I first say that i enjoy your efforts and how you look at things. Its professional and not ad hoc. I am just trying to point out inconsistencies to help you arrive at the conclusion by an examination of the period were dealing with.
I don’t think a complete loss of invasion capability would take place even with the rule I thought of, since US or UK would surely be able to repair all convoy damage inflicted on them. Even with 3 subs attacking you would have around 10 IPCs loss in production.
The rule as stated still prohibits the building of naval units, and its possible players of the same team would build more than 3 subs and ‘cost no more than 10 IPC’ Rule systems have to look at the extremes and are refuted even if ONE time in ONE game a trick is discovered which breaks the game. IMO your rule can lead to a broken game. Japan, Germany and Italy, can start adding more subs to the 4-5 they begin with and prevent the allies from ever getting transports made. While u-boats enjoyed the “happy times” the allies were building more merchant ships than can be sunk. it was a race and the allies were still winning it. Your rule takes the wind out of the sail.
None of these invasions would be represented in Axis & Allies. Operation Overlord was postponed due to the fact of submarine warfare and this is the kind of scale we are talking about. Of course, US and UK could have invaded France even in '42 but I’m not sure they would have succeeded. In game terms, this would mean that submarines in '41 and '42 inflict damage enough so that the number of transports to invade with would be too few.
Overlord was not postponed for this reason. Please find this fact and cite it. However, our landing in Morocco was in a scale represented by AA and performed in 1942. The landing at Sicily in 1943 was also in AA scale. IN both periods U-Boats had the upper hand and ships were being built.
IN 1944 they invaded and no U-boats has any effect on it
In 1942 they invaded Morocco and no U-boats had any effect
IN 1943 Italy didn’t do anything while Sicily was invaded.
In 1942 America invaded the solomons and Japanese subs didn’t have any effect on it.
In 1943 America invaded all sorts of islands and Japanese subs didn’t have any effect on it.
I can go on and on.
Of course, you could just have IPC damage being taken from cash at hand, but I wanted to find something similar to how SBR damage is handled in AA50 and also something that means you don’t have to have “ad-hoc” rules such as Germany and Soviet Union are immune from convoy attacks or the addition of convoy zones on the map.
Why not treat them all equally as long as they have the same access to IPC detached by sea zones. I have this posted in another thread:
Lend Lease: For each transport in the Atlantic the US player rolls one d6 = result equals IPC that can be sent to Russia and deducted from US IPC total. (I recommend you use chips) Procedure: place whatever you rolled in the Soviet Lend Lease box. The convoy box can be subject to attacks and should be protected. The following Soviet turn the IPC generated is added to the Soviet player’s treasury.
For example: The US player has 5 transports and rolls 5 dice resulting in 22 potential Lend Lease IPC. They elect to send only 15 and place that amount of chips in the Lend Lease Box. Enemy subs or planes can attempt to attack these IPC up to the limit of 15 IPC. They roll as a convoy raid attack.
Exception: You may place up to one naval ship in a VC even if the territory does not contain a factory.
Attacking Submarines can only engage enemy transports or perform convoy raids on enemy sea zones designated as such. If they elect to attack transports perform the following sequence:
- Subs each roll at 2 or less to hit. Transports are removed for each hit.
- ASW units (Destroyers and Cruisers) each roll hitting at one. Remove subs.
- Subs may elect to submerge or continue attack.
Note: If attacking ASW units engage the subs on their own turn follow the same procedure except ASW units can now be hit rather than transports.
• If the active player has Super Subs Technology they attack at 3 or less.
• If the active player has ASW Technology, then planes can now roll for ASW as long as a ASW naval unit is present (at a 1:1 basis). Also, all ASW units now roll at 2 or less to score a hit.
Submarines no longer block movement of surface naval units, except for transports. In combat with subs and other naval units, submarines are not involved. That’s to say they now perform as totally independent forms of naval combat. Once the surface naval combat is resolved, further combat with submarines can occur.
Convoy Zones: Each nation begins in control of specific sea zones that can be attacked by enemy naval forces or bombers. When the listed territory is occupied by the opposing side the convoy center is replaced with a new convoy token of the controlling player. Anytime the enemy enters this sea zone with a warship (not transport) they roll one D6:
1-2= 1 IPC lost, 3-4= 2 IPC lost, 5-6= 3 IPC lost. The convoy zone can only be attacked up to the full value of 3 IPC per turn. The following convoy centers are in the game:
Sea zone #5-Convoy removed if Germany loses two of the three: Sweden, Finland, or Norway.
Sea Zone #14- Convoy removed if Italy loses Libya or Balkans.
Sea Zone #62- Convoy removed if Japan loses Manchuria.
Sea Zone #36- Convoy removed if Japan loses French-Indo China.
Sea Zone #4- Convoy removed if Soviets lose Karella S.S.R.
Sea Zone #8- Convoy removed if UK loses any part of Canada.
Sea Zone #2- Convoy removed if UK loses England.
Sea Zone #33-Convoy removed if UK controls less than 6 IPC in Africa.
Sea Zone #35-Convoy removed if UK controls loses India.
Sea Zone #12-Convoy removed if UK controls loses Egypt.
Sea Zone #39-Convoy removed if UK controls loses Australia.
Sea Zone #38-Convoy removed if UK controls loses East Indies or Borneo.
Sea Zone #10- Convoy removed if USA loses Eastern USA.
Sea Zone #50- Convoy removed if USA loses Western United States.
Sea Zone #54- Convoy removed if USA loses Alaska.
Sea Zone #56- Convoy removed if USA loses Philippine Islands.
Sea Zone #65- Convoy removed if USA loses Hawaii.
Note: In each case when the sea zone is occupied a new convoy zone is established by the side that captures the listed territories and the new player can now be attacked in the same manner on your own next turn.
Convoy Raid Attack: Submarines or planes in range can elect to attack these convoys in addition to other attacks in the same sea zone if other ships are also present (subs can only attack transports in this manner).
Procedure: move sub in sea zone with convoy box roll d6
1-2= 1 IPC lost
3-4= 2 IPC lost
5-6= 3 IPC lost
Following the Convoy Raid each submarine or plane has the option to attack enemy transports located in the sea zone.
under this system we bring back the basic convoy zones represented as they were historically and caped at 3 IPC max, so the other player cant pile up on one weak sea zone each turn.
Also, they are in flux, so if the assigned territories are taken they flip to convoy zones for the new conquering player. The problem with AAE was if all of Africa was axis occupied by Germany , their was no need to a UK convoy box, because now the Germans needed to bring the income over and establish sea lanes to supply the home territory with these resources. So you merely place a convoy token when the listed territories change hands and its now a target for the opposition.
Also, i allow a choice on multiple sea combat rounds. Perhaps both sides with to keep rolling, but still give each the option to retreat.
Sub combat is now totally separate and subs are NEVER again the ‘infantry of the sea’. Thats what destroyers are now.
I can move the zones around because they are afterall tokens that are placed on the map. Playtesting shows they are in correct places at this point.