Does anyone really want to know this?


  • Actually, you’re story isn’t very new. Historians have already known of the existence of this sub quite some time now (I can dig up an article in my WWII periodical if you like).

    The USS Ward sent two messages to its superiors, warning that an enemy sub had been fired on. However, for reasons that remain undetermined, a general alert was never issued.

    This is true. The Ward did report to HQ. However, it was determined that the sub did not pose a significant threat to the harbor and that any invasion probably would not have come from air (even the Japanese believed that much of the damage would be done by these mini-subs instead of planes).

    “To me,” he said, “the real significance is that the Americans are typically warmongers.”

    This claim is totally ridiculous given the wartime nature of the time, and the charting into US waters.


  • I’ve actually known about this also. When I started my “Pearl Harbor Conspiracy” thread I forgot all about it. This also fueled the fire that Roosevelt knew the attack was coming and allowed it to happen. Similarly, a radar operator reported the first wave on his screen. It was dimissed as friendly planes from the mainland!


  • Roosevelt did know the attack was coming, that’s why he sent an alert to the Philippines and Pearl Harbor but because of bad weather, the message to Pearl Harbor didn’t come in time.


  • Similarly, a radar operator reported the first wave on his screen. It was dimissed as friendly planes from the mainland!

    Well this was more of a coincidence since a flight of B-17s(?) were scheduled to appear at approximately the same time as the Zeros.


  • Those Japanese subs were sunk in the mouth of pearl harbour very close to the day of the attack. Japan would have attack whether or not those subs were sunk.

    If the Americans ran into the Jap carrier group, I’m sure they would have attacked it too.

    Japan intentions in either case would have been interpreted as hostile and aggressive.
    The U.S. would have just provocation to attack.

    To call the Americans warmongers and the aggressor in the Pacific is a wild and a completey inaccurate overstatement.


  • @Mr:

    Those Japanese subs were sunk in the mouth of pearl harbour very close to the day of the attack. Japan would have attack whether or not those subs were sunk.

    If the Americans ran into the Jap carrier group, I’m sure they would have attacked it too.

    Japan intentions in either case would have been interpreted as hostile and aggressive.
    The U.S. would have just provocation to attack.

    To call the Americans warmongers and the aggressor in the Pacific is a wild and a completey inaccurate overstatement.

    i agree that it’s an inappropriate statement. particularly given the lengths to which the Americans avoided going to war.


  • @cystic:

    @Mr:

    The U.S. would have just provocation to attack.

    To call the Americans warmongers and the aggressor in the Pacific is a wild and a completey inaccurate overstatement.

    i agree that it’s an inappropriate statement. particularly given the lengths to which the Americans avoided going to war.

    Still, they have been extremely provoking towards the Japanese. One could say, the US looked like wanting to be attacked: Looking for the war, but not for being the aggressor.

    What’s your stand on this?


  • well roosevelt did want to go to war and was doing every thing in his power to get involved i beleive. i could be wrong


  • @DasEwokSS:

    well roosevelt did want to go to war and was doing every thing in his power to get involved i beleive. i could be wrong

    Rossevelt wanted to stop the Nazis.
    One front at a time.
    He was trying to keep the peace with a ever expanding Japanese Empire.
    Both nations new a war was coming years before.
    America did not want to fight Germany and Japan at the same time, It was not their first choice.

    Japan was the nation with territorial gain as an agenda, not the Americans.
    The U.S. was NOT the aggressors or provokers in the Pacific.


  • Still, they have been extremely provoking towards the Japanese. One could say, the US looked like wanting to be attacked: Looking for the war, but not for being the aggressor.

    What’s your stand on this?

    How so? I think embargos on Japan were at least justifiable - considering the fact that the Imperial Japanese war machine was massacring fellow Asians.


  • An unidentified submarine in US territorial waters! I’d say the USS Ward had good provocation to attack. Wasn’t this sub actually a mini-sub, brought along with 4 others to sneak into Pearl Harbor. If a mini-sub, it was brought by a bigger ship for NEFARIOUS purposes. :)

    I read that the carriers based at Pearl left a day or two before 12-7-1941! I’d say we got coinkydink. Put that with Midway(7 flights with no success then BOOM!, if I memember korrectly) LUCK and what a history. I think SOMEBODY was lookin’ out fer US. :wink:

    "Humankind has not woven the web of life.
    We are but one thread within it.
    Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves.
    All things are bound together.
    All things connect.

    • Chief Seattle

  • Yes, the sub was a mini.

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