Nazi Diplomacy



  • Guys, try this out.
    It finally makes the Pacific what it should be.

    2 Hit BBs, 3rd Ed Rules, NO magic 84 Rule, Paratroopers.

    Scenario: Due to good diplomacy, Germany avoids war with the United States. The Americans are at war ONLY with Japan, and may not attack any German units or territories until A) Germany attacks the US, or B) Japan proper has been captured.

    Tell me what you guys think…



  • I feel sorry for the UK in this scenario. It will be easy pickens for Germany in Africa.



  • How about the reverse? Everyone is at war with Germany, except the British, who have been conquered. GErmany activated Operation Sea Lion before Operation Barbarossa and captured the British Isles and British Africa. Now America and Russia have to liberate Britain and destroy Germany before attacking Japan. Japan can already have the British colonies in South East Asia.



  • Is there anything preventing the US from just playing defense in Africa and Europe? I can see this happening: UK take Ukraine with 1 infantry. On USA’s turn, 1 Infantry from Karelia non-combat moves into Ukraine. Unless, Germany decides to concede Ukraine for the rest of the game, they are forced to attack a territory with US troops and thus have declared war on the USA.

    Or are you saying that the USA cannot move into any African or European territory until they are attacked in some way by Germany? Where would you draw the line? Syria, Persia, Caucasus?



  • The first idea sounds interesting, but I too feel sorry for the loser that gets stuck with U.K.! It would be worth a try to see how it works!



  • I have tried a similar variant like this before. However, why don’t you add a few extra rules like: Japan cannot invade Greater Russia until at least T3 and the Islands in the Pacific are worth a lot more IPC (ex. Australia worth 5-4 IPCs, New Guinea worth 3 IPCs). I think this will greatly enrich your experience in the Pacific 🙂



  • I like your suggestion Mose, strategic importance should be a factor in the value of territories. Plus, since Germany is uninhibited it would be good to help Russia out a little.



  • What are the rules for paratroopers? Cost, transport, combat, etc. I like the idea, but I want to know the most common paratrooping system.

    This german diplomacy game sounds fun. It sounds tough for the Allies, but an all out brawl in the pacific would be cool to watch and play.



  • @bangalore:

    I like your suggestion Mose, strategic importance should be a factor in the value of territories. Plus, since Germany is uninhibited it would be good to help Russia out a little.

    I disagree about the strategic value, but Moses is definitely right that some Far East territories should be worth more IPCs than they are, which might enrich the game in the Pacific Far East. As it is, you can hurt Japan by siezing valuable islands–but you hafta take a LOT of them to make a dent and there are usually easier pickings for the Allies elsewhere. If the IPC values were rationalized, maybe it’d become wothwhile in more cases.

    For instance, say Borneo/Clebes were now worth 2 and East Indies worth 3. This would make sense because these islands were among the richest sources of natural resources (oil, tropical foods, rubber, etc.) in the 1940’s world. Now, to be rational, we’d have to take IPCs from somewhere. I’d suggest Manchuria is now worth only 2 IPCs (how much more valuable economically is Manchuria vs. Kazakhstan or Egypt, really?)
    And take 1 IPC from Ssinkiang (which Japan usually ends up taking for strategic reasons anyway and is in reality little more than high mountains and desert).

    Conversely, China should be worth AT LEAST 3 IPC’s–I mean it’s CHINA! But let’s leave that alone for a minute…

    So if you made the above changes, Japan would start w/ 26 instead of 25 IPCs. But Manchuria’s only 2 IPC’s so USSR might be less likely to attack it in a “smash & grab” for 2 lousy IPCs (though you never know), while if you add up the 10 IPCs Pacific Islands are now worth (minus Hawaii), it might become more tempting for the USA to attempt a Naval strategy in the Pacific–and we all know how cool carrier battles are in the game! Best part is–it’s not drastically unrealistic; in fact it’s rational…

    I’d just like to add as well that the oil from some of the fields in Borneo was so pure the Japanese could just pipe the stuff directly out of the ground into their ship’s oil tanks. Sure it was dangerously volatile (as they found at Midway) but man—that’s GOOD oil! 😉

    Ozone27



  • disagree about the strategic value, but Moses is definitely right that some Far East territories should be worth more IPCs than they are, which might enrich the game in the Pacific Far East.

    I would like the increase the price tag of Soviet FE from 2 to 3 and adding an AA gun there.

    Conversely, China should be worth AT LEAST 3 IPC’s–I mean it’s CHINA! But let’s leave that alone for a minute…

    Yeah, I would expect China to be worth 3 IPCs.

    So if you made the above changes, Japan would start w/ 26 instead of 25 IPCs.

    Well the way I had it before, I think Japan started out with 26-28 IPCs instead of the normal 25. I also think USA’s income started a little higher, though it might have stayed the same.

    USA to attempt a Naval strategy in the Pacific–and we all know how cool carrier battles are in the game! Best part is–it’s not drastically unrealistic; in fact it’s rational…

    Wel… the way we have it so far is that USA can’t attack Germany, so they going to be forced to dive in the Pacific. I suggest increasing the IPC value of Hawaii to 3 (adding an IC w/ AA too), along with Midway worth 1.

    Also, UK can have a stronger “presence” in Asia by increasing the value of Australia from 2 to 3 or 4 and adding an IC w/ AA). Of course UK will have its hand tied against Germany, so they can only contribute a little.

    If the IPC values were rationalized, maybe it’d become wothwhile in more cases.

