Destroyer on G1



  • I remember reading somewhere about buying ships on G1. It seems transports and air craft carriers were popular with some other posters in this forum. I was playing a “minor victory” game recently, and my brother-in-law bought a Destroyer on G1, and it worked well for him. But it worked well mostly because I was pretty stupid and left Britain wide open by not buying in infantry on UK1. He got lucky and had two direct hits when he combined the Meditteranean german ships with his Baltic ones to attack the UK.

    Anyway, the destroyer threw me off, and I chickened out on attacking his fleet with my UK planes early on since the destroyer takes two hits to kill. But I was wondering what people thought of this move in general. Is it too expensive? Is the AC a better proposition, especially if Germany goes after the UK?



  • Destroyers do not take two hits to kill.  Battleships do.  In fact, from the context of your post, I see that you are actually referring to Battleships the entire time.

    A Baltic battleship is a very expensive option for Germany in round 1 that will certainly create a different naval pressure-system in the Atlantic, but will also mean a pronounced lack of ground-units heading to the eastern front or ramping up defense on the west shore.  The basic problem with generating a navy for Germany is that the Allies build up a force to attack it, which means you will have to keep on adding ships or get destroyed quickly.  That means funds diverted from other fronts.

    ~Josh


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Destroyers offer more bang for your buck, but don’t repair at the end of your round. (2 Destroyers Cost 24, Attack 2X3 or less.  1 Battleship Cost 24, Attack 1X4 or less.)

    I have done the 1 Aircraft Carrier, 2 Destroyer option with Germany.  As well as the 1 AC, 3 SS option.


  • 2007 AAR League

    i have often wondered if a first turn BB would be a good move.
    If you can lure Russian/UK forces into Norway, and Karelia, you get a helpful BB shot each turn (awesome killing an INF or ARM with no retaliation), and you also increased the threat on the UK mainland while having a durable navy.

    If you move your med fleet to Gibralter 1st turn, now you have a pretty scary threat on UK, turn 2, with 2 BB shots, and 2 TRN, and all the FTRs/BOM you can plant in WEU (potential 2 BB shots, 6 FTR 2 ARM 2 INF 1 BOM against England… likely killing 6-7 units first round, up to 2 of which dont retaliate… ouch, even if you dont feel like invading UK, you can amphib 1 ARM at UK, and potentially kill 3 units, though a Russian sub sacrifice might be able to prevent the BB shots.

    Turn 2 you should be able to destroy any fleet that UK could muster to prevent a fleet unification, so UK and US will have to fortify the UK mainland, protecting Africa and Norway for Germany. UK and US cant go for Africa turn one, cuz you will destroy their combined fleet. And once you merge the 2 fleets…, you can threaten UK, US, keep the Baltic Sea safe forever, or go back to the Med and punish Russia via 2 BB hits against Cau a turn. And with 2 BB, you get a REALLY fun fleet strafing fleet… first 2 hits dont count, combined with the massive GER airforce…

    Still, very expensive. I might try it if I get a big bid and lots of extra cash for GER (only 8 more dollars than an AC, which is a standard opening for a lot of players. Bids at DAAK often go for 12-14.

    Mateooo


  • 2007 AAR League

    Subs offer even more bang for the buck - attack 3X2 (same punch as 2 DD but take longer to kill) and also get that sneak attack advantage. Downside is that they are vulnerable to air units, so you want to keep them with few other units that can take out any air attack. Another upside though is that they can submerge to live to fight another day.

    Subs are the infantry of the ocean in terms of value for the price. But like infantry, you want to pair them with a few heavy hitters for maximum effect. I think a perfect fleet would be 1 BB, 1 DD, 1 AC, 2 Ftrs and as many subs as you can buy.



  • @mateooo:

    If you can lure Russian/UK forces into Norway, and Karelia, you get a helpful BB shot each turn (awesome killing an INF or ARM with no retaliation), and you also increased the threat on the UK mainland while having a durable navy.

