We should not attack Iraq

You are clearly not a man of science if you believe someone could demonstrate god doest not exist… Even if i could explain everything on this universe i would not be able to prove a god doest not exist; that is simply impossible. If you really want Atheist to prove the nonexistance of a mythology, why don’t you try proving me the tooth fairy does not exist, with facts.

About you being Crazy you probably know i don’t think that. When all your friend, family and people around believe very have in something, it is hard to get against them, even more when the belief is as golden as christianism.

Fin

@Anonymous:

You are clearly not a man of science if you believe someone could demonstrate god doest not exist… Even if i could explain everything on this universe i would not be able to prove a god doest not exist; that is simply impossible. If you really want Atheist to prove the nonexistance of a mythology, why don’t you try proving me the tooth fairy does not exist, with facts.
Fin

my mommy told me that there is no tooth fairy and that she was just pretending to be the tooth fairy for some bizaare reason.

I have been amazed at the work that the Holy Spirit has done in my life - stuff that i could never have done on my own, insights that are beyond my tiny mind

I wouldn’t believe that. When you lower yourself, I also lose face. :) Remember that.

As for my own reasons why i believe in a God, there are many. The most important is the feeling deep in the pit of my stomach. The “fact” that i have “heard” God/Jesus telling me that he cares about me. And at the oddest times. Less when i’m praying, and more when i’m just being “quiet”. I have been amazed at the work that the Holy Spirit has done in my life - stuff that i could never have done on my own, insights that are beyond my tiny mind.

Anything else aside personal experience. I haven’t had the plessure of God/Jesus actually “telling me” something - at least not in an actual “voice.” Of course I could just be crazy…

I believe the bible. I believe it’s history, and i believe the message it communicates. I believe in Jesus and i believe i’ve talked to him. The message he brought to earth is beautiful, as are the things he did during his life (including his death). As mentioned, i think one can’t take the whole of the bible literally as too much of it makes more sense metaphorically.

Well let me ask you this. How much do you believe in evolution (both micro and macro)? Do you believe in the Bibical “Flood?” Do you believe in Adam and Eve? Are are these just metaphorical stories?

I used to be continually questing for hard, logical knowledge, but i’ve come to know enough about myself and the world to know that this is a much of the time this is a stupid quest for useless knowledge given the many sides to the human psyche etc.

Stop that! Some of us are still on that quest! :)

“Who would you feel if one day you woke up and turned on your computer, and it started talking to you? It started to perform tasks that you are thinking about, even before you tell it what to do. How would God have felt?”

“Of course I could just be crazy”

Welcome to the club.

@Yanny:

I’m getting fed up watching President W. Bush infringe upon my civil rights. He is acting like a Hypocrit, a Dictator, and is not abiding by our Country’s laws. If I could make the choice, I’d impeach him, but I can’t.

President Bush somehow got it into his head that he needs to attack Iraq. At this point, if we do attack it looks like it will take place around Late October early November, election time. Any analyst will tell you attacking Iraq is a political issue, and is not important to our national security.

Congress, except for a minority of Republican busch supporters, completely opposes attacking Iraq. Our Allies, even such names as Turkey and Britain, are against attacking Iraq. In fact, if we do attack Iraq we’re unlikely to have a decent bombing base.

Ousting Saddam would destabilize the entire Mid East. The Countries of Iran and Israel would become the regional powers. Without Iraq’s military in the picture, there is no one to threaten Israel. Israel could attack Lebanon, Syria, and Jorden without any trouble. Iran would likely seize up a large portion of the former Iraq. This will set in place a powerful country, more ruthless than Iraq itself.

In Iraq itself, its likely 3 groups, maybe even independant states, will arise. The Southern Islaamic Fundalmentalists are willing to rise up and attack Saddam, but doing so would require the US to arm these people. This will create another Taliban. In the North, the Kurds will likely become part of Turkey, no big deal there. As I have already mentioned, Iran is likely to seize a large portion of Middle Iraq, including important Oil wells.

This is not 1991. Saddam has not made any aggressive action toward the United States. We do not have the Military Force, nor the Allies we did back then. Our Economy is much worse. Busch needs to forget about stupid Politics like this.

Bush is dropping “the ball” like his father. You don’t give advanced warning of an attack.

