USA IC in Sinkiang



  • I come across the KJF a little to often in my games as Japan and have a question. After I take china should I attempt to throw everything I have at an IC Sinkiang or just stack defense in China. Whenever I try to play conservative with Japan those 2 tanks per turn continue to pile on doing a combination of 2 things to me, A) Any form of ground help against Moscow will have to go around north. B) I will have to keep both FIC and China equally defended at the same time buy spending money on more land troops when it could be going to more navy to prevent the inevitable
    US invasion. So whats the first thing that pops in your head when you see that IC in India and Sinkiang appear?



  • @Blitz:

    So whats the first thing that pops in your head when you see that IC in India and Sinkiang appear?

    KILL KILL KILL

    Man I tell you, that all this evil allied factories must be utterly destroyed. Now the Sinkiang factory never have AA-gun, so bomb it, bomb it, bomb it and bomb it, and make the allies pay for theyr arroganse. Next thing, you steal the factory, take it away from them, move in an infantry stack supportet by tanks and planes, and make this factory build japanese units.


  • Moderator

    What happens prior to this (on R1 and UK1)?

    I always attack Chi with 7 inf (possibly 6 inf if Ind is empty), 2-4 ftrs on J1 and pretty much eliminate the option of a US IC b/c you can usually take with 5-7 inf and can then attack Sin on J2 with remaining Inf + 4 ftrs, 1 bom.


  • 2018 2017 '16 '11 Moderator

    I agree with DM here.  What happens on Russia 1 and England 1 are very significant.

    If England has 6 Infantry, Armor, 2 Fighters in India (with 3 Russian Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor in Persia to come up and help on R2) and Russia has 6 Infantry in Buryatia, 2 Fighters in Kazakh, 1 Armor and 2 Infantry in Yakut, things look a lot different and America may even get away with a factory in Sinkiang. (Hell, maybe you even have 4 Russian infantry in Sinkiang as well.  Then it’s hella secure for a while.)

    If you are not in all out KJF mode, then I don’t view ICs in India/Sinkiang convenient at all.



  • Yeah I think you need to go with Jen and DM.  As a general rule Japan needs to be in a constant state of expansion, at least for the first few rounds anyway. You need to take Sinkiang and India if they have an IC.

    Don’t do any thing stupid if you have to focus on them one at a time go for India as they can produce more; however, depending on the spending habits and troop positioning of that player Sinkiang may be more of a threat.

    I would say some where around turn 3 Japan should be building an IC of their own on the mainland.  The are a few reasons you should wait this long.  One, you need to know where to put it.  If the US player is the only agressive threat in Asia you can plan accordingly.  Like wise if the UK goes heavy in India you can shift fire.  The second reason is you now have time to move troops in that direction to keep the proposed IC site safe.

    Good Hunting,
    LT



  • @Blitz:

    So whats the first thing that pops in your head when you see that IC in India and Sinkiang appear?

    Great! One game without that gamey KGF strat!  😄 Surely USA’s fleet will grow big at z55 …

    There are two cases:

    A) Allied player is a moron and will not buy USA’s z55 fleet or reinforce India and Sinkiang properly. Toast the ICs and proceed to Moscow

    B) Allied player knows what is doing. You’ll have a very interesting game, fighting for all the map. Better if you build some boats for Japan or you’ll suffer badly. The IC should be at Kwantung, FIC is too risky, forcing you to defend it and probably negating any way to conquer Sinkiang. This is a the moment to build that german AC (if UK dind’t sink baltic fleet). Build tons of land units with Germany, they will be the ones who must conquer Moscow.


  • 2018 2017 '16 '11 Moderator

    Japan will eventually lose a naval engagement with America, no questions asked.  Question is, can they break Russia before America breaks Japan (ie reduces Japan to no navy, you don’t need mainland Japan here, just destroy their fleet and you beat Japan.)

    If Germany built a Carrier, then it is time to go after Japan.  It’s the most bone headed maneuver in the game to build a carrier for Germany, IMHO.  With that Carrier, you can fully expect British and Russian forces to own the eastern european states for quite some time freeing America to run roughshod over Japan without much of a worry.

