Not for years and he did the same strategy on me. Is it that easy that any idiot can just buy bombers and keep Germany’s factories useless. Does anyone have a strategy to prevent this.


  • I hope you play the rules right. Germany can’t be bombed any further than a loss of 20 IPC to repair the damage. But that’s only when you want to produce 10 units. If you only want to produce 8, there is no need to spend more than 18 IPC on repairing damage.

    Although it hurts, SBR-ing isn’t as effective as it once was.  😉

    p.s. with tech it gets even better for Germany. 😉

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    I think it is more effective since now one country can do 200% damage than they could before.

    Before Germany could only be hit for MAX 10 IPC.  Now they can be hit for MAX 20 IPC.


  • Every round my complex would get maxed bombed. Germany was only making 30/35 so 15 to repair and i could only buy 3 tanks or 5 men. it was like that all game. Russia was out buying me


  • rpv173,  Read this thread.

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=12966.0

    Also, where is Japan during this time?  If UK and USA were building nothing but bombers, how did they contain Japan?


  • Bombers are also 3 bucks cheaper now, making SBRs more tempting.

    There is anything you can do to stop the Allies from bombing you if they buy loads of bombers. That said, you also had very poor luck in shooting them down. You cant do anything about very poor luck besides minimizing your risk of it.


  • Since i wasnt able to buy enough units to send to the Russian front, Russia was moving a lot of their pieces to china. That kept japan busy for a while. eventually japan broke through but it was too late. i got rid of the american fleet in the pacific and the US player devoted the entire effort towards Germany…Germany was bombed 25+ times no bombers shot down. I send 2 bombers to Russia both shot down like flies…My cousin swears he’s good at this game, but all he did was industrial bomb me.


  • I would have somehow tried to attack the bombers wherever they were parked and destroy as many as possible. Its a hard tactic to fight against the bombing raids with that many machines coming in. The AA gun is a slim hope without radar tech.

  • 2007 AAR League

    Well, shooting down zero bombers is an anomaly that should correct itself the more games you play.

    I say return the favor.

    With the UK spending all of their money on bombers then Italy should have no trouble in Africa and Japan should take India early and be making in the 50’s rather quickly. With that kind of income Japan can easily afford 1 or 2 bombers per turn and still make headway on all of their fronts. Japanese bombers in India can hit both of Russia’s big IC’s and any surplus bombers can go to Germany and begin paying the UK back for bombing Germany. Plus, Japanese bombers in Germany and India can also help the Italians keep the Med clean of Allied shipping.


  • He built a complex in egypt the first turn. I tried to take it with italy and germany but once again rolled some crappy dice. i eventually took control of africa with japan, but it didnt matter. he had about 10 bombers sitting in england i only had a couple of ftrs but they were defending my tanks. nothing i could do.


  • while england was pounding my complex into submission, usa was building a HUGE fleet of transports, tanks, men, artillery……I messed the board up before he could get an attack off on Germany lol.

  • 2007 AAR League

    Well, in my opinion, in the 41’ scenario people get greedy as Germany and make an ill advised attack on Egypt on G1.

    I think it’s best to transport 2 units to Libya with Germany and leave 2 units in Bulgaria for landing in Egypt on G2. That’s a total of 8 units(6 in Lib,2 inf Bul)+available air to threaten Egypt which should be enough to make the UK retreat on their turn and give the Italians a free walk in.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    Yes, well, the average cost per bombing run is down from 3 IPC to 2 IPC and the average gain hasn’t changed, so why not SBR?

    And who cares about containing Japan when you get to own all of Europe with Russia?  By the time Japan can take Russia, Russia’s got an income of insane proportions. (Though I’d let France fall to England or America since Russia cannot get the NO for it.)


  • @Cmdr:

    I think it is more effective since now one country can do 200% damage than they could before.

    Before Germany could only be hit for MAX 10 IPC.  Now they can be hit for MAX 20 IPC.

    This is incorrect. Germany could be hit 10 IPC MAX, per countries turn. This was potentially a 30 IPC Max on Germany per round if Russia somehow SBRed as well. But realistically, 20 IPC max. In revised, this was 20 IPC in real money, in the new game, Germany doesn’t have to spend the full 20. And if they don’t, the max damage is even less next round.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    But if Germany does not spend the money, they cannot build the units either.  So the reduced impact of not repairing is offset by reduced production. (No more 10 infantry in Germany, whew!)

    Also, I think you kind of realize what you said when you said technically Germany could be hit for 10 more by Russia in Revised.  So I won’t expound upon that.

    Lastly, I think it’s important to note that one country can do 200% damage now, so you don’t need bombers for everyone.  America could sit there and build nothing but bombers and do 32 IPC damage to Germany/Italy each round allowing England and Russia a chance to do the hard work of taking the soil.


  • @Cmdr:

    Lastly, I think it’s important to note that one country can do 200% damage now, so you don’t need bombers for everyone.  America could sit there and build nothing but bombers and do 32 IPC damage to Germany/Italy each round allowing England and Russia a chance to do the hard work of taking the soil.

    Ok, i see your point now, that only one of the allies has to take on a SBR campaign in AA50. Where as in Revised, both UK and USA had to commit to that. I honestly don’t like the Germany restricted in AA50. One IC? sure, maybe its designed that they get Karelia. But UK can deny them Karelia if they wanted to. And when you play with NOs, Germany is earning 50+ and 10 production spots. Its work for me, as I like buying bombers with Germany, but I also end up buying a lot more tanks in AA50. It seems like Germany is pigeoned into a panzer dash to moscow framework. The options seem way more limited in this version for the Germans!!