    Battleships only bombard during amphibious assaults, this wouldnt work.


  • 2007 AAR League

    Yeah, you have a fling an infantry off your transport into the enemy’s stronghold every time in order to get those free shots.



  • i have done this, it is fun :mrgreen:
    throws a real monkey wrench into the atlantic with those 2 bb soaking hits



  • If Germany builds a BB on G1, they are likely to have that TRN available, the one they start with in SZ5.

    If Germany pulls off a fleet mergem then you have 2 BB’s and 2 TRNs, plus the SUBs and DST to help protect your little invasion fleet.  And that IS a worry for the Allies…


  • Official Answers 2007 AAR League

    Every turn Germany has navy on the board it is bad for the Allies.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Subs are especially awesome with LHTR U-boat interdiction National Advantage.

    Put 7-12 of them in SZ 5, get a BB and an AC sometime in those 10 rounds then ignore England/America because htey have zero income anymore.



  • Just fly over it…
    Send FIGs to reinforce Moscow’s gains, and once you have a nice big AF, 1-2 punch and wipe out the whole fleet…


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Yea, I thought the same way.  It’s dang impossible, Switch.

    Only counter I’ve found: NA: Joint Strike.  Gives you a lot of fleet to hit at the same time.



  • Or the old…
    save all your cash, drop 2 rounds of fleet in one shot and invite teh attack approach…

    Or your own SUB based navy… backed up by massed AF…



  • +1 allied sub = -1 allied transport

    if germany can get both uk and usa to spend more on capital ships than they did(each) it is a good return on invetsment

    anyone crazy enough to go g1 bb+cv? 😮
    think of the possibilities :evil:



  • I am… Russia in both Balkans and Eastern on R2…
    :mrgreen:


  • 2007 AAR League

    @frimmel:

    Every turn Germany has navy on the board it is bad for the Allies.

    correct, but every ipc Germany spends on navy is good for the allies.


  • Official Answers 2007 AAR League

    @ezto:

    @frimmel:

    Every turn Germany has navy on the board it is bad for the Allies.

    correct, but every ipc Germany spends on navy is good for the allies.

    I agree with that. That is the big question for Germany. Navy or not.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @ezto:

    @frimmel:

    Every turn Germany has navy on the board it is bad for the Allies.

    correct, but every ipc Germany spends on navy is good for the allies.

    I used to think that way too, but if you have U-boat interdiction that goes out the window.  Every sub Germany has then costs the allies 2 IPC a round, add in Rockets and you can just forget England even exists, they’re toothless.


  • 2007 AAR League

    noone plays with NA



  • :roll:


  • Official Answers 2007 AAR League

    @ezto:

    noone plays with NA

    You might amend that to no one you play with uses NA’s.

    I’ve never played with them though.

    In Jen’s scenario though you have money in the water and thus Navy takes on a new role.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Exactly, lots of players use NAs, more and more every day because it takes a static game and makes it dynamic.

    Chinese Divisions, Fast Carriers, Colonial Garrison, Radar, Lend-Lease, Trans-Siberian Rail all makes KJF a much more viable strategy.

    Dive-Bombers, U-Boat Interdiction, Banzai all makes the fall of Russia much faster.


  • 2007 AAR League

    I’m about ready to mix it up a bit - maybe some NAs or techs. I was thinking about giving each side some random techs - say you would roll randomly until each side had 2 or 3 techs, then you work with what you get. But of course, only to take effect after round 1.

    Or how about if each round you allowed one free tech roll, and it took effect immediately? First roll a die to see if you get a tech, then roll a die to see what it is.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Axis: Roll 1d6 for a random NA.  Roll 2d6 for two techs each.
    Allies: Roll 1d6 for a random NA and another for a random tech each.

    That’s 6 per side, pretty even.  And with LHTR, the allied NAs are mega nerfed and the Axis are buffed so it pretty much kills a need for a bid over, oh, 5 or 6 IPCs.


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