    I totally agree with you. However, the way I do it (and this isn’t very historically correct), is that I bleed IPCs away from Japan itself! Instead of making Japan worth 8, I can lower it to 5 or so, given me IPCs to distriubte elsewhere. This makes the SE Islands much more valuable, which they were in the war (esp. the Indies). Similar I can also lower the value of EUSA and distribute those IC’s to Hawaii or Midway.

    With these rules, you have a Pacific Front that is much more intense! And we all know we love expensive carrier battles! 😉



  • Could someone explain to me why so many people feel sorry for the UK in this scenario? The UK is more than capable of taking and holding Africa by herself. With this cash coming in, the UK can choose from a variety of attack plans.



  • I can see what you’re saying there. But with no pressure from U.S., Ger. has a little more room. Of course that’s the idea, but they may utilize that to slap U.K. around a little bit. We’d have to play it to find out, but that’s what we’re thinking. Over all I think it’s a good variation. 😄



  • I kind of like it, but to add a touch of “historical accuracy” and maybe some balance give Eastern Canada an IC. Canada produced over 850 000 war-vehicals, 1.1 million troops (out of 12 million people), had the 3rd largest navy, thousands of planes and fighters, was the first nation out of the gate in the West (had a full regiment in France prior to Paris being sacked) and provided many thousands of tonnes of supplies (esp food) to Britain in the dark days.



  • T_6,

    I disagree with reducing EUS.
    Take it from WUS, or some from both. The east coast and Midwest supplied the bulk of equipment and food for the war. Men and raw materials were supplied from throughout.
    –----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    " Sterilize! Sterilize!" - name the character and production this quote is from(Henceforth, all tv, stage show, and movies will be referred to as production~~.)~~



  • Perhaps it wouldn’t be a bad idea to do that Canada mod. on all games, not just this scenario? 😎

    Just an out of the blue question here, when do I get addict status? 100 posts?



  • Hey, E_G_

    @EmuGod:

    How about the reverse? Everyone is at war with Germany, except the British, who have been conquered.

    Have you tried this?

    Germany activated Operation Sea Lion before Operation Barbarossa and captured the British Isles and British Africa.

    How many German INF & ARM do you recommend having in GB?
    –-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    " Keep up the good work!" - Xi



  • @EmuGod:

    …British Africa.

    What would you recommend Germany start with and where in Africa?
    I can see INF, ARM, and FTR already there. Somewhat out of position since they just toook Africa.

    (Oh, and what German naval units in UK sz? GB BB in Gib sz?GB SS in EMed?
    GB TRN in ECan sz?)

    …America and Russia have to liberate Britain and destroy Germany before attacking Japan. Japan can already have the British colonies in South East Asia.

    Do any GB units exist in Australia? or did you include that in SEA
    What Japanese units will occupy India?

    Give me more details, please! I think I’ll try this.Maybe make MOP UP of GB units part of the game if it leans too far to the Axis side. Will try three games before I make additional alterations.
    A million ARM! - Xi
    –----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    " Alus lookin’ fer a gnu angel, das mi." - Xi



  • Iguess you can tell…

    THAT’ S ME.

    • XI


  • Will try a game or 2 this weekend with

    Nation-IPC value[units added]
    GB - 6,
    Australia - 4[IC+AA],
    ECan-[IC](UK ipc total remains same),
    SFE - 3[AA],
    KAZ - 1(USSR ipc total remains same),
    EUS - 11,
    WUS - 8,
    Midway -1 ,
    Hawaii - 3[AA, [u]NO IC as powerful mainland next door],
    China - 3,
    Ssinkiang - 1(US ipc total remains the same),
    JPN - 6,
    MAN, KWA, FIC - 2 each,
    East Indies - 3,
    Bor/Clbs - 2,
    New G - 2,
    Sol Is. - 1,
    Car. Is. - 1,
    Wake - 1(Japan is +1 overall=26 IPCs to start)
    –-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Wish me DEATH and DESTRUCTION - Xi



  • I’ll give you more details as I finish my World War 1 scenario for Axis and Allies: Europe.



  • :-? Eeeeewkay. :-? Go ahead. Tell me. How many Variations of A&A have you developed? :-? …No! Wait! I doan wana kno. :-?.. 😞 … :oops: … 😄 Eeeeeeeeeeewkay! Tell me. I’m no longer :-?, just Curious(which I think should be on the Emoticons board as :?o or maybe ?:o …that’s lookin’ with a question on the mind, inquizative eyes, and mouth slightly ajar).

    I’ve noticed that the previews of posts sometimes do not show same as final posts. - Xi



  • Just this one and my WW1 one so far, but I do have ideas for another one once I finish World War 1.



  • How about Emu’s idea, but changed a little. Germany has taken the UK over, and is at war with Russia and the US. However, Japan is an independent nation, at war with everyone. Use a VP system to determine the winner.



  • Anyone ever played Reagan’s War?

    US controls S. Euro and Japan; UK controls W. Euro and Norway

    USSR has Germany and all of E. Euro territories, including Manch, China, Siinkang, Kwangtung, Indochina. (All Commie areas.)

    All African territories are worth 0 IPCs.

    UK and US vs. USSR !!!



  • @city:

    Anyone ever played Reagan’s War?

    US controls S. Euro and Japan; UK controls W. Euro and Norway

    USSR has Germany and all of E. Euro territories, including Manch, China, Siinkang, Kwangtung, Indochina. (All Commie areas.)

    All African territories are worth 0 IPCs.

    UK and US vs. USSR !!!

    I like it.
    Don’t forget that USSR get’s cuba and some s-american countries too . . . .
    This is like one of the Iron Blitz variations.


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