@ncscswitch:
Only if they ignore it.
It WILL slow them, but at what cost in Europe, I would have to play it out to be certain…
my guess is about the same as if Russia had to retreat from Ukraine due to a bad round. so not devastating.
Trading Caucasus instead of Ukraine is a shift of 7 IPC… 3 that Russia is not collecting in Ukraine, and 4 that Germany IS collecting in Caucuses. That is the equivalent of what Germany normally gains in Africa, and they get that income without pulling forces off the Russian front, so an even bigger bonus.
Add in Africa, even if only for a few turns, and Germany is collecting $50+ against Russia’s $20-$22. That is enough of an income shift that Germany will be outspending the combined UK/USSR.
Yeah, Switch knows all about getting punked by that Med. fleet in Caucuses, don’t ya Switch? :-D :wink:
You always gotta be careful any time you are shifting stuff away from Caucuses early on. Sure, the 7 IPC swing Switch is talking about is no big deal, but if you leave two fighters in Caucuses with too little protection, then it’s more like a 27 IPC swing when I kill those fighters! Not to mention, Russia is pretty much toast without those fighters to support its attacks (not to mention for defense). I love it when an opponent leaves Caucuses vulnerable. :evil: I’ve won more than a few games that way.
I like the idea of the 1st round russian build and landing the fighter in China, as well as blitzing FIC with the British forces and landing that fighter in China as well. I would still dump my 4 Russian troops from into Sinkiang from the surrounding zones and move all 6 Russian troops into Bury.
I’d also use the UK Transport off the coast of India to grab the extra troop from Trans-Jordan and move it into India along with the troop from Persia, then build a factory there. I’d also blitz the Japanese transport off the coast of Kuang Tung with the British Destroyer and Carrier, as well as attack the Japanese sub in the Solomon isle sea zone with the sub and transport from Australia.
That would leave Japan with a lot of problems on J1… do they try a risky attack on India to get the British Factory? Do they Attack a much beefier China? Do they hit the 6 Russian troops in Bury? Do they still make a full assault on the Hawaiian fleet? What do they do about the two British ships sitting off the coast of Kuang-Tung?
Whatever the Japanese decide to do after that would largely determine what the US does the next round. If the Japanese player doesn’t hunker down and build Navy, it could get nasty. After the first turn, the Brits are only committed to 3 infantry per turn in Asia and can focus the rest of their resources on reinforcing the Russians against Germany. Its the USA’s show in the Pacific from that point on.
I like the idea of the 1st round russian build and landing the fighter in China, as well as blitzing FIC with the British forces and landing that fighter in China as well. I would still dump my 4 Russian troops from into Sinkiang from the surrounding zones and move all 6 Russian troops into Bury.
I’d also use the UK Transport off the coast of India to grab the extra troop from Trans-Jordan and move it into India along with the troop from Persia, then build a factory there. I’d also blitz the Japanese transport off the coast of Kuang Tung with the British Destroyer and Carrier, as well as attack the Japanese sub in the Solomon isle sea zone with the sub and transport from Australia.
That would leave Japan with a lot of problems on J1… do they try a risky attack on India to get the British Factory? Do they Attack a much beefier China? Do they hit the 6 Russian troops in Bury? Do they still make a full assault on the Hawaiian fleet? What do they do about the two British ships sitting off the coast of Kuang-Tung?
Whatever the Japanese decide to do after that would largely determine what the US does the next round. If the Japanese player doesn’t hunker down and build Navy, it could get nasty. After the first turn, the Brits are only committed to 3 infantry per turn in Asia and can focus the rest of their resources on reinforcing the Russians against Germany. Its the USA’s show in the Pacific from that point on.
in that case if USSR/UK play their first turn that way
against a solid Japanese player
Hawaiian fleet will be destroyed
Kwangtung fleet will be destroyed
India will fall soon, not to mention Buryatia and China
and Germany has opened hands against USSR, and strong attacking position on UK fleet in the Pacific
Alright. Let’s assume FIC is cleared with the UK fighter surviving. We can also assume both subs in sz45 missed. Those are the average results. If Japan loses the SS in sz45 it’s no big deal, although the UK taking FIC would be a problem. But that depends on luck because the chance that UK takes FIC is about the same as Japan repelling that attack with at least the fighter left.
What about this counter?