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    Yea, those NOs are really darn annoying.  So easy for Germany and Japan both to be getting 50+ while the allies are scrambling to keep 30ish.

    Oh, and if England helps with Karelia, then Russia loses 5 IPC a round.


  • @rpv173:

    He built a complex in egypt the first turn. I tried to take it with italy and germany but once again rolled some crappy dice. i eventually took control of africa with japan, but it didnt matter. he had about 10 bombers sitting in england i only had a couple of ftrs but they were defending my tanks. nothing i could do.

    Well if you AND fail to take Egypt with an IC on it on I2 AND you fail to take down 25 bombers in the whole game, than it has nothing to do with strategy but only with bad dice.

    By the way, I am curious how UK is able to hold an Egypt factory…, even with no G1 attack the axis should overrun this on the second turn… don’t tell me Japan didn’t attack those ships before the coast of India either…


  • We never play with NO…Is this ok? I thought that was an option…


  • @Driel310:

    @rpv173:

    He built a complex in egypt the first turn. I tried to take it with italy and germany but once again rolled some crappy dice. i eventually took control of africa with japan, but it didnt matter. he had about 10 bombers sitting in england i only had a couple of ftrs but they were defending my tanks. nothing i could do.

    Well if you AND fail to take Egypt with an IC on it on I2 AND you fail to take down 25 bombers in the whole game, than it has nothing to do with strategy but only with bad dice.

    By the way, I am curious how UK is able to hold an Egypt factory…, even with no G1 attack the axis should overrun this on the second turn… don’t tell me Japan didn’t attack those ships before the coast of India either…

    I killed his destroyer and transport next to india with two Jap ftrs. In egypt he had 3 inf. tank, art, ftr, and bomber. I attacked with Italy first with 3 inf, tank, ftr, art. and TWO bombardment shots. Both of those missed(they never hit for me) and I only got one hit with the rest. He took everything out but my ftr i retreated my ftr. In all i lost 3 men, art, tank and he just lost 1 inf. I didnt even attempt an attack with Germany. The next round he bought two bombers on the complex and the rd after that he destroyed my italian fleet.

    I want to note that since he defended egypt with everything i was able to take India w/IC in two turns. by rd 4 or so i took egypt over with Japan.

  • 2007 AAR League

    @rpv173:

    I killed his destroyer and transport next to india with two Jap ftrs.

    this is imperative. Smart move.

    In egypt he had 3 inf. tank, art, ftr, and bomber. I attacked with Italy first with 3 inf, tank, ftr, art. and TWO bombardment shots. Both of those missed(they never hit for me) and I only got one hit with the rest. He took everything out but my ftr i retreated my ftr. In all i lost 3 men, art, tank and he just lost 1 inf. I didnt even attempt an attack with Germany. The next round he bought two bombers on the complex and the rd after that he destroyed my italian fleet.

    You gotta believe me, landing 1 inf, 1 arm into Lib on G1 and moving 2 inf, or 1 inf, 1 arm to Bulgaria or Balk makes an Egypt defense untenable.

    Even if you don’t try to soften it up with an Italian landing beforehand, just compare 4 inf, 1 art, 3 arm plus at least the German bomber for support against 3 inf, 1 art, 1 arm, 1 fig, 1 bmb and you’ll see how bad the UK position really is.

  • '19 '18

    There is no easy way to combat all out SBR on Germany, but if Britian is only buying bomers, then they aren’t buying navy or troops.  What I like to do with on G1 is build an AC to protect the baltic felt, then on each german turn I buy 1-2 naval ships usally subs, destroyers and transports.  By turn 3 or 4 I have a nice little navy to defend germany with from UK along with 2-3 transports which can threaten London, or I use them as a bridge to get infantry to Russia and Karelia quicker.

    Being able to threaten the UK you could attack them and all the bombers stationed there, and if UK doesn’t prepare for it then London falls.  This German naval strategy goes along with the Axis strategy that we commonly use to go at the UK first, reducing their IPCs to around 15-20, destroy UK navy with Germany navy and make it impossible for the UK to rebuild.

    So my answer for counteracting a UK SBR campain is to go at the UK and make it difficult for them to replace lost items.


  • Spending 20 ipcs a turn to be able to build a unit is pretty bad, but here is a thought. Instead of spending say 20 out of your 30(as an example) and thus getting 10 IPCs of spending, you could fall back from the front a bit and not build units that turn. On the next turn you should have 60 ipc, and you spend 20 and have 40 left. If you build twice in a row you will have spent (using the above numbers) 60 ipcs and gotten 20 ipcs of units, this way you spend 60 ipcs and get 40 ipcs worth of units.

    Just a thought.


  • Ever considered Germany and Italy doing the bomber tag team on England? The Allies are not the only powers that can buy bombers.


  • @cond1024:

    There is no easy way to combat all out SBR on Germany, but if Britian is only buying bomers, then they aren’t buying navy or troops.  What I like to do with on G1 is build an AC to protect the baltic felt, then on each german turn I buy 1-2 naval ships usally subs, destroyers and transports.  By turn 3 or 4 I have a nice little navy to defend germany with from UK along with 2-3 transports which can threaten London, or I use them as a bridge to get infantry to Russia and Karelia quicker.

    With UK and/or USA operating a massive SBR campaign from the UK I don’t see how this can work. All they have to do is spend one turn sending their entire bomber force (and fighters, which will be in range) to sink every non-sub sea unit you have. It’s just not possible for Germany to maintain a non-sub fleet if UK/USA are using lots of bombers out of the UK. The new transport rule of 0 defense and can’t be taken as casualties pretty much means ships are dead vs bombers.

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