Pearl Harbor

Well, I think the US knew a little, but not enough to confirm anything. Also, the garrison at Pearl Harbor was put on alert many times in the weeks before, and when the alert was called out that day, it was largely ignored.

IMO, the Americans knew enough to make an attempt to stop it, but most sightings and alarms were just ignored. Then it happend and boom, we are in the war.

America new war with Japan was going to happen, they just tried to delay it enough to help Britain deal with the Nazis.

Pearl Habour is a long way from Japan, know one would have thought an attack on Pearl Harbour was “possible”.

WW2? Isn’t that a little off topic for this forum in general? j/k

Why would the US Navy not, instead, prepare an ambush for the Japaneese carriers?

Ok, then put the US Pearl Harbor base on high alert, and have the Carriers ready to catch the Japaneese fleet from behind while the planes were away.

I’d thinka brilliantly planned ambush for the attacking Japaneese who thought they would catch us off guard would sway public opinion just as much.

"DID THE US GOVERMENT KNOW THE JAPANESE WERE TO STRIKE AT PEARL HARBOR ???

New declassified information from intelligence sources seem to confirm this to be true in recent years. Roosevelt knew the British were in real trouble. The Russians were getting hammered terribly at that time, also. Who else could help out? Was the US in danger? He knew we had to step in to stop the Axis. But the American people do not want war. How is that corrected? Oh yes, we’ll eventually get attacked and turn it into a real tragedy for extremely angered US people to take the reins and start to kick some butt!!!

Opinions and Comments???"

Hell friggin’ yeah!

I consider myself a patriotic american, waving my flags way before 9-11, but that doesn’t mean america is innocent in all situations obviously (cough, century of dishonor, cough.) Though I don’t believe the US had advanced info about 9-11, i do think we did about pearl harbor.

Roosevelt’s new deal and welfare state was a huge failure. IT shocked the system for 4 years, but Roosevelt’s taxes evetually hurt GNP and rose unemployment. War got america into a prosperity that would last them to the 70s. Just like WW1, american companies and politicians wanted in on this war. American judgement and military placement on december 7th was very iffy, and america did break japanese naval code (but to what extent?) Britain also could of had this info.

BTW guys, do you think the US gov had advanced info on 911? i believe not. We get terror threats all the time I’m sure, only since 9-11 did we take it seriously.

Personally, I think the US got very basic advanced Info, but there are literally hundreds of threats a day, it was just one.

But, why not start the war off on a good note?

I have done the research, so I think I can give an honest opinion of this matter. First, the Americans knew that invasion by Japan was a likely possibility. However, the big question was location. Most US commanders (including FDR) believed that the invasion would come at the Philippines, as they did not believe that such an attack could come at Pearl Harbor unnoticed. Even going over cryptographic files by the US Navy, they admitted failing to break the Japanese code in time for Peal Harbor. Also the very thought of American military leaders purposely letting the Japanese attack Pearl Harbor is absurd. Remember, by 1941 the outcome of the war was very favorable to the Axis and in was not until 1943 did the American people know that they were eventually going to prevail. To give almost the whole Pacific Fleet to the Japanese would’ve been a disastrous move both politically and militarily.

Also, even though polls showed that the American majority was against war, it was much more active than isolationists. Even by July 1941, FDR had made the decision to convoy merchant ships as far as Iceland, a move that invited attacks by German u-boats and the support of the American public. By November, an even braved step was made by actively arming merchant ships to the British warzone. Any attack on Pearl Harbor, even if defended would’ve roused the support of the American public. “Rather than let democracy die and dictatorship rule supreme, most citizens were evidently to support a policy that might lead to war. It did.”

Now there is a lot of controversy surrounding that absence of the American carriers. However, upon closer examination, this was not a forewarned warning that the Japanese were about to strike. The two carriers that berthed at Pearl Harbor were sent on a routine route to deliver planes to the garrisons at Midway and Wake Island, a move repeated more than once before Pearl Harbor. Even right after Pearl Harbor, Vice Admiral William Halsey of the Enterprise task force and Vice Admiral Wilson Brown of the Lexington, were sent to intercept the Japanese carriers that had conducted the attack. Though they were unsuccessful in seeking out the Japanese fleet, they were lucky they didn’t. Nagumo had six carriers and more than 400 planes that would certainly destroyed any American task force. Now if the Americans had already been forewarned about the expected attack on Pearl Harbor, would they have been so brash as to send their carriers out knowing the power of the Japanese fleet?

Your assumption that high-ranking Americans did know that a Japanese surprise attack could occur at Pearl Harbor is true. One such person was the famed American aviator, Billy Mitchell. He even predicted that the Japanese would hit Pearl Harbor with planes from waterborne carriers. Of course for his words, American sophists were forced to apologize to Japanese diplomats for ill intentions and Billy was even court marshaled! He even predicted that air power would soon replace sea power as the dominant force, another notion laughed at by his contemporaries.

As for your question, the only other carrier was at San Diego going over routine inspections and maneuvers. However, even if that carrier joined in into the foray, chances are the Americans still would’ve been smashed.

No problem Herr Field Marshall :wink:

It’s just that when you talk about using thousands of Americans as martyrs simply to get your country into war, that’s just ludicrous. And imagine the propaganda if the Americans were able to beat off the Japanese attack! Wouldn’t that have whipped America more in a wartime frenzy than if the people were disillusioned that we would be caught very close to losing the war even from the onset?

Now that’s not to say mistakes weren’t made at Pearl Harbor. There should’ve been a stricter early warning system conducted by search planes, submarines, and surface ships. Also, advisers should’ve paid better attention to radar conclaves. Carelessness caused a lot of Pearl Harbor, not purposefulness.