• The Sideskirts ability reads: This unit gets +1/+1 defense against units have the close assault ability.

    Does that mean that the +1/+1 defense applies even when a unit that has the close assault ability is not in the same hex (not using the close assaut ability but still -has- it).  :?


  • @Shemar:

    The Sideskirts ability reads: This unit gets +1/+1 defense against units have the close assault ability.

    Does that mean that the +1/+1 defense applies even when a unit that has the close assault ability is not in the same hex (not using the close assaut ability but still -has- it).  :?

    Shermar

    What unit has closed assault and uses it in another hex?


  • Bazooka has Close Assualt and can attack from upto range four.

    And yes, the side-skirts work VS a Bazooka


  • @Motdc:

    Bazooka has Close Assualt and can attack from upto range four.

    And yes, the side-skirts work VS a Bazooka

    I don’t agree.  The way I read it says +1/+1 for units attacking with their close assualt.  If bazooka is 2-4 hexes away it would be normal attack.  Correct?


  • Re-read it:

    This unit gets +1/+1 defense against units have the close assault ability.

    Not:

    This unit gets +1/+1 defense against Close Assault.

    –-

    In my experience, rules should be read a literally as possible.


  • I stand corrected by Mot again… I’ll have to reread that SA again.

    So here’s some questions

    Besides Bazooka what other units have close assault & a short or medium range attack greater than “2”.  Since the tanks defense is 3 your would need to roll at least 3 dice, even if disrupted or damaged.

    I know a couple of units attack at “2” short or medium range and don’t have close range attack… How fair is it that a bar gunner can attack these tanks rear while disrupted at short range and get successes, but a garand can’t because it has close assault.

    How about US hero using his SA, if he uses a tank attack, does sideskirts still offer +1/+1.

    I don’t understand what they were trying to accomplish with this SA.  I guess sideskirts helped only against infantry attack… so why not just say that
    “this unit gets +1/+1 on infantry attacks”


  • Because Artillery units are Soldiers…


  • This unit gets +1/+1 defense against units have the close assault ability.

    I agree with Mot here
    If resourceful hero has a CA then I guess his improvisation ability attks these units with sideskirts, they get +1/+1 on def.  kinda cheesy but it sounds plain english to me…

    STUG G’S ARE NOW THE MOST DEVASTATING COST EFFECTIVE UNITS TANKS IN THE GAME.


  • Because Artillery units are Soldiers…

    aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

    too much info let these guys get burned to learn this lesson…  :evil: :evil: :evil:

    the loophole has been exposed AARRGGGGGGGGGGHHHHhhh


  • No Turret cannot be ignored.

    I’ll take a Panzer IV F2 (AKA Panzer IV G) for 3 pts more and get a turret and Extended Range unless I’m on a budget


  • kinda true, but with decent maneuvering and kamikaze like style, you could put 5 stug’s in a 100pt build.

    or 4 Stug’s
        1 SS Haupt or SS Panzer Gren
        1 Grizzled Vet
        3 Mauser’s


  • Stug G @19 x2 =38
    Brumbar @22 x1 =22
    Elite Panzer IVD @18 x1 = 18
    BMW @5 x2 = 10
    Griz Vet @8 x1 = 8
    96 pts…what do you do with 4 points?

    Upgrade one of the Stugs to a Panzer IV F2 or the EPzIVD inot another Brumbar?


  • Still no one answered my questions???  What about the fact that a Bar gunner now has a better attack against a tank with sideskirts than does a garand.

    Please reread, I specify infrantry attack, not soldier attack… or they can specify exclude artilary just like they do with transports.


  • @Half-Track:

    Still no one answered my questions???  What about the fact that a Bar gunner now has a better attack against a tank with sideskirts than does a garand.

    Ummm, duh?  :evil:  :-P

    I’d image that yes, at a 100 yards a BAR is gonna have more stopping power than a Garand.


  • @Motdc:

    @Half-Track:

    Still no one answered my questions???  What about the fact that a Bar gunner now has a better attack against a tank with sideskirts than does a garand.

    Ummm, duh?  :evil:  :-P

    I’d image that yes, at a 100 yards a BAR is gonna have more stopping power than a Garand.

    Well in the Axis and Allies world they have the same… that is until sideskirts is considered.

    Maybe this is a bad example but your missing my point.


  • @Half-Track:

    Please reread, I specify infrantry attack, not soldier attack… or they can specify exclude artilary just like they do with transports.

    Yes you did say infantry, sorry.  But the game doesn’t actually have a class of units called Infantry.  It should though…it should split Soldiers into Infantry and Artillery and the attack grid on each card should have multiple catagories like those WAS cards.  But they dont…

    I think stating “non-artillery soldiers” would have been acceptable as well, but there isn’t much practicle difference.


  • @Half-Track:

    I know a couple of units attack at “2” short or medium range and don’t have close range attack… How fair is it that a bar gunner can attack these tanks rear while disrupted at short range and get successes, but a garand can’t because it has close assault.

    Your are right, I’m probably missing the point you are trying to make.

    While its best not to try to map the rules too much onto reality, I guess conceptually it has more to do with how the units would have attacked?  The Soldier unit would have guess trying to chuck grenades into the treads while the BAR is hoping via automatic fire to get some rounds through view-slots?

    I don’t know why, but the fact that the BAR is slightly more effective at Med range as compared to a Garand doesn’t really bother me?


  • Very interesting discussion!

    I agree that when it comes to WotC games, the rules/abilities text is taken literally over any possible realism and with that said, it is clear that the defense bonus is tied to the attacking unit having the ability not actually using it.

    Part of the reason why I posted is that sometimes errata comes out that reverses some of these decisions, makes an exception or outright changes the rule/ability text. It seems there is none at this point.


  • I’m trying to stress out that a bar gunner and garand both have the same attack vs vehicles at short range.  Rolling “2”.  Both units would have an equal chance to score a hit on a disrupted/damaged german tank from the rear having a defense of 5/3.  However, add side skirts and the garand no longer has the ability to do any damage from medium range because it’s basically penalized for have close assault.


  • @Half-Track:

    I’m trying to stress out that a bar gunner and garand both have the same attack vs vehicles at medium range.  Rolling “2”.  Both units would have an equal chance to score a hit on a disrupted/damaged german tank from the rear having a defense of 5/3.  However, add side skirts and the garand no longer has the ability to do any damage from medium range because it’s basically penalized for have close assault.

    I’m confused here…

    Doesn’t a Garand roll 0 dice at med range against vehicles, maybe 1 dice with stars and stripes.

    I’m thinking M1 Garand rolls 2/0/0  or 3/1/0 with SnS.

    Bar would stay as you mentioned above at 2/2/0

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