Build 3 TP save $6
China (2 inf, 3 fig)
2 inf, 1 fig Man
3 inf Kwang
2 fig sz37
1 fig, 1 bmb japan
Average result: taken with 1 inf, 4 fig, 1 bmb
sz59 (1 CV, 1 DD, 1 TP)
1 BB sz60
1 BB, 1 CV sz37
1 fig sz50
Push this attack as long as you have a BB hit to take. If not, retreat to sz60. Most likely you’ll destroy the fleet with no losses or, at worst, leave only the DD alive.
Non-combat is situational.
If you clear sz59:
1 TP unloads 1 inf, 1 arm Japan to man
1 CV, 1 DD sz50 and the sz45 SS(if it survives) to sz60
1 fig Chi to sz60
1 fig sz59 to sz60
3 fig, 1 bmb to Man
If you don’t clear sz59:
1 DD, 1 CV sz50 to sz36
1 TP sz60 to sz36 unload 1 inf, 1 arm Japan to FIC
1 fig Chi to sz36
1 fig sz59 to sz36
1 bmb, 3 fig to FIC
1 SS(if it survives) sz45 to sz60
Build your TP’s in sz60. And Japan has $38 to spend next turn in response to whatever the Allies do.
Japan just killed 3 Allied fighters(sweet!), if there is anything left of the UK fleet in sz59 it’s pinned between 2 fleets and very dead next turn, and there is only 6-8 scattered inf between Japan and a whole bunch of Asian IPC’s. Plus, I don’t mind that the US is given a head start in the Pacific because the UK fleet is largely nullified and the Japanese fleet is probably completely intact and safe from US attack on their turn(unless they want to throw away some high priced air and navy to kill a couple TP’s). And Germany gets to keep Egypt and will most likely own the whole continent of Africa by G3.
General Monty’s plan is slightly better but, with Africa lost and minimum 9 IPC’s committed to India the UK has maybe 10-15 IPC’s to get troops to Europe. Germany could sink that much into navy and air every turn to keep them out and still be able to outproduce Russia on the ground.
The loss of Africa is often the bitter pill the Allies must swallow if the KJF is to be done in earnest. If this results in a German economy near 50, then the Allies could be in trouble.
Personally, I don’t like the FIC attack because your odds are less than 50% that you will clear it with surviving pieces. If it works, great, but it could just as easily open the path to Asia for Japan, as U-505 notes.
U-505,
Leaving Pearl and Bury intact leaves Japan open to some nasty little raids on USA1. If you do NOT kill both of those, you can;t leave a split Japan fleet in SZ60, or you lose it.
Also, in order to land in Manch, you have to send your 1 TP to SZ61, which further reduces your fleet size in SZ60.
Better I think in that scenario to stage in SZ61 with your build fleet than to leave it in 60.
It DOES allow the UK/US to merge their Pearl/India/Aussie fleets in SZ60 on Turn 2, but Japan with air power and fleet should trash it easily, and then proceed as normal.
Yeah, I modified my strat after the Doolittle raid :-D. That’s why I left the DD out of combat. But, don’t forget, there were some repercussions that weren’t immediately apparent to either of us. Namely, the US lost half it’s fighters and the bomber. Because of that, Germany retained air superiority for most of the game and it allowed them to hold off the Allies until Japan rebuilt.
If Japan doesn’t clear sz59, there will be 2 BB, 1 CV, 3 TP, 1 SS in sz60 and you can shift a fighter there, as well, if the sz45 SS is sunk.
If Japan clears sz59 without loss, sz60 will have 1 CV, 2 fig, 1 DD, 1 SS, 3 TP. Against 1 bmb, 2 fig, 1 CV, 1 SS the average result is 4 surviving japanese units. A greener player might take the TP’s as losses but, as more advanced players, we can see the obvious advantage of losing 1 fig, 1 DD, 1 SS, 1 TP and leaving 1 fig, 1 CV, 2 TP to preserve the bulk of Japan’s landing force especially since the US will have just sacrificed more than half of it’s current offensive firepower in the Pacific. No matter what the US builds on it’s turn, after that combat, Japan will still retain naval superiority and have $38 to respond with.
If the sz45 SS is sunk, you can also shift the strat and send the DD to sz59 and hold back the sz60 BB instead if you’re concerned about a US strike. Plus, building the TP’s in sz61 is still an option no matter how J1 plays out. I just see building in sz61 as Japan’s way of setting itself back a turn so I try to avoid it if at all possible. Getting Japan out of the gate at full speed is always first priority to me.
