• '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    If you are so certain that AARe is winnable with the allies, let’s try out a game, eh?  I’ll either take Allies with 24 IPC (1 Destroyer in SZ 2, 1 Submarine in SZ 52, 1 Artillery in Karelia) or the Axis with 8 IPC (Infantry, Armor in Libya)

    Otherwise, please stop telling me that it’s all fair and balanced and crud.  I’m lookin, and i’m not finding a game where the allies didn’t get incredibly lucky to find a win.  AFAIK this is about as broken as possible.  It’s like giving Japan battleships that take 5 hits to sink and can transport 2 infantry AND a tank in Axis and Allies Classic!


  • Can you detail a game breaking strategy?
    Moves and odds.

    The AARe team resides mainly at the avalon hills forum. I’ve only seen two members of the team here
    occasionally. If they don’t reply just repost over there.


  • @Cmdr:

    If you are so certain that AARe is winnable with the allies, let’s try out a game, eh?  I’ll either take Allies with 24 IPC (1 Destroyer in SZ 2, 1 Submarine in SZ 52, 1 Artillery in Karelia) or the Axis with 8 IPC (Infantry, Armor in Libya)

    I don’t follow your reasoning for your bid options.

    Enhanced contention is the game is fairly balanced, bids are between 3 and 6 FOR the Axis.
    You contend the allies have no chance….

    Why would I give you the allies and 24 IPCs?

    As for a bid of 8, I would never allow that, I can win with the axis with $4… and if you contend the allies can never win, WHY would you need $8 for the Axis?

    I think a fair challenge would be the Axis +5.

    Where do you want your bid?
    What dice roller we using?  AAMC rated?

    I know your a battlemap fan, so that’s fine with me.


  • @Cmdr:

    I’m lookin, and i’m not finding a game where the allies didn’t get incredibly lucky to find a win.  AFAIK this is about as broken as possible.

    I am curious as to where you were finding A&ARe results?


  • Just wanted to add this excerpt from the introduction of the 5.0 version of the rules.  I find this to very much be true:

    Characteristics of an AARe game:

    • Lots of naval action in both the Atlantic and the Pacific.
    • With 3 additional Allied VCs, the Allies will have to fight on multiple fronts to protect them
    • The balanced techs are less luck-based and play a bigger role in the game.
    • The Allied economic edge vs. the Axis military edge ensures a tensed, exciting and dramatic ending.
    • Subs are the lonely hunters of the sea! They hit and dive before you even noticed them. Aircraft alone cant get to them! Destroyers will need to Search & Destroy.
    • Balanced sides (the bids are currently around 6 IPC)
    • The National Advantages are chosen on the turn of the respective nation. Wisely utilize the NAs that suit your strategic goals and are strong against your opponent’s strategy.
  • '17 '16 '15 Organizer '14 Customizer '13 '12 '11 '10

    you should give the woman a chance. Your the champ and she only has 7 games ‘EXPERIENCE’. 24 is not too much to overcome right?  😐

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    A) The allies are spread out defending everywhere instead of focused.
    B) The Germans should have England out of the game by Round 2, Round 3 if bad dice.  That means they own Africa and are doing 8 Convoy Damage a round to England.  -9 Africa -8 Convoy -6 from what Japan does to Australia, India and New Zealand in most games.  That’s turning 30 IPC into 7 IPC. 
    C) With India, and Australia gone, the Axis only need a couple more VCs, oh look, Stalingrad and Leningrad are so convenient for the taking.  Maybe Hawaii instead.  Not like the allies have a chance because America either defends Hawaii or Russia.  Either way, 10 VC, Axis win.  No chance for the allies.

    As for “where I am looking” the only place I can look.  AAMC.  I don’t see any AARe games here.

    There needs to be some SERIOUS changes to “balance” the game.

    1)  Submarines can be found by aircraft only.
    2)  Super Submarines and Wolf Packs have no effect on Submarine Detection
    3)  Submarines must be adjacent to industrial complexes to cause Convoy damage and that damage is 1 IPC per submarine up to 50% of the territory’s value

    Pick 2 of the above.

