Japan invading Brazil - An option?

As I said, Sproit, Japan should have some cash on hand to build a counter navy.  If you are that advanced with the Japanese fleet, odds are you own Africa uncontested, the middle east with a few ICs put up, China and the eastern Russian states to include Novosibirsk.  That means Japan’s in the 50+ range.

So:
D-2 Japan has just taken New Zealand with some half of fleet (1BB,1CV,2ftr,1tra,1-2inf). US fleet and air are in Europe, and just needed for convoy escorts.
Is this the right time for US to take preemptive measures ? what exactly ?

D-1 Japan is with said fleet off Argentina. Is this the right time… ? With what ?

D-Day: Japan has already taken Brazil. What now US ? Or is it too late ? Accept the -3/+3 IPC to the end ?
(Assume Allied victory in Europe is not imminent - still serious build-up to do)

This looks like ‘naval guerilla’ anyway, so if US actions are too threatening, Japan may withdraw before losing anything except time of using not-too-heavily-used-anyway ships.
US expends real IPC to counteract that may be useless elsewhere (ships), or of less utility (say fighters instead of transports+more troops to Europe)

I’d say that Japan has a good chance to disrupt the allies with a landing in Brazil, if America is going to Europe.  That’s usually round 4, IMHO.

1. It takes a long time to get to Brazil as Japan.
2.  If you are building up SZ60 fleet defense via new ships early in the game, then Russia will NOT be contained and turtled (in fact, Russia may well get “out of the box” and grab extra income from Japan territories).
3.  If you do not go straight for Brazil and the Allies build up their shucks, it IS a suicide mission.
4.  If the Allies have already established their shuck to Africa, then Japan does NOT hold Africa, the Allies do.  Japan cannot get enough forces to Africa early in the game to hold against a US, let alone a UK/US joint counter. 
5.  If Japan, in addition to building new fleet defense in SZ60, is also going heavy to Africa, then Russia is CERTAINLY out of the box, or at a minimum there is a static front in Asia with Russia out basically no income.

Aways remember, early in the game, Japan has only 70% of the income of the US.  They are VERY weak on land forces in Asia.  And they need to expand quickly in order to get some income in order to be a viable threat to anything.

Last but not least…
Power in this game is STACKS, not a few units here and there.  And this Japan Brazil move has Japan spread WAY too thin…
starting with 3 different naval groups to defend, none of which are in range to support each other (SZ34, SZ60, SZ22)

I consider the Brazil attack only a raid that should be an hit and run move, without moving too much fleet to the South Atlantic. So it should be performed with minimal forces ready to run away if in danger.
I do not like to leave unguarded sz60 or sz34 lightly held when attacking Africa, and Africa is a greater priority for Japan.
Going in force in south Atlantic is too risky. USA may react … very bad  :-D

@Sproit:

It doesn’t matter how big your force is, they still move 2. :P (haha kidding ya)

But he it could make the game also a bit more fun, to just annoy the US player with lots of Axis activity there, might cause a laugh after all,

And that’s what this game is about, to have fun, aye?!

Elementary, my dear Sproit!

Naturally game have to be funny. But also discussing about games is entertaining! And if discussion become hot… don’t worry it is itself a game!

Usually I am not involved in sending a lot of ships to Brazil. If I have a spare TRN not strictly needed for carrying units in Africa I consider to send it to Brazil.

Anyway, for causing USA player laugh I may still tell him a … joke!  :-D

One caveat…

Japan invading Brazil CAN be a VERY good move, if combined with a massive German fleet (Med based).  The Allies have to go one or the other, and that lets at least one Axis power roam the Atlantic for a while…

Ok, I see the effect of this move.
This scenario require to be planned in advance with also naval building in Med. In that case Japan may also move almost all of his capital ship to Southern Atlantic. I think that in such scenario USA may not divert IPC for Pacific.

@ncscswitch:

One caveat…

Japan invading Brazil CAN be a VERY good move, if combined with a massive German fleet (Med based).  The Allies have to go one or the other, and that lets at least one Axis power roam the Atlantic for a while…

I would add another caveat:

Japan hitting Brazil getting America to pull off their Shucks or build something else and diverting to liberating can buy Germany some time (usually 1 or 2 rounds).

It’s like Japan hitting Alaska when America doesn’t have extra units to throw away liberating it and thus pulling off Americans who would otherwise be going to Europe.

The loss to the US is minimal.

The loss to Japan is permanent

@ncscswitch:

The loss to the US is minimal.

The loss to Japan is permanent

The loss to the allies is pulling the US out of position just before an Axis 1-2 punch on Moscow.

The loss to the axis are a couple of infantry and a transport they most likely did not need as part of their main attack force anyway. (If they needed them, then how did they afford the diversion???)

@Cmdr:

The loss to the axis are a couple of infantry and a transport they most likely did not need as part of their main attack force anyway. (If they needed them, then how did they afford the diversion???)

I’ve never met an Inf + TRN that I didn’t need. The answer to your question is: they may not have been able to afford it. The fact that they did the move does not prove that it was a wise one.

I’ve bought lots of things that I couldn’t afford.

If Japan and Germany are ready to hit Moscow, and Japan happens to have a Transport/Infantry in S. Africa in range of Brazil, then it’s an infantry/transport i don’t need for my military objective (taking moscow being the objective.)  So in that case, I’ll invade Brazil from SZ 22 which normally results in the transport living but the infantry dieing.

But only because SZ 22 is usually out of range of America.  Not always, but usually.

Thank you Dan.

4 turns of movement, several Capital ships, possibly some FIGs, a TRN, and ground units tied up in a fools errand to Brazil…

Are there better ways to use those forces?
DAMN SKIPPY!

1.  A BB is better used taking UK islands, or supporting in the middle East or Africa
2.  FIGs are better off ANYWHERE else for Japan
3.  TRNs, even “extra” ones, are better off being used to augment/extend the range of the Japan Shuck, increasing the flow rate to the middle east, Africa, or taking UK territory in the Pacific.  Hell I think they are better used taking Midway than spending 4 turns heading for Brazil (killing a US unit, preventing Midway from being used for AF staging…)
4.  Land units…  Japan needs every unit it can get in Asia.  If some of them arrive via NZ, Australia, Madagascar so be it.  but they still ARRIVE.  INF sent to Brazil is NEVER coming back.
5.  AC is better off being used for fleet defense, or perhaps sent into the med to anchor Germany’s southern defenses.

Are you referring to my idea of sending the entire Japanese fleet to the Atlantic?  If so, we’re talking well after Africa is 100% secured and all English islands and Hawaii has been captured.

Here I’m referring to a solitary Transport and Infantry raiding Brazil to get America to divert forces away from Europe much akin to your sanctioned attack on Alaska.

Not a viable mid-game move.

USA will have, almost certainly, an AC w/ FIGs defending their SZ12 fleet.

A lone TRN dies before it ever gets within range, and without cost to the USA fleet or interruption of the shuck.

@Cmdr:

Are you referring to my idea of sending the entire Japanese fleet to the Atlantic?  If so, we’re talking well after Africa is 100% secured and all English islands and Hawaii has been captured.

Here I’m referring to a solitary Transport and Infantry raiding Brazil to get America to divert forces away from Europe much akin to your sanctioned attack on Alaska.

how long to your games last 50 rds ?!! If you can do that much with Japan you should stop buying more than 6 trns( AT THE VERY MOST i personally like 5 trns) and start pushing towards Moscow.