    If Germany did not build a Carrier, then significant resources are going to be needed to slow Japan’s mainland down.  A mere 2 tanks, 4 infantry from Russia can easily do this. (That’s in addition to the forces already in position.  Russian fighters in range, but not used against Japan, just ready to be if needed.)



  • @Blitz:

    I come across the KJF a little to often in my games as Japan and have a question.

    Opponents using KJF against you too often??? Can’t win too many games??  Even if I win by luck I’m happy for all of my victories.

    As for IC in Sink, take it and use it to capture Moscow.



  • Opponents using KJF against you too often??? Can’t win too many games??  Even if I win by luck I’m happy for all of my victories.

    As for IC in Sink, take it and use it to capture Moscow.

    Ha, I just meant it would be nice to play a game where the nation I am isn’t the focus of every ones attention. You know being able to plow through Asia without interference would be great 🙂



  • One should play according not only to general strats, but also react to the opponent.

    The reason why many of us thinks KJF is an inferior strat is not because it’s impossible to slow Jap considerably, but because a KJF strat should result in allies losing the game. Germany will have to be more than usual aggressive in an KJF game than ordinary KGF.

    If you play one side alone or multiplayer doesn’t matter, both axis powers must move according to the changing units/colors on the map and according to opponents.
    If US build IC in Sink in a non KJF/CJF game it should be easy to take controll of, but to take the IC must be a nr.1 priority. for the Jap player regardless of other issues which may or may not happen.



  • A USA IC in Sinkiang demands that USSR send INF fodder to help protect that IC in the early rounds of the game.

    Knowing that, Germany needs to be hell-bent-for-leather after USSR from G2 forward.

    With an early ARM lead of more than 2 to 1, and with an AF lead of more than 3 to 1…

    Germany builds whatever with lots of INF on G1, then on G2 they can adjust to a major ARM build and basically out-class Russia the entire game, especially if the Med Fleet pulls out of Africa and goes after USSR held Ukraine and/or Caucuses.

    Russia is 1/2 of Germany income on average.  Steady pressure, good use of the German FIGs and BOM, and lots of INF/ARM means Russia DIES.


  • 2018 2017 '16 '11 Moderator

    Honestly, Switch, I believe that if Russia puts 4 Infantry in Sinkiang on Russia 1 and leaves a tank or two and her fighters in Kazakh the risk to Sinkiang drops significantly.  (Japan can only have 7 Infantry in China after Japan 1, and odds are closer - in my experience, not by calculator - that Japan will be reduced to 4 or 5 infantry.  Russia could then easily liberate China if it came too it, giving America that necessary round to build forces there.

    I am NOT saying it is optimal.  Just speculating on how it could be done.



  • @Cmdr:

    Honestly, Switch, I believe that if Russia puts 4 Infantry in Sinkiang on Russia 1 and leaves a tank or two and her fighters in Kazakh the risk to Sinkiang drops significantly.  (Japan can only have 7 Infantry in China after Japan 1, and odds are closer - in my experience, not by calculator - that Japan will be reduced to 4 or 5 infantry.  Russia could then easily liberate China if it came too it, giving America that necessary round to build forces there.

    I am NOT saying it is optimal.  Just speculating on how it could be done.

    So if what you just proposed happened and the UK has a shop in India whats a Japan player to do?


  • 2018 2017 '16 '11 Moderator

    Honestly, it would have to depend on what England did.  If they took Borneo and New Guinea, sunk the Submarine in SZ 45 and sunk the Transport in SZ 59 then Japan would be in a REALLY bad place on Japan 1.

    If all they did was move into position, then I would eliminate China (to get the fighter) and then plan to make a massive dump in FIC on Japan 2 (with a complex on Japan 2) to try and get India.  It’s the most secure victory you’d have probably.  Either way, if you force the allies to dedicate their firepower there, you MIGHT be able to get Russia weak enough that Germany can tank dash (as in 8-12 tanks a round) into Russia


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