    4)  Remove VCs from W. Europe, Karelia, Hawaii and Philippines.  (Keeps the Axis and Allies even on number of VCs.)  Reduce VCs needed to win by 2 each. (Axis need 8, Allies 9.)  This allows the allies to do something other then every nation for itself.

    Think that would give the allies a chance.  As for your axis getting 3 or 6 bid, who’s that insane?  I’ve won a couple of times with no bid for axis.  They are SOOOO primed for victory that the allies don’t even have a chance!  Well, barring insane dice, no chance!

    England starts with NO destroyers near by, that means you can do 6 Convoy Damage on Germany 1, assuming you don’t buy more submarines, and hell, I buy 2 more!  Now I’m doing 8 Convoy Damage on Round 1 and there isn’t a blessed thing England can do about it!  Japan should be focusing on their own Submarines so they can line up 5 Submarines and a fleet in SZ 55 to do 10 IPC damage to America and own Hawaii reducing America and that means America’s earning 27 IPC a round, almost as little as Russia!


  • shouldn’t mr. submarine be the axis? thats teh only way that makes sense to me. if the allies never win. Jenn should prove herself by being the allies, and U505 should disprove via the Axis winning. just my thoughts.

  • 2007 AAR League

    I believe you may be mistaken, Commander. U-505 doesn’t play Enhanced. Never has. However, if I ever get tired of dominating Revised, I may decide to dominate Enhanced just for the variety.  :evil: But not right now.


  • I thnk she might be thinking of Axis _roll


  • @Cmdr:

    A) The allies are spread out defending everywhere instead of focused.
    B) The Germans should have England out of the game by Round 2, Round 3 if bad dice.  That means they own Africa and are doing 8 Convoy Damage a round to England.  -9 Africa -8 Convoy -6 from what Japan does to Australia, India and New Zealand in most games.  That’s turning 30 IPC into 7 IPC. 
    C) With India, and Australia gone, the Axis only need a couple more VCs, oh look, Stalingrad and Leningrad are so convenient for the taking.  Maybe Hawaii instead.  Not like the allies have a chance because America either defends Hawaii or Russia.  Either way, 10 VC, Axis win.  No chance for the allies.

    You have NO idea how to play an Enhanced game as the allies.

    Please take the uber axis and destroy me.  I will show you the allies do have a chance to win the game.

    Stop the chatter and accept the challenge.


  • @Imperious:

    you should give the woman a chance. Your the champ and she only has 7 games ‘EXPERIENCE’. 24 is not too much to overcome right?  😐

    She is the one saying the axis can not lose, I never made that contention.  Why should I give her the weaker team, regardless of any bid they may get?

    In fact, I still believe the axis need a small bid to even the game.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    Fine, you want allies with the axis with a bid of 4.5 rounded down to 4?  Since you claim the axis NEED a bid and that the average bid is 3-6 IPC. (3+6 quantity / 2 = 4.5)

    Still don’t see how the allies even have a breath of a chance.  I’ve yet to see them win except in the very wild game where I was allowed a 24 IPC bid (cause the other guy also never saw them win!)


  • @Cmdr:

    Fine, you want allies with the axis with a bid of 4.5 rounded down to 4?  Since you claim the axis NEED a bid and that the average bid is 3-6 IPC. (3+6 quantity / 2 = 4.5)

    Still don’t see how the allies even have a breath of a chance.  I’ve yet to see them win except in the very wild game where I was allowed a 24 IPC bid (cause the other guy also never saw them win!)

    Where/how?  Here by forum or AAMC rated with their dice roller?

    You choose, either is fine by me.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    AAMC doesn’t have a dice roller for AARe specifically, they just use their AAR roller and you make up for it.