And Yanny, thanks to Israel, Saddam didn’t have a nuclear deturrent which could of made Saddam king of Arabia in 1991.

Nice to see you two back.

After i read what horntet said, good to see ya back by the way, I can help but wonder if you ever described how your civil rights were being violated Yanny.

Saddam will not, as i have said many times, be stupid. He wants to stay alive. He will only use his weapons if he is forced to. 

For Saddam, I’m not too sure of hissanity. After all, this was the same person who invaded Kuwait and gased/starved his own people. As for the possibility of nuclear weapons, this seems only that Saddam won’t use NBC’s. Chances are, Saddam will instead use his weapons as leverage to carry out his own acts. And by then, it will be too late. Imagine if the Israel’s hadn’t taken out Iraq’s nuclear reactor in 1981. Would the Allies be so lucky in the Persian Gulf?

A President cannot just go start a war without permission.

That’s why the President will not invade Iraq without asking for permission from Congress and make his case to the Allied Powers.

So TG, are you saying you are for it or against it? Because when I read your posts I get mixed feelings.

That’s because the President hasn’t even made his case to Congress. Time will tell.

Broke 2600 8)

So when he makes His case to congress, what do you want to happen? I think that the U.S needs to give a reason for an attack. If Bush came on the tv on Sept. 10th and said, “we are starting a war on terrorism!” everyone would wonder what the hell he was talking about. Most of the other countries have went against the idea of attacking Saddam. Plus, he is a main leader where he is. It would be like Iraq comming over here and overthrowing our President.

Congrats TG :wink:

So when he makes His case to congress, what do you want to happen?

Too early to tell. I would like our President to will give more peaceful alternatives. Saddam stepping down, enacting country reforms (both against terrorism and the government), humanitarian reforms, ect. - I don’t think we can much keep the Middle East it is. However, seeing as how Saddam has turned down offers to halt any invasion in exchange for the unrestrained movement of UN bomb inspectors in his country - the situation looks grim.

I think that the U.S needs to give a reason for an attack.

Of course the US needs to give a reason for an attack. Do you think
we’ll just walk over there, hold Saddam at gunpoint, and give no particular reason for doing so?

If Bush came on the tv on Sept. 10th and said, “we are starting a war on terrorism!”

And if the war on Iraq coincided with the war on terrorism? Anyways, it’s a damn shame we had to have our buildings smashed before we did anything about it.

Most of the other countries have went against the idea of attacking Saddam.

Main reason is that much of this has been speculation, not even I know exactly what type of planned assualt this will be. However, I like to keep Saddam on his toes.

It would be like Iraq comming over here and overthrowing our President.

And yet we overthrew the Taliban?

Congrats TG

Thanks.

20 years from now half the world will have or be building nuclear weapons.

Whoa. Where are you getting these stats from? I’m not sure there wouldn’t be enriched Uranium (under the current embargo) or money to field a nuclear weapons program for this to happen.

Iraq is not that irresponsible. Saddam is not crazy, and he is very smart.

If I was smart enough to be Saddam, I would use those nuclear weapons as incredible leverage to get things my way. Suddenly the whole world would have to bow down to me and let me do as I please.

Nuclear weapons used as deterrent is a great way to gain concessions.

A lot of people have been saying that no nation is asking us to come in and save them from Sadam, like they were back at the Gulf War. That is not true. The 4th world nation of the Kurds is pleading for us to save them from Sadam.

But they aren’t anti-Israeli so the liberals don’t like them.

Hi Disclaimer!

But they aren’t anti-Israeli so the liberals don’t like them.

The support in the US for the Israeli is very high

It would not seem that way from the media or around here.

@yourbuttocks:

A lot of people have been saying that no nation is asking us to come in and save them from Sadam, like they were back at the Gulf War. That is not true. The 4th world nation of the Kurds is pleading for us to save them from Sadam.

But they aren’t anti-Israeli so the liberals don’t like them.

Hi Disclaimer!

Also back in 1990 Iraqi forces were bordering and poised to enter Saudi Arabia. This, i suspect, is the other “real reason” the US went into the Gulf - to support/build support by it’s “allies” in Saudi Arabia. This is the reason why the Saudi’s allowed the US to launch it’s attacks from there - it was for their own protection. Afterall, a good defense is a strong offense.