    May as well do it here, with the onsite roller so every die roll is open for everyone to see.  Nice log that way.  No one can complain they didn’t get the email cause it’s displayed right here. 🙂

    As for placement of bid, make it an Artillery in Libya

  • '17 '16 '15 Organizer '14 Customizer '13 '12 '11 '10

    I think i will follow this game. Can it be played at these forums?


  • @Imperious:

    I think i will follow this game. Can it be played at these forums?

    Certainly, follow along at http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=10442.0

    test roll for PBF rolling
    Rolls: 2@1 2@2 5@3; Total Hits: 32@1: (4, 3)2@2: (3, 5)5@3: (5, 2, 3, 1, 6)


  • @Cmdr:

    Otherwise, please stop telling me that it’s all fair and balanced and crud.  I’m lookin, and i’m not finding a game where the allies didn’t get incredibly lucky to find a win.  AFAIK this is about as broken as possible.

    I will wait until we finish game two of “The Jenigma Enhanced Experiement” before I ask for a full retraction of the above statement.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    @axis_roll:

    @Cmdr:

    Otherwise, please stop telling me that it’s all fair and balanced and crud.  I’m lookin, and i’m not finding a game where the allies didn’t get incredibly lucky to find a win.  AFAIK this is about as broken as possible.

    I will wait until we finish game two of “The Jenigma Enhanced Experiement” before I ask for a full retraction of the above statement.

    Well, in my own defense, the players I’ve been playing with were not exactly following the rules.  I won’t say they were cheating, they may have just been confused.  The theory was presented to me that attacking and defending submarines were immortal until discovered by a destroyer, thus, it was perfectly possible to have a submarine attack 3 battleships, 8 carriers, 16 fighters and 24 transports and win every time without losing the submarine, since the defenders could not retreat and could not fire back because they had no destroyer to find the submarine!

    Given that scenario, all Germany has to do is send the submarine to SZ 2 and only Russia/Germany submarines could fire.  Or Send just a submarine to SZ 13 and all the fighters in Europe are free for other activities since the battleship there had no chance to defend itself before being sunk.  Etc.

    You can see how I’d say it was hopelessly broken.


  • @Cmdr:

    Well, in my own defense, the players I’ve been playing with were not exactly following the rules.  I won’t say they were cheating, they may have just been confused.

    You can see how I’d say it was hopelessly broken.

    Oh I understand.

    Which is why I want to wait until the end of the second game.

    You mentioned about something else being broken from our first game 🙂

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    Yea, the economic attacks.  They’re always broken, they’re just MORE broken in revised I think.  (Mainly because there are even MORE ways to Economic someone.)

    Not broken for either Allies or Axis, just broken in general.


  • @Cmdr:

    Yea, the economic attacks.  They’re always broken, they’re just MORE broken in revised I think.  (Mainly because there are even MORE ways to Economic someone.)

    Not broken for either Allies or Axis, just broken in general.

    at least in Enhanced, you can counter these economic attacks

    so I think they’re not as broken as you might suspect.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    The counters are not too effective.

    For instance, if America has 5 heavy bombers attacking you, even if your gun DOES get one or two, you’re still screwed.  Add to that submarines off your coast (Japan) and rockets and there’s absolutely nothing you can do but wait for them to invade.

    That’s what makes it completely broken, instead of just way too powerful.  Anyone one economic would be okay, all three?


  • @Cmdr:

    The counters are not too effective.

    For instance, if America has 5 heavy bombers attacking you, even if your gun DOES get one or two, you’re still screwed.  Add to that submarines off your coast (Japan) and rockets and there’s absolutely nothing you can do but wait for them to invade.

    That’s what makes it completely broken, instead of just way too powerful.  Anyone one economic would be okay, all three?

    sending 5 bombers is totally inefective. lets say you have one die, thats 15 ipc loss. you did not bomb  anyterrtory for 15 ipc so you are taking a loss.

  • '18 '17 '16 '11 Moderator

    3 At Germany, 2 At Southern = 5 Bombers

    You can do 16 IPC and only lose 1 Bomber making it a 1 IPC